Open Carry - What do you think?
This is a discussion on Open Carry - What do you think? within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; What I find funny is in TX I can't OC my pistol, but I can walk down the road with a loaded rifle (non assault ...
June 19th, 2008 05:34 PM
What I find funny is in TX I can't OC my pistol, but I can walk down the road with a loaded rifle (non assault type) with no worries, well almost no worries. I'm sure I could get stopped and asked what I am doing, but legally speaking I can trot along with my loaded Remington and have not a care in the world.
Wonder if I should try this with my WWII Mauser, hmm....
"Don't hit a man if you can possibly avoid it; but if you do hit him, put him to sleep." - Theodore Roosevelt
June 19th, 2008 07:15 PM
It might cause the person to look else where, unless I have SOMETHING he wants and does not care what it takes to get it. NRA mag had a "Armed Citzen" newspaper article where a women shot a guy one time, he gets up and comes at her again. She shoots him a second time.
Originally Posted by TacticalCompact
I see no reason to take one option away just to open carry. If he does not know I'm carring, it gives me the advantage. If I was a crook, and you had something I REALLY wanted and I saw you were armed, I just bid my time wait for you to look down to unlock the door, turn toward the car to unlock the door,,,whatever and just shoot you in the back from a safe distance. Get what I was after and leave. If I did not know you were armed, I might make a mistake and give you a chance to get me.
Just one more option. Just like not posting in your front yard you have 20 guns inside........
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June 19th, 2008 07:40 PM
in nevada open carry is legal but will get you a talkin to by the cops.
me and a few friends excersize out rights by all OC on saturdays. some people get use to it and others freak out. 7-11 no longer calls the cops. instead they ask me what its like to carry and how i get away with it.
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it."
June 19th, 2008 09:03 PM
Originally Posted by uakaos
June 19th, 2008 09:48 PM
It's funny how the open carry threads attract so much attention on this forum. LOL! Everyone is so quick to voice their opinions, even though the same things have been said time and time again.
USMC rule # 23 of gunfighting: Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet.
I am the God fearing, gun toting, flag waving conservative you were warned about!
June 19th, 2008 10:14 PM
Most every instance of a bank robbery in which the on-duty, armed security guard was targeted. Ignoring that one could get the BG's killed. Targeting him/them, specifically, at the outset can result in a successful robbery (from the BG's point of view).
Originally Posted by 500Mag
June 20th, 2008 01:20 AM
I am all for open carry, but you do loose the element of surprise and as it has been stated before, you may become a target because of it.
God bless our troops!
June 20th, 2008 03:34 AM
As stated earlier I carry concealed. But if we are shopping late at night I will place my shirt behind my weapon just in case. Going to the car in a dimly lighted parking lot, with few people around, makes one more cautious. This is one of the few times I OC.
Originally Posted by CR2008
John Steinbeck: Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he's too old to fight, he'll just kill you.
June 20th, 2008 08:11 AM
Wow - That is a point that I have never thought about before and makes as much sense as any other argument about OC vs CC as I have ever heard. How many LEO are shot every year and I would assume that most of them are OC rather than CC? Sort of puts a damper on the idea that a BG will run from someone OC. I know some will say apples vs. oranges but is it?
Originally Posted by ccw9mm
June 20th, 2008 02:01 PM
Not too common here in the U.S. but, in some other countries LEOs are gang ambushed just to gain possession of their carry firearm.
Just making a statement of fact and nothing more than that.
Will that ever become more common here? Who can say?
Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ
June 20th, 2008 03:59 PM
Hmm. This is a very good point! One thing to remember, though, is that a Security Guard is a constant. They are known to be in that location and probably where s/he will be standing. The armed citizen, be it OC or CC is still the unknown factor. If they are standing with their strong-side away it is possible they (the perpetrators) may never even know...
Originally Posted by ccw9mm
..however this also brings an important point. OC'ing in a robbery situation may very well force the hand of the carrier. Either you clear leather or, at the best, lose your firearm.
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"It is enough to note, as we have observed, that the American people have considered the handgun to be the quintessential self-defense weapon." - Justice Scalia, SCOTUS - DC v Heller - 26 JUN 2008
June 20th, 2008 04:03 PM
Actually, it happened to an officer in Hartford, CT last year around this time, he literally got sacked. They got his duty belt which contained his radio, gun, mags, and who knows what else.
Originally Posted by QKShooter
June 20th, 2008 04:31 PM
I have to say (and this applies to some LE as well) many folks are wrapped up "in the gun," lack awareness and the physical ability to resist a determined disarm. Equally, most CC'ers aren't prepared for a blitz-attack. For this reason, I dislike the general concept of OC: until we are prepared and legally able to "dispatch with immediacy" an armed or unarmed assailant while we carry, we offer the criminal community extraordinary opportunity.
Originally Posted by CR2008
If one hasn't taken a real punch to the head, unexpectedly, in the last 6 months or so, and actively, agressively functioned through the event, one should carefully evaluate one's preparedness.(As in the case JD cites above)
June 20th, 2008 04:57 PM
In Texas we can't open carry a handgun in public, well technically we can't. I OC when at home after I have taken a jacket off in the winter, and don't hesitate to go out in the yard to get the trash, or mail, paper, whatever, I am in my yard and it is perfectly legal. The only other time I do is when I am hunting, I will have my 44 mag on my hip with or without a rifle.
That being said, I don't think that I would OC regularly if it was legal. I say that for the same reason that I don't carry a shotgun around with me. Carrying a shotgun around, just about everywhere is perfectly legal in the state of Texas. I can even go into a bar with one. How many of you are legally able to carry long guns around in your state? How many of you do? If it is legal to do so, why don't you?
Simple answer, public reaction/opinion. Next time you go to walmart or the pizza parlor, whereever, picture the person next to you with a shotgun in their hand. Or imagine what the reaction would be from them if you were toting one. That is a pretty clear picture to most.
I would venture to say that many people who see folks OC initially assume that the person is a LEO. At least in Texas when I see someone OC that is what I think because they are the only ones allowed to carry that way.
I carry every day for a simple reason. The protection of my family and others whom may need it one day. I don't need to advertise to anyone that I am carrying, I don't need for someone to see a gun to try to deter crime. I can look at a punk or other unsavory character and let them know that they are being watched, and convey the same message that having a gun exposed on my hip would convey.
I don't know if OC deters crime any more than CC, I don't think that anyone does or will ever have good figures on that. If you want to OC and it is legal in your state more power to you. I don't know if there is a "movement" regarding OC because I don't see it here in Texas or over in Arkansas. Frankly when I go to the Memphis area, I don't see it there either.
I will however continue to CC even if OC is legal one day here. I don't need to draw any more attention to myself than need be. If I want you to notice me, I will make it a point for you to notice me, but my gun will remain out of sight.
Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
Texas CHL Instructor
Texas Hunter Education Instructor
June 20th, 2008 05:09 PM
I've taken the time to read this whole thread just now. Good points/thoughts made by about everyone on either side.
What stood out for me was that the scenario's presented the good and bad of a "robber" armed with a gun was involved. While thats looking at worst case scenario, and what each form of carry may be of benefit or not, I don't think the "armed robber" is covering the overall picture out in public.
We have no idea how people spot the gun on the hip from any distance [ open carried ] and decide not to commit the crime they were about to start. Say the 7-11.
Who knows how many times some banger type/druggie, etc has walked into that type of place, seen an open carried gun on a customer and thought better of carrying out their plan of robbery/theft, or who knows what.
Open carried firearms are spotted by a lot of people, but I'd think the criminals would be spotting them first in any given scenario over the average joe citizen, so we can't possibly determine the potential for the criminal element to not have acted in any criminal activity just because someone with a gun was nearby.
I carry open when working the shop. It's not a matter of if we get hit but when as far as I'm concerned. If they come with ill intent, they'll have likely cased the place for numbers of employees, their routines, their being armed or not, locations of register/safes etc. Even if they were stupid enough to hit that place cold [ I'm thinking 2-4 if it goes down ] with no prior knowledge of the above, they'll be expecting the employees to be carrying even if they weren't and they have that figured into their plans [ it's going to be a bad day for everyone involved ].
The open carry gives me a faster reaction time to threats. I may need that speed, as well as staying alert as much as possible of the goings on in the shop, who's coming in from the lot with what in their hands [ guns are openly brought into the shop daily, in hand, including ak's, ar's, g3's, you name it ]. Better stay alert, it's normal to see these weapons in hand and entering the store.
At times, I've not dropped the shirt over the gun when I've left the shop on the way home and stopped at the local stop and rob for a coffee to go. The alert factor just gets increased as to walking into a problem inside when entering, and no one gets close enough to the gun side, with the gun protected by the elbow.
So, I'm both forms of carry. Up until 4 years ago, it was concealed or not at all. Now I have a choice, and I don't give it much thought really. I stay alert to pulling into where I'm going, alert entering any store/bank etc and if all looks like it's business as usual, I don't give it much thought after that. I do those things anyway no matter how I'm carrying as most everyone should IMO.
Open carry can prevent/deter and it can be a disadvantage when facing hardened criminals who may challenge you regardless of the gun they can see. I really don't believe you are specifically targeted just because you have a gun as often as it deters people from dealing with you.
The lady carrying open on her way to the parking lot is less likely to be attacked as one who is concealed carry or not armed. Thats human nature, and the predator doesn't pick hard targets lightly, hence I think the deterrent of crime to your person is greater than the risk of being targeted just because someone can see it.
The mind is the limiting factor
Quick Kill Rifle and Pistol Instructor
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