PA OC, What do I need to know?

PA OC, What do I need to know?

This is a discussion on PA OC, What do I need to know? within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I understand PA has OC *some places*, not others? I have a CCW, am I better off just CC'ing, or can I OC without winding ...

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Thread: PA OC, What do I need to know?

  1. #1
    Member Array MedPig's Avatar
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    PA OC, What do I need to know?

    I understand PA has OC *some places*, not others? I have a CCW, am I better off just CC'ing, or can I OC without winding up talking to cops on a daily basis? (Not that I mind, but it always seems to be at a bad time...)

    Anyone?
    Guns don't kill people.
    Gaping wounds in vital organs do.
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  2. #2
    Member Array Steve261's Avatar
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    OC is 100% legal in the entire state of PA.

    However, in Philly you need a license to carry firearms in order to OC.

    In my opinion, CC is the way to go. I'm not against OC, but CC is what I would go for.

  3. #3
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    In Pittsburgh OC is legal but, I never see anybody doing it.

    As I have said on this forum before there is a "Catch22" in Pittsburgh law in that LEO must investigate all Man With A Gun calls so if any "concerned citizen" "drops a dime" on you and calls 911 - Expect delays and expect to approached as an unknown with a gun until they get you sorted out.
    And then they will allow you to go on your merry way.

    Please no Nazi "Papers Please" comments on the RKBA politics of it as I am just relaying the reality of how it IS right at this time and not how it ideally should be in some future perfect world.

    The OP may just want to get from Point A to Point B in Pittsburgh without having to play The Founding Fathers game.

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    Member Array MedPig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    In Pittsburgh OC is legal but, I never see anybody doing it.

    As I have said on this forum before there is a "Catch22" in Pittsburgh law in that LEO must investigate all Man With A Gun calls so if any "concerned citizen" "drops a dime" on you and calls 911 - Expect delays and expect to approached as an unknown with a gun until they get you sorted out.
    And then they will allow you to go on your merry way.

    Please no Nazi "Papers Please" comments on the RKBA politics of it as I am just relaying the reality of how it IS right at this time and not how it ideally should be in some future perfect world.

    The OP may just want to get from Point A to Point B in Pittsburgh without having to play The Founding Fathers game.
    Nah, I live at the other end. I was a cop for long enough that I *like* having the weight on, when I'm carrying. I'm used to having one. But, I wonder how cool people are with it. Given the vast majority of citizens who have sheep-like tendencies, I'll just keep CC'ing...
    Guns don't kill people.
    Gaping wounds in vital organs do.
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  5. #5
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    Concealed Carry is an absolute breezy pleasure in PA.

    We still have a good ways to go on OC though.

  6. #6
    Member Array MedPig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    Concealed Carry is an absolute breezy pleasure in PA.
    We still have a good ways to go on OC though.
    Yep. I got my CCW on Tax Day, of all times, and I've never had a problem yet. Nice and easy. I use a vest for EDC, which gets a little tougher when it's in the 80's, but with a 1911, or USP 45, I don't have a lot of choices...
    Guns don't kill people.
    Gaping wounds in vital organs do.
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  7. #7
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    Suggestion:

    Grab a good quality OWB leather pancake holster & combine that rig with a good gun belt.
    Pick a holster with at least a 15 degree cant - park it behind the hip and just cover it with a longer oversize Cotton T-Shirt.
    Very comfortable. I never wear a vest or additional cover garment.

    I carry all through Pittsburgh & Pennsylvania (in general) that way in Summer and I carry either a Combat Commander or a SIG 220.

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    Tons of good stuff here:Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association

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    Thumbs up

    Good worthwhile addition.

    Quote Originally Posted by MP45Man View Post

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    Member Array V65magnafan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MedPig View Post
    Yep. I got my CCW on Tax Day, of all times, and I've never had a problem yet. Nice and easy. I use a vest for EDC, which gets a little tougher when it's in the 80's, but with a 1911, or USP 45, I don't have a lot of choices...
    A quality belt and holster are essential.

    I carry a G22 or a 1911 in a canted belt holster at about 3:00 under a loose, untucked, botton front shirt with a pattern that breaks up any printing.

    If I want to wear a golf or tee shirt, I use my Kramer IWB #3. I position it at about 3:00 or sometimes 4:00. It's comfortable for driving, too. Even with a solid dark shirt, a person really has to know what he's looking for.

    I practice draw with the shirt and holster of the day. Some shirts need a weak-hand sweep, some shirts need only a strong-hand sweep. It's not a good idea to leave the house not knowing exactly how you will draw the firearm safely and efficiently.

    The 1911 is thinner than the G22, but it's more difficult to grasp when it's in the IWB. So, toss a coin.
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  11. #11
    New Member Array JCWohlschlag's Avatar
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    Open Carry in Pennsylvania

    Quote Originally Posted by MedPig View Post
    I understand PA has OC *some places*, not others?
    The locations in Pennsylvania where concealed carry is legal, but open carry is illegal will somewhat depend on whether you have a Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm.

    In Pennsylvania state parks, 17 Pa. Code § 11.215 prohibits all general carry of firearms (outside of the stated exceptions), but effectively since December 16, 2008, House Bill 1845 amended 18 Pa.C.S. § 6109 by adding ¶ (m.2), which specifically allows law enforcement officers and “licensees” to carry concealed despite any other restrictions.

    While within a Gun Free School Zone (within 1000 feet of a school), you are not allowed to possess a firearm unless you have a Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm. [18 USC § 922 (q)] Since you have a “CCW” (Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm), this does not affect you.

    While within a city of the first class, which Philadelphia is the only one in Pennsylvania, you are not allowed to possess a firearm unless you have a Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm or a reciprocal license. [18 Pa.C.S. § 6108] Since you have a “CCW” (Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm), this does not affect you.

    During and within the location of a declared state of emergency, you are not allowed to possess a firearm unless you have a Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm or a reciprocal license [18 Pa.C.S. § 6107]. Since you have a “CCW” (Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm), this does not affect you.

    Persons openly carrying a firearm generally cannot get into a vehicle unless they possess a Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm or a carry license from any other state. [18 Pa.C.S. § 6106] There are exceptions to having a carry license for carry in a vehicle for trips in between your home or business and the place of purchase, place of repair, target ranges, etc., but all these specific exceptions require the firearm to be unloaded. It is debatable whether motorcycles and bicycles constitute being “in” a vehicle for legal purposes as no empirical data to prove one way or another has been found so far. Fortunately, again, you have a “CCW” (Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm) so this does not affect you.

    The other locations that prohibit open carry also prohibit concealed carry, regardless of whether you have a license to carry a firearm, so firearms are just generally prohibited in these locations:
    • Primary and secondary school grounds and buildings are prohibited by 18 Pa.C.S. § 912. There exists a “for other lawful purpose” defense to this, but no empirical proof for how effective this defense would be has been found so far.
    • Court facilities are prohibited by 18 Pa.C.S. § 913. They must also provide a locker for you to secure your firearm while there.
    • Casinos are prohibited by 58 Pa. Code § 465a.13.
    • Certain Department of State buildings are prohibited by 49 Pa. Code § 61.3.
    • Any place off limits by federal law or regulation, such as federal buildings [18 USC § 930], military installations (except for hunting and target ranges at some), secure areas of airports, post offices [39 CFR 232.1 (l)], National Park Service grounds (at least until February 2010), etc.
    • Any private property where the owner or administrative representative has asked you to leave, or where signs restricting firearms possession have been reasonably posted, can get you charged with defiant trespass. [18 Pa.C.S. § 3503 (b)] Practically speaking, you will likely not be charged for violating a posted sign, but if you are asked to leave, you will be required to abide by that request.
    • Detention facilities, correctional institutions, and mental hospitals are prohibited by 18 Pa.C.S. § 5122.


    Quote Originally Posted by MedPig View Post
    I have a CCW, am I better off just CC'ing, or can I OC without winding up talking to cops on a daily basis? (Not that I mind, but it always seems to be at a bad time...)

    Anyone?
    You will likely not end up talking to the police on a daily basis, but you may end up with a few encounters per year. Police officers in Pennsylvania have begun being specifically trained on the legality of open carry since the MPOETC 2009 Mandatory In-Service Training was started, and this training specifically informs them that open carry is generally lawful and does not provide, in and of itself, grounds to stop citizens for investigative questioning. Hopefully, these incidents will gradually decline to the point where they are negligible.

  12. #12
    Member Array MedPig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCWohlschlag View Post
    The locations in Pennsylvania where concealed carry is legal, but open carry is illegal will somewhat depend on whether you have a Pennsylvania license to carry a firearm

    Most informative, Thanks!
    Guns don't kill people.
    Gaping wounds in vital organs do.
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  13. #13
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    Great posting by JCWohlschlag

  14. #14
    kpw
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    You might want to check out this site. Pennsylvania Open Carry Gun Laws, Information, Fliers and Forum - paopencarry.org
    There is a printable flier that outlines much of PA's carry and gun laws. It's for CC/OC, very informative and helpful.
    "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." -
    -- Marcus Tullius Cicero

  15. #15
    Distinguished Member Array AKsrule's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MedPig View Post
    I understand PA has OC *some places*, not others? I have a CCW, am I better off just CC'ing, or can I OC without winding up talking to cops on a daily basis? (Not that I mind, but it always seems to be at a bad time...)
    Anyone?
    My Two Cents.......

    As previously stated - OC is perfectly legal with a few exceptions.

    Is it always appropriate?
    NO

    Will you ever be confronted by the Police because of it?
    Probably

    Does it offer any advantages?
    You might deploy your weapon slightly faster than if it were concealed.

    I live in a small PA town - rural county.
    Without a doubt there is probably a gun of some kind in 75% of the residences. MANY people carry concealed.

    BUT I HAVE NEVER SEEN SOMEONE HERE OPEN CARRY.

    ( Not counting hunting , range/private land, inside home or business )

    I like to blend in.

    YMMV
    -------
    -SIG , it's What's for Dinner-

    know your rights!
    http://www.handgunlaw.us

    "If I walk in the woods, I feel much more comfortable carrying a gun. What if you meet a bear in the woods that's going to attack you? You shoot it."
    {Bernhard Goetz}

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