Open carry in Michigan? - Page 2

Open carry in Michigan?

This is a discussion on Open carry in Michigan? within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; There is no law that says you can not open carry in Mi. As Rocky said, It is not an acceptable type of carry and ...

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  1. #16
    Senior Member
    Array Landor's Avatar
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    There is no law that says you can not open carry in Mi. As Rocky said, It is not an acceptable type of carry and you may ruffle some feathers doing it. In some cases depending on the scenario it could get ugly. You should be prepared to get a lawyer and possibly lose your gun until your lawyer can prove you have done nothing wrong. The law is one thing. Dealing with the police is another. If they have a problem with you doing it you might just end up down town. I am all for open carry and hope we make some headway sooner or later but Detroit, Flint and other bad spots in this state makes it harder for people who see someone carrying a gun not think they are a bad guy.


  2. #17
    Senior Member Array Al Lowe's Avatar
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    Pick your city.
    Quote Originally Posted by Michigan Open Carry
    A few of the cities members open carry in. PM me to add your town.
    Allen Park
    Alpena
    Battle Creek
    Bath
    Bay City
    Beulah
    Big Rapids
    Burton
    Chesaning
    Clio
    Corunna
    Dearborn
    Dearborn Heights
    Detroit
    East Lansing
    Fenton
    Flint
    Flushing
    Fowlerville
    Frankenmuth
    Garden City
    Grand Blanc
    Grand Rapids
    Grandville
    Haslett
    Hasting
    Howell
    Jackson
    Kalamazoo
    Lake City
    Lansing
    Leslie
    Livonia
    Macomb Twp.
    Midland
    Mt. Morris
    Mt. Pleasant
    New Lothrop
    Okemos
    Owosso
    Paw Paw
    Redford
    Romulus
    Saint Charles
    Sault Sainte Marie
    Saginaw
    Standale
    Traverse City
    Warren
    Westland

    JOIN OUR TALK SHOW AND LISTEN TO PAST SHOW at these links. Call direct at 810-208-1854

    The Saturday Afternoon Shootout!* Flint Talk Radio.com

    TalkShoe - Call - The Saturday afternoon shootout!

    IF YOU CAN ONLY WATCH ONE VIDEO THIS YEAR MAKE IT THIS ONE:

    Civil Liberties Examiner: Loose lips can get you arrested or, why you shouldn't talk to the police OR this link.

    "Don't Talk to the Police" by Professor James Duane


    Great Book on line STOPPING POWER: http://www.pulpless.com/gunclock/stop0584.pdf

    A few attorneys that will take on cases regarding firearm laws.

    Steven Dulan Attorney, site: Welcome to The Law Offices of Steven W. Dulan, PLC

    Jim Simmons: Law Offices of James T. Simmons, P.C. 45700 Village Boulevard Shelby Township, Michigan 48315-6093 (586) 566-1900 (586) 532-4110 fax jtsimmons@jtsimmons.com

    MSP's June 2008 Legal Update Newsletter: http://www.michigan.gov/documents/ms...6_238184_7.pdf
    Find the above info, as originally posted at MICHIGAN OPEN CARRY INFO HERE - Michigan

  3. #18
    New Member Array DerbyGirl's Avatar
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    I'm with y'all. open carry is NOT my first choice. i definitely want the surprise advantage if it ever came down to me needing to protect myself.

    but as a klutz, i'm well aware that my gun may end up showing itself to the general population from inside my purse or in my waistband. i was just wondering if i'm going to end up being arrested because my gun happened to show when i bent over to buckle my son into his car seat in the parking lot at the mall.

    based on the replies here, i am led to believe that imprinting, visible gun leather or even a visible firearm shouldn't be held against me.

    and as an aside, my boyfriend is a coach at A Michigan University. as an employee he is not supposed to be carrying according to campus police. he drives a university vehicle all over campus and off. he's in and out of campus buildings all the time...sometimes laws get grey and fuzzy around the edges...

  4. #19
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    I would not take that to heart. If you accidentally print and someone sees it and they call the cops to report a person with a gun you can bet the cops will show in force and although you might of made an honest mistake the police can make your life miserable for a few days and it might require you to get a lawyer. We all heard about the soccer mom in PA that just lost her license for open carrying even though she did not break a law. It scared other parent so she was punished. Not for open carry but for scaring or disturbing the peace.

    Link

    It would just be better not to print. :)

  5. #20
    Senior Member Array Al Lowe's Avatar
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    I've printed, and OC'd all over Michigan, I've been seen by cops and hordes of other people. The police have never hassled me about it, and most people just sort of stare. One or two have asked if I was a cop, and I said "No, just your every day, law abiding gun owner."

    Yeah, there are some in law enforcement who are not aware of the law. But they are being educated, one town at a time.

  6. #21
    Member Array Glock23MI's Avatar
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    Detroit...try Ann Arbor

    Having lived in Detroit for 3 years while in college, you would be hassled less than if you tried OC in Ann Arbor. In the outskirts, you would most likely draw more attention from the general populous than anyone else. Even then, few would probably mention it, less would call the police. Downtown would be a different story. No doubt the DPD would like to have a chat w/ you.
    Try OC in Ann Arbor and you're likely to meet with much more fear & screaming from passers-by and an iminent meeting with some sort of SWAT type team.
    The point of carrying for me is to have the upper hand of surprise if/when it's needed. OC immediately removes that and may in fact put a large red target on you, as you would be an obvious threat to a BG. Take you out, make an example of you, and everyone else complies.

  7. #22
    VIP Member Array Thanis's Avatar
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    The issue in MI is less what is legal and more how the LE who either notices the OC or someone who sees you CC for a second or OC reacts and how LE wants to react.

    MI has OC with a lot of gray.

    The best one I've heard was a range friend who has a CCW made the choice to OC one day. Someone has a problem and LE became involved. LE told him, since the holster partially covered weapon, was a CC. He pointed out he had a CCW. Then LE told him he was in violation of his CCW permit.

    Here is another gray. Your hunting and you deside to carry your CC Glock as a back up in case you run into something or someone. The Glock carries more rounds then what are legal to hunt with. Next issue, you are walking back from the blind. You took the ammo out of your hunting rifle, but what about the CC (or the OC back up revolver at your hip). I know a cousin who ran into a problem (loaded CC firearm) with the DNR officer one night. The officer claimed he was spotting / poaching after dusk. He was just walking home from a blind a few farms down from where he lived.

    There are a lot of Gray areas in MI when it comes to OC and CCW. MI is a lot less gun friendly then it might 1st appear.

    There are a lot of people I talk to (and even posts on this site) that state they have never had a problem. Then I know a hand full of people (and heard of a few stories) when problems pop up.

    In general, comes down to the situation, and it is not an open carry / firearm they charge, but a disturbing the peace or other issue. I have yet to hear of the charge sticking, mostly just hassle and loss of a firearm for a few months.

    So as a resident of MI, as a CCW holder and a rare OC, I'm stating IMO, MI may be OC, but there are a lot of gray areas.
    Last edited by Thanis; November 10th, 2008 at 07:55 PM. Reason: spelling

  8. #23
    Member Array starshooter231's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by youngda9 View Post
    Go to Handgunlaw.us

    Click on the "US Off Limits A-M" link on the left side. It will give you a .pdf file of all the places that weapons(concealed or not) are of limits in all states.

    For MI it states that the following places are off limits:

    1.*Schools or school property but may carry in the while in a vehicle on school property while dropping off or picking up if a parent or legal guardian. (Act 719 allows carry in parking lots. See below)

    2. Public or private day care center, public or private child caring agency, or public or private child placing agency.

    3. Sports arena or stadium

    4. A tavern where the primary source of income is the sale of alcoholic liquor by the glass consumed on the premises

    5. Any property or facility owned or operated by a church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship, unless the presiding official allows concealed weapons

    6. An entertainment facility that the individual knows or should know has a seating capacity of 2,500 or more

    7. A hospital

    8. A dormitory or classroom of a communitycollege, college, or university

    9. A Casino

    10.Premises does not include parking areas of the above places


    Administrative Order 2001*1 of the Michigan Supreme Court:
    "Weapons are not permitted in any courtroom, office, or other space used for officialcourt business or by judicial employees unless the chief judge or other person designated by the chief judge has given prior approval consistent with the courtís written policy."

    28.425c Sec. 5c.

    (2) Subject to section 5o and except as otherwise provided by law, a license to carry a concealed pistol issued by the county concealed weapon licensing board authorizes the licensee to do all of the following: (a) Carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person anywhere in this state. (b) Carry a pistol in a vehicle, whether concealed or not concealed, anywhere in this state.

    MSP website: Does my valid Concealed Pistol License allow me to carry a concealed pistol in a state park? Yes. MCL 324.504 states that the DNR cannot promulgate or enforce a rule that prohibits a CCW holder from carrying on property under the control of the DNR.


    Michigan State University, University of Michigan, and Wayne State University Buildings and Campus are off limits to those even with a Permit to Carry. All other colleges etc the only place off limits are the Classrooms and Dormitories.
    The above list does not cover ALL places Open Carry is prohibited by law in Michigan. If you really want to know the law read the book you received from your county clerk when you applied for your CPL. If you've lost it go to your county clerk and get a new one.
    If you didn't spend the time reading it when you got it you should do so soon. There is a huge amount of information in that little book. I have read the entire thing atleast three times.
    Michigan Gun Owner
    Michigan CPL Holder
    Proud Member of The NRA

  9. #24
    Senior Member Array Al Lowe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock23MI View Post
    OC immediately removes that and may in fact put a large red target on you, as you would be an obvious threat to a BG. Take you out, make an example of you, and everyone else complies.
    Find any instance where a NON-LEO was targeted by bad guys, because they OC'd. This argument is brought up all the time, but so far, there are no known instances of this happening.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanis View Post
    ............
    So as a resident of MI, as a CCW holder and a rare OC, I'm stating IMO, MI may be OC, but there are a lot of gray areas.
    Not really.

  10. #25
    VIP Member Array Thanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al Lowe View Post
    Find any instance where a NON-LEO was targeted by bad guys, because they OC'd. This argument is brought up all the time, but so far, there are no known instances of this happening.
    ...
    I have also never heard of a case where an OC was targeted because they OC. However, if a person OC a valuable firearm (and in some areas that could be your standard Glock), it has the potential.

    For example, about 20 years ago, someone was hitting houses that had NRA member stickers on their doors / windows and were stealing rifles in the Gladwin area.

    BG reacting or not reacting to OC has not been proved either way. However, BG have reported that they often pass on people who appear to be looking around and aware. You would think the OC would be a similar effect.

    Quote Originally Posted by Al Lowe View Post
    ...Not really.
    I don't think you can feel how gray the issues is until you get harassed the first time.

    Really, really, depends on what county or twp you are in, in MI, IMHO.

  11. #26
    Senior Member Array Al Lowe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanis View Post
    I don't think you can feel how gray the issues is until you get harassed the first time.

    Really, really, depends on what county or twp you are in, in MI, IMHO.
    It's not the issues, or the law that is gray. It's the stuff in between the ears that is gray.

    The biggest problem with most local law enforcement, is they THINK they know the law, but they typically don't.

    Go to this link, print it out and keep it with you. Make sure the URL is there. If you get hassled by any local LE agency, don't argue with the cop on the spot, give in, or whatever you feel you're up to, but take a copy of that form to their cop shop and see that the chief gets it. Mail it to them, better yet, go to the Michigan Open Carry forum on OCDO and post a message there. They have a great support system, and before you know it, that locality will be inundated with all sorts of info. And maybe even an OCDO picnic.

    Sure, if you OC, you risk getting hassled by the police. In fact, I'd say the likely hood of getting hassled by local LE, is 1000 times more likely than getting targeted by a BG. But this is the only way we can educate them on our RIGHT to bear arms.

    Concealed Carry is not a right. If it was, we wouldn't need a piece of paper saying we can. OC is a right. Use it or lose it.

  12. #27
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    Al, thanks for the info. I never noticed anyone OC'ing in my part of MI. A few of the cities on your list I frequent, too.
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

  13. #28
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    Exclamation Why raise suspicion

    Speaking as an LEO, I would stop and question anybody walking around displaying a firearm. The best possible reason for carrying a firearm is self defense, why would you advertise this to the bad guys?
    Protect your right to carry CCW. and pratice...

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by 588 View Post
    Speaking as an LEO, I would stop and question anybody walking around displaying a firearm. The best possible reason for carrying a firearm is self defense, why would you advertise this to the bad guys?
    Protect your right to carry CCW. and pratice...
    Without getting into the OC vs. CC debate as any posts resulting in or partaking in such a debate will be removed...

    Many OC because:

    A: They can
    B: They feel the presance of an openly carried re: visible firearm may actually deter crime
    C: Can draw faster with an OWB unconcealed holster
    D: Be more comfortable carrying by not needing a cover garment
    E: Carry a larger firearm as a smaller, easier to conceal firearm isn't needed as you don't have to hide it.
    G: They (in some cases) are required by law to OC
    H: Don't have a concealed permit, thus OC is the only legal way to carry.

    That about does it.

    To recap the topic of the thread is:


    Relating to MICHIGAN
    my question is WHERE this is allowed. is open carry allowed in all the same places that concealed carry is allowed with a permit?

    and the other question i have is that if i'm legally carrying my concealed handgun say inside the waistband at the small of my back and my sweater rides up without my knowledge and someone starts screaming bloody hell about my having a gun...what would be the ramifications? open carry being legal and all.

  15. #30
    Senior Member Array Al Lowe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 588 View Post
    Speaking as an LEO, I would stop and question anybody walking around displaying a firearm. The best possible reason for carrying a firearm is self defense, why would you advertise this to the bad guys?
    Protect your right to carry CCW. and pratice...
    Really? It's a right? You don't need a permit to conceal in NC?

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