The Virginia Two-Step: Restaurants-Open Carry or Car? :MERGED now w/ poll

This is a discussion on The Virginia Two-Step: Restaurants-Open Carry or Car? :MERGED now w/ poll within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I prefer to carry concealed for all the general reasons other people usually quote (tactical advantage, less hassle, etc). If I know that the restaurant ...

View Poll Results: How do you OC at the watering hole?

Voters
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  • Lock it up in the car and don't carry at all.

    37 31.36%
  • Simply expose the weapon in its IWB holster.

    49 41.53%
  • Change from an IWB holster to an OWB holster.

    5 4.24%
  • I carry OWB anyway so I just take off the cover.

    27 22.88%
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Thread: The Virginia Two-Step: Restaurants-Open Carry or Car? :MERGED now w/ poll

  1. #91
    Senior Member Array PaulG's Avatar
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    I prefer to carry concealed for all the general reasons other people usually quote (tactical advantage, less hassle, etc).

    If I know that the restaurant management is OK with open carry, I will sometimes open carry there.

    I usually keep on outside the pants paddle holster to transition to when open carrying in such a restaurant.

    Sometimes I have friends come into town who are not gun people and who REALLY want to go to a certain restaurant where I know I would be asked to take the gun back to the car.

    On those occassions, I just lock it up in a Gunvault in the car.
    fortiter in re, suaviter in modo (resolutely in action, gently in manner).

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  3. #92
    smn
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    I recently vacationed in VA and I OC'd my .45ACP XD OWB everywehere I went. I was mostly in the Midlothian (West of Richmond) and visited several shopping malls and a few restaurants. I OC'd in a CiCi's pizza without any problems. One of the last restaurants I visited was Red Robin somewhere near 288N and Broad Street near a large shopping mall.

    I didn't have any issues anywhere I went and enjoyed the freedom in VA.

    On a side note, in several of the malls, I did observe unarmed mall security.

  4. #93
    Distinguished Member Array 4my sons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JD View Post
    Virginia State Police



    I don't know if they are going by the legal limits for "under the influence" or just using in general. Also, note that the above does not discriminate between carrying concealed or openly, only that:

    carrying such weapon in a public place shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor

    But, that's only if you have a permit?

    VA just doesn't make any sense.

    *Note, I'm not a lawyer, nor do I play on on the forum.

    That's where the Gray area mucks it up, I'm not trying to split hairs, but VA General Assembly states
    "Intoxicated" means a condition in which a person has drunk enough alcoholic beverages to observably affect his manner, disposition, speech, muscular movement, general appearance or behavior.
    But no level, then they get specific on a level of .08 when it applies to operation of a motor vehicle,
    It shall be unlawful for any person to drive or operate any motor vehicle, engine or train (i) while such person has a blood alcohol concentration of 0.08 percent or more by weight by volume or 0.08 grams or more per 210 liters of breath as indicated by a chemical test administered as provided in this article
    If I read it correctly, as J.D. said, I'm no lawyer, it looks like it's saying that you can't be "intoxicated" (show indications of being impaired) or you can't drive with a 0.08 level. I'm not aware of any case that has challenged this, I sure don't want to be the test case, personally I only drink at home, or special occasion while out, but never while carrying. It is awfully gray, at least to me.

    Now my head hurts and it's time to go home.
    "fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen." [Warren v. District of Columbia,(D.C. Ct. of Ap., 1981)]
    If I have to explain it, you wouldn't understand

  5. #94
    JD
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    Well that's the whole problem, it doesn't say, "intoxicated" it says "under the influence" technically speaking they do not always mean the same thing...

    I'll check out the VA criminal code book tomorrow at work and see what I can find.

  6. #95
    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JD View Post
    Everyone play nice now....


    I generally don't like to leave it in the car, I OC when mandated by law.

    And as of yet, there's no reason to lock this thread as long as everyone plays nice, there was no mention of illegal activity, and the subject of ignoring the law has not been brought up, nor will it be as that IS against forum policy.
    Ok for a second there I thought you locked and closed my second thread because it covered OC in VA... you had me a little there for a while until I realized you just merged it.

  7. #96
    JD
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pro2A View Post
    Ok for a second there I thought you locked and closed my second thread because it covered OC in VA... you had me a little there for a while until I realized you just merged it.

    So I saw, check your PMs.

  8. #97
    Member Array Fozzy Bear's Avatar
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    Getting back to the original questions(s).

    I discussed this in a thread a while back and I got a great answer (but I forget from who - sorry). The thing that was brought to my attention is that an IWB will also mount OWB if it is between your pants and your belt. So just unclip it, tuck it back in outside your pants, but inside your belt (so the clips/loops still function as designed) and your gun is no longer concealed.

    I go ahead and rotate it from about 4:00 to about 2:30 (depending on how the belt loops on my pants line up that day) just to be clear about it.

    I am kind'a embarrassed that I hadn't thought of that myself, once I heard it. So maybe it will help somebody else out too.


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  9. #98
    Senior Member Array Juggernaut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smn View Post
    I recently vacationed in VA and I OC'd my .45ACP XD OWB everywehere I went. I was mostly in the Midlothian (West of Richmond) and visited several shopping malls and a few restaurants. I OC'd in a CiCi's pizza without any problems. One of the last restaurants I visited was Red Robin somewhere near 288N and Broad Street near a large shopping mall.

    I didn't have any issues anywhere I went and enjoyed the freedom in VA.

    On a side note, in several of the malls, I did observe unarmed mall security.
    When did Cici's start ABC-on? At least you were in Midlothian, where it's still conservative. I'm glad you had a positive experience while in our great Commonwealth. I've gotten wayward looks from people up at Short Pump (where you wen to Red Robin) while OC'ing.
    Vis consili expers mole ruit sua.
    -Horace

  10. #99
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    I do not carry if I'm going to be drinking, and to me, drinking means any alcohol. If I go into a restaurant that serves alcohol, I leave it in the car. If I go to a place which doesn't serve alcohol, I carry it concealed. There was a change proposed to the Va carry laws that would have allowed concealed carry in restaurants, but from what I heard, "King Kane" shot it down even though it had a "no alcohol consumption" requirement. However, he did state, by "Imperial Decree" that it was okay for Commonwealth's Attorneys to carry concealed, even when drinking.

  11. #100
    Member Array Nelson Muntz's Avatar
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    I OC, owb. Even in restaurants that serve alcohol. I have OC'd in them with my family, sat strong side to the server and the room, and had a beer or two with dinner. Never a problem or an eye batted.

    I discussed the legality of it much later with a 2A attorney and he did indicate there is a distinction between under the influence and intoxicated. Intoxicated involves a defined limit and is applicable to driving, but not to carry and alcohol. Under the influence does apply to carry and alcohol. And there is no limit to the amount of alcohol you consume as long as you do not have the 'appearance' of being under the influence. To a cop I presume. That appearance includes speech, gait, eyes, etc.

    If you do not appear under the influence while carrying and drinking, you could still be legally 'intoxicated' (over .08) should you get in a car and drive. Confusing enough?

  12. #101
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    I dont drink when I go out.
    I do however go to establishments that serve alcohol while I am OC.
    So, going to a place that serves is not any different to me than going into an auto parts store.


    Jim
    A Right not exercised, is a Right lost.

  13. #102
    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    I carry concealed in all restaurants but never in stand alone bars. OC in a bar just might attract a wise guy wanting to take you on because you have a gun. When alcohol is involved anything can happen.

  14. #103
    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
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    I would expose the concealed pistol and avoid leaving it in the car.
    "If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan

  15. #104
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    If the kids are with me (which is most of the time) I leave it in the car. I don't need to risk having them see daddy getting accosted and drawn on by the police.

    I have a few times OC'd at restaurants. No problems.

    Don't go to bars much.

  16. #105
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    I don't live there but have visited twice and I just took off my jacket and open carried. No big deal.
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