Open Carry Question - Why?

This is a discussion on Open Carry Question - Why? within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Why do people OC? Many of the posts indicate that some OCers are looked at strangely and that some of the citizenry show fear and/or ...

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Thread: Open Carry Question - Why?

  1. #1
    Member Array rangefinder's Avatar
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    Open Carry Question - Why?

    Why do people OC?

    Many of the posts indicate that some OCers are looked at strangely and that some of the citizenry show fear and/or wonder at those who OC.

    I imagine that most of the BGs carry concealled.

    I understand and agree with "my right" as a reason.

    Doesn't this make the person who is OCing a target?

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    Ex Member Array jahwarrior72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rangefinder View Post
    Why do people OC?
    for a variety of reasons. i do it as a matter of practicality.

    Doesn't this make the person who is OCing a target?
    that's a common myth, to discourage people from open carrying.
    ten characters.

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    Senior Member Array rmodel65's Avatar
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    OC is considered by courts to be the right, CC can be banned by states(although some ban OC+CC or just OC) in the DC v Heller case this case from GA was cited as what 2A means...

    Caselaw, Nunn v. State

    The state of Georgia may not violate the right to openly carry a "breast pistol" in the hand, which is protected by the Second Amendment. In dicta, the court stated that Georgia could regulate or prohibit concealed carry without infringing on the Second Amendment. No state constitutional right to bear arms in 1846.

    The court clarified the scope of the right protected as follows:
    "The right of the whole people, old and young, men, women and boys, and not militia only, to keep and bear arms of every description, and not such merely as are used by the militia, shall not be infringed, curtailed, or broken in upon, in the smallest degree; and all of this for the important end to be attained: the rearing up and qualifying a well-regulated militia, so vitally necessary to the security of a free State."
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    VIP Member Array raevan's Avatar
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    A matter to consider; the more people open carry, the more people except it that it is a normal thing to do.

    Back in the 19th Century people OC their EDC and concealed their BUG. Still not a bad way to carry.

    It is a personal choise, I sometimes OC , sometimes I CC and sometimes I do both at same time. I really depends on circumstance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rangefinder View Post
    Why do people OC?
    Many of the posts indicate that some OCers are looked at strangely and that some of the citizenry show fear and/or wonder at those who OC.
    A lot depends on what part of the country your in. I believe you'd find OC more accepted in the South and the West (in states where it is legal). I've yet to encounter any problems when OC'ing.

    Doesn't this make the person who is OCing a target?
    There is no proof that OC'ing makes a person a target for BG's, just like there is no proof that allowing CC in restaurants that serve alcohol causes random shooting in those establishments.

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    VIP Member Array bsnow's Avatar
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    Choice. I OC in the woods and CC in town, just depends, sometime both. I agree with raevan. It's a personal decision on circumstance.

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    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    I OC and CC....depends on my preference that day...
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

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    JD
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    I've OC'd for a couple of reasons:

    1: In VA while awaiting my permit it was the only legal way to carry.
    2: In VA it was the only legal way to carry in an establishment that serves alcohol.
    3: Even when I had my permit, sometimes it was just more convenient to OC.

    Regarding:

    Doesn't this make the person who is OCing a target?
    Sure it could, but it would take one ballsy criminal to do so. If I recall correctly there has only been once incident where someone was targeted specifically that OC'd. Other than that it tends not to happen. However that doesn't mean it can't.







    Also, if this turns into an OC vs. CC debate, posts will be removed etc.

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    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rangefinder View Post
    Why do people OC?

    Many of the posts indicate that some OCers are looked at strangely and that some of the citizenry show fear and/or wonder at those who OC.

    I imagine that most of the BGs carry concealled.

    I understand and agree with "my right" as a reason.

    Doesn't this make the person who is OCing a target?
    I'm not allowed to OC in my state, but I am allowed to OC in others, and I have. First off, I don't care if I get looked at strangely, and I give no value to what any stranger thinks about me, the way I look, or what I do. Each and every person has their rights, and if someone wants to show fear, then that's their right to do so. Let them wonder (or wander the way I see it).
    "my right" as a reason? Well, it is a pretty good reason you'll have to admit, but let's take a step further.......if we don't assert our rights, then they are subject to being taken and can be lost. If people don't use and retain their rights, then what did the Fathers of this nation do exactly? Just write some stuff down on a piece of paper just for fun? This is America, and whenever someone asserts their rights in the view of the public, it should send a message.....that this IS America, and it will continue to be what it was intended from the start. By the people, for the people, and with all of their rights intact and not subject to interpretation or misrepresentation, or discombobulation.
    Does OC make one a target? Everyone has their own opinion, just like everyone has their own rights.....collective, and individual. I'll just say a few words, and I'll leave my opinion out on this one so you can make up your own mind (as you should without weighing the odds of who says yes and who says no and without making an analysis). Does one's faith make them a target? Does one's skin color make them a target? Does one's gender make them a target? Your answers to these questions is going to lead you back to the question once again. You can say 'yes, but...well....under certain circumstances, or yes...because.....or yes, in certain places, or yes....etc......etc'. But the answers need to come from you and only you. OC makes me a target for what? Strange looks? Odd questions? A crime can happen anywhere. Ask the criminals what makes an appealing target. Surely someone carrying a gun doesn't make an appealing target. The criminals prey upon the weak and the meek, the unsuspecting, and the elderly because criminals have pea size nuts and no backbone. You might say CC makes you just as much a target as any American breathing air at the moment. Statistics?
    Why do I OC when I'm legally allowed? Because I can, and although it's one of my inherent rights, I've paid for it one way or another, and I'm gonna get my money's worth out of it whenever I can. Besides....what are our service men and women doing here and abroad but defending our nation and the reasons it was founded upon? Surely you can't say their actions are worthless. I say OC whenever you legally can, and you'll be supporting America as a whole. Educating the ignorant, the complacent, the next generation, and letting everyone know we are ready to defend ourselves and quit depending on others to do so for us. OC is a visible sign that we are doing just that.

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    Senior Member Array kellyII's Avatar
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    Well said RamRod, thats the exact thought and feelings that I have and believe in,,,

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    VIP Member Array raevan's Avatar
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    On being a target. I was more of a target while doing street Photography.
    One street Photographer in Seattle was shot and killed because a felon thought he was photographed. I was threatened numerous time for the same reason. One time I was chased 5 blocks by a pimp because I was doing an expose on Prostitution in Eugene Oregon. I carried then but prefered to avoid conflict if at all possible. I always tried to stay under the wire, it was always easier to do my job if I wasn't recognized.

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    Thanks for the replies. My post was one of curiosity, especially the "target" question.

    We don't have open carry in TX. Maybe if I lived where open carry was common I would not be curious.

    My question about becoming a target was not meant to infer becoming a target of opportunity simply because of open carry, i.e. strolling down the street. Rather it was in reference to situations such as a store robbery and a person in the store who is carrying in the open being immediately targeted. (Sure does help to have someone proof read. I know what I meant to say. I just didn't say it well enough.)

    Again thanks for the replies. And yes I do wish TX allowed open carry as an option.

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    Distinguished Member Array Bunny's Avatar
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    * there's an up-to-six-month wait time for CC license in my county, OC is legal and the only other choice if you want to carry while you wait

    *harder to CC on my frame with my gun, especially in warm weather

    *nobody seems to really care around here. If anything, it gets people interested in classes and the idea of carrying to protect themselves and their families. Gives them a chance to see a real-live "gun nut" up close and personal, and see that we are not "crazy" or "scary."

    *I personally don't think it makes me any more of a target than if I was CC or not carrying at all. I think it might make me less of a target, actually. Let's face it, the playing field isn't exactly even for a 5'4" female. Maybe someone sees my Sig on my hip and thinks twice about me when he's shopping for a victim.

    Maybe not. *shrug*
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    Senior Member Array Tom357's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rangefinder View Post
    Why do people OC?
    First and foremost, I OC because there are places I can OC, but am prohibited by law from CC, like restaurants that serve alcohol (hopefully, that will change within the next few months). I also think it is important for people to see us carrying as we go about our mundane tasks, neatly dressed, polite, with families or without, minding our own business, everyman - normal members of the community and neighbors - not the paranoid, extremist fringe the anti's would have the public believe. In that sense, it is part of being an active gun rights supporter, for me, anyway. We have more than a century of propaganda to overcome in our efforts to maintain our rights. We can't just stick with the abstract, talking about the Constitution and Bill of Rights and the philosphy of Founding Fathers. We have to personalize it, quietly, as individuals, letting our deeds put a lie to the propaganda. It is much harder to accept the image the Brady Bunch portrays, when they've known Joe Nextdoor for 20 years as a good, stable member of the community and completely unremarkable in every respect except that he carries. And when they start seeing others carrying in the community, who are also otherwise unremarkable, then the hyperbole stops making sense.
    ...Many of the posts indicate that some OCers are looked at strangely and that some of the citizenry show fear and/or wonder at those who OC...
    There will always be hoplophobes. All we can do is, by our own actions and behavior, cause them to question their preconceptions.
    ...Doesn't this make the person who is OCing a target?
    Do you have any proof that this is, in fact, the case?

    I know of a recent robbery, right here in my area, where that was most definitely NOT the case, and it illustrates my points, well. 9 people in a convenience store, being held at gunpoint by a would-be thief who was threatening to kill them all. One of them, someone people saw in that store everyday, a friend of the store owner and a respected member of the community, was open carrying. After giving the situation a chance to resolve without violence, when the threats started, the man carrying took action. The thief didn't give him a second glance - missed it completely until it was too late. This man shot the robber and stopped the robbery. The non-gun carrying victims encouraged him to keep shooting after the thief was down, but he remained calm and cool and judged the threat stopped.

    He wasn't fringe, but a well-respected member of the community. He wasn't bloodthirsty; in fact, it was the other store patrons who wanted more blood. He did what was necessary to save their lives, and no more. The fact that the thief died did not create a hue and cry. In fact, the media protrayed the OC'er in a favorable light, quoting people who appreciated the fact that he was carrying. The one article I saw that tried to portray the thief as a victim got absolutely no traction.

    I think OC helps us more than it might hurt us.
    Last edited by Tom357; December 28th, 2009 at 01:07 AM. Reason: word choice
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    Senior Member Array EvilMonk's Avatar
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    Rangefinder,

    I'm sorry that Texas doesn't allow OC. I have never really understood that...

    In KY, OC is allowed, but not widely practiced (at least in my area). I do it on occasion because it is my right, and I want the General Populace to see someone openly carrying a loaded firearm and maybe, perhaps notice that they survived the experience intact and unharmed.

    I do it once in a while to help promote responsible gun ownership and carrying for others who may be curious about the practice or even those hostile to the same. It has not yet happened, but if I am confronted about my OC, I plan on asking (I frequently use the Socratic Method) the questioner about the experience of seeing a loaded firearm.

    "If you had not said anything or approached me, do you believe that you would have gone on about your business unharmed and without any issue?"

    "What prompted you to 'Speak up' in regards to my weapon?"

    "Was I acting in any manner (other than the OC) that gave you cause for alarm or otherwise made you uncomfortable?"

    I can quote laws and platitudes all day and all I will get for my troubles will be the experience of watching the "blast doors" slam closed behind their eyes.

    Happens. All. The. Time. (About much less contentious issues...)

    At least by asking, I can possibly redirect the conversation, or even get them to question their knee-jerk responses to seeing the World's Most Demonized Tool.

    The one question that I may ask, but only if I believe the individual to be responsive to philosophical debates would be:

    "If I carry a weapon, and I am trained to use it, to you really think I need it to be dangerous? The Human Mind is the most deadly weapon of all, you know?"
    That which does not kill us leaves us broken and bleeding...

    Donít mess with the guy who can barely stand up. His remaining options for self-defense don't include your survival.

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