Pistol-packing Pa. soccer mom loses gun permit (Merged) - Page 8

Pistol-packing Pa. soccer mom loses gun permit (Merged)

This is a discussion on Pistol-packing Pa. soccer mom loses gun permit (Merged) within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by ccw9mm Any person who attempted that would be a felon, and the resisting of an attack by any felon in the act ...

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Thread: Pistol-packing Pa. soccer mom loses gun permit (Merged)

  1. #106
    Member Array TattooedGunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    Any person who attempted that would be a felon, and the resisting of an attack by any felon in the act would be justified.


    Absolutely, in my opinion. (Securely, of course.) But then, so should every other freedom-loving adult who desires to resist felonious actions that may arise in our lives. It's the entire point.

    Take the number of sporting events you've ever attended. Many of us have probably witnessed a person go sideways, bring out a weapon, strike (or even badly beat/harm) another person. Yes, if weapons were brought by every upstanding person, there would be more weapons there. But that's exactly the point of the exercise: to make it absolutely impossible for a felon to gain the upper hand against upstanding citizens ... here, there, everywhere. Yes, situations would likely be shut down via firearms, then. But, they would be shut down, instead of leaving everyone with nothing to do but weep about their hollow inability to do a damned thing about it. And, at a place where our defenseless children are gathered? It's at just such places where we have the most reason to ensure things are safely protected.

    In short: this woman sees clearly, thinks simply and acts accordingly. She is not a threat. Not by any standard.


    Awesome post, I wish I could word things this well.
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    Glock 17, Dale Fricke Archangel, Wilderness Tactical belt.
    My Guns and Tattoos Blog


  2. #107
    Ex Member Array jahwarrior72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pro2A View Post
    It was the sheriff using his personal opinion above the law in this case. OC is legal in PA. You may or may not agree with it, but its the law, you have the choice to either CC with a permit, or OC without a permit. Revoking her permit for not breaking a law is not right, nor is it legal in a "Shall issue" state. If anyone broke the law it was the local authorities. Revoking her permit only forced her to OC since you need a permit to CC in PA.
    ummm, yeah....that's what i said.

  3. #108
    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jahwarrior72 View Post
    ummm, yeah....that's what i said.
    Just putting an emphasis on it

  4. #109
    New Member Array Denial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 747Sonny View Post
    I notice that caption says "pistol packin soccer mom". Considering that PA is so liberal and anti-gun Rendel, I'm surprised they didn't somehow tie this to Gov. Palin. Just my thoughts on this.
    Lebanon is in the mid-state. PA is acctually very gun freindly and conservitive. It is philly (2 hours east) and pittsburg (4 hours west) that are the bastions of liberalness.

    P.S. - Randell is a Philly Boy

  5. #110
    Member Array bcvojak's Avatar
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    I'm sorry but in my opinion, people who say "She shouldn't open carry because I don't like it" are no different than those who say "I's OK if they ban those AR-15s, as long as I get to keep my Weatherby". I personally prefer concealed carry, even though we have open carry and State level preemption (WA State). If she showed up a one of my daughters events, I'd probably end up "talking guns" with her.

    Since she was following the law. . she should sue the Sheriff to recover her legal fees. Especially since, by his own admission, did this purely for personal and political motives.
    Somewhere in the Pacific NW

  6. #111
    Member Array Rusty Bouquett's Avatar
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    Does anybody know the status of the legal action she took to regain her permit?

  7. #112
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Bouquett View Post
    Does anybody know the status of the legal action she took to regain her permit?
    Permit restored/returned, October 14.

    Quote Originally Posted by MP45Man View Post
    I think she did a great disservice to the carrying community.
    IMO, exactly the opposite was the outcome. She showed that a parent simply being earnest about the security of her family is no threat. The bureaucrats agreed.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  8. #113
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    Soccer Mom suing.

    This may be posted earlier. I saw on the news this morning that the mom is suing the county for damages. She didn't specify the amount but she said she was out about 3 grand for her defense. Can't wait to see the editorial page in a couple of days.

  9. #114
    Ex Member Array jahwarrior72's Avatar
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    Meleanie Hain was recently a guest on "It's Your Call, with Lynn Doyle", along with Bryan Miller, that anti gun freak from CeaseFireNJ. two othr panelists also represented the pro and anti sides of the argument, one was a a cop from NJ; guess which side he was on?

    anyway, Miller, who is a journalist, blogger, and "professional" debater", attempted to take Mrs. Hain to task, using wildly inaccurate stats and typical irrational anti rhetoric, and had his butt handed to him on live TV by Mrs. Hain, who spoke in simple common sense terms. he then attempted to name calling. he put the last nail in his own coffin when, during the show, a woman called in, to tell her story. she was approached in the ladies room by a strange man, and she had to present her weapon to defend herself. Miller so much as called her a liar, and said a better option would have been to scream and call for help.

    you can watch the fun here: SFN on Lynn Doyle

    really, Miller was nothing more than comic relief, until the end; then he just disgusted me.

  10. #115
    Member Array ImaShepardRU's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jahwarrior72 View Post
    Miller so much as called her a liar, and said a better option would have been to scream and call for help.
    Probably what he would have done!
    This is the law;
    The purpose of fighting is to win.
    There is no possible victory in defense.
    The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either.
    The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental. - John Steinbeck

  11. #116
    Senior Member Array gilraen's Avatar
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    Tempting to put him in a restroom with a BG (pretender) and see what he does, and what he says afterwards before he knows it's just a test. Might teach him something.

    Too bad that's a lawsuit waiting to happen.
    "I pledge allegiance to the war banner of the united states of Totalitaria. And to the Republic, which no longer stands, several bankers, who are now god, indivisible, with Bernanke bucks and credit for all."

  12. #117
    Ex Member Array jahwarrior72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilraen View Post
    Tempting to put him in a restroom with a BG (pretender) and see what he does, and what he says afterwards before he knows it's just a test. Might teach him something.

    Too bad that's a lawsuit waiting to happen.
    *puts evil suit on.....

  13. #118
    Member Array kohburn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilraen View Post
    Tempting to put him in a restroom with a BG (pretender) and see what he does, and what he says afterwards before he knows it's just a test. Might teach him something.

    Too bad that's a lawsuit waiting to happen.
    hidden camera shows do that stuff all the time..
    "An armed society is a polite society" - Robert A. Heinlein

  14. #119
    Member Array SlowSSls1's Avatar
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    I was up in Lebanon PA this past weekend and read the following article in the local paper, I counld wait to get home to post it for you all.

    Gun mom looks to sue sheriff - Lebanon Daily News

    Gun mom looks to sue sheriff
    By JOHN LATIMER
    Staff Writer
    Lebanon Daily News


    A Lebanon woman who achieved national notoriety when her concealed-weapon permit was taken away after she wore a gun openly to a youth soccer match has hired a lawyer to prepare for filing a federal civil lawsuit in the matter.
    Meleanie Hain claims Lebanon County Sheriff Mike DeLeo violated her constitutional rights when he confiscated her license-to-carry permit after a parent complained when Hain wore her holstered handgun to her 5-year-old daughter’s soccer game played Sept. 11 at the city’s Southwest Park.

    DeLeo said Hain showed poor judgment and created a danger by wearing her loaded Glock 26 to the youth soccer game. He justified his action to confiscate her permit on a statute of the Pennsylvania Uniform Firearms Act that denies a permit to any “individual whose character and reputation is such that the individual would be likely to act in a dangerous manner to public safety.”

    Hain’s permit was returned last month after she appealed DeLeo’s action.

    In a hearing in the Lebanon County Court of Common Pleas, President Judge Robert J. Eby questioned Hain’s judgment but ruled that she violated no law by wearing the firearm openly, and DeLeo did not prove that Hain presented a danger.

    Two weeks ago, Hain said, she hired Philadelphia-area civil-rights lawyer Matthew Weisberg to represent her.

    Weisberg said he has sent a letter to DeLeo and sheriff’s department solicitor George Christianson notifying them of his
    intent to file a suit. He has taken no other formal action while awaiting their response.
    “I served the sheriff and his solicitor with a notice of my claim and an intent to pursue a lawsuit if they refuse to settle, which I fully expect they will refuse to do,” Weisberg said.

    Christianson acknowledged that DeLeo received the letter and promptly turned it over to the sheriff’s department’s liability-insurance carrier. He refused further comment, and DeLeo did not return a call.

    Weisberg said he believes several of Hain’s rights were trampled, including her Second Amendment right to carry a firearm and elements of her Fourth Amendment right guaranteeing due process.

    “I think her case, in terms of a winning legal perspective, is more complicated than just a Second Amendment case,” he said. “It is not so easy, because it is not necessarily about the denial of her Second Amendment rights and not necessarily about the denial of due process. Rather, it is about the intent to suppress those rights. That is what makes this case so complicated.”

    If filed, the suit will seek damages for pain and suffering, but Weisberg did not say how much.

    “I’m not there yet,” he said. “What could be the monetary value (of the damage) is hard to decipher. ... I would say that in some respects what she has lost is worse than actual personal injury or physical injury, because she has lost forever a feeling that she was guaranteed under the Constitution. Which is: You can trust police unless you do something wrong.”

    Hain, the mother of three young children, said her life has changed, and she has become a target of ridicule and harassment.

    She cited an incident in which a neighbor complained to a store manager when she spotted Hain wearing the gun while shopping. When the manager checked the laws, he told her she was permitted to carry the weapon in the store, according to Hain.

    “Once I explained that these people were manipulating him for their own agenda, he wasn’t very pleased,” she said.

    Hain said DeLeo’s actions have also caused her to lose customers at the babysitting business she operates in her South Second Avenue home. In addition, she feels she may have lost the opportunity to become a police officer because of the publicity generated by her case. She had planned to attend the state-police academy at her own expense, she said, but now she’s afraid she might not be hired because of the controversy.

    Although much of the expense was offset by supporters’ donations, Hain said she was also irritated by having to pay $3,000 to defend herself at the appeals hearing.

    “It (the lawsuit) is about money, but it is not about money,” she said. “It is wrong for me to have to pay out $3,000 in attorney’s fees to get back my license when I never should have lost it in the first place.”

    If she wins any damages, Hain said, she would give the donated money to a fund kept by the Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association for people who must defend themselves in cases like hers.

  15. #120
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    “I think her case, in terms of a winning legal perspective, is more complicated than just a Second Amendment case,” he said. “It is not so easy, because it is not necessarily about the denial of her Second Amendment rights and not necessarily about the denial of due process. Rather, it is about the intent to suppress those rights. That is what makes this case so complicated.”
    2A and actions taken to suppress it. It is that simple.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

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