Do any African Amercians open carry?

This is a discussion on Do any African Amercians open carry? within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by SIXTO Here is an honest question, and I'm asking because I don't know; Have you actually sat in the back of a ...

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Thread: Do any African Amercians open carry?

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array Rollo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Here is an honest question, and I'm asking because I don't know; Have you actually sat in the back of a patrol car for an hour because of your permit? Or is it a fear that you have?
    If you have, does Indiana have a automated system to look up permits, or must that be done by hand?
    Yes, I have sat in the back of a patrol car for an hour twice. They run my permit and the serial number of my gun. The frist two times was mainly because I wouldn't give them consent to search my vehicle. So I had to wait for them to get a drug sniffing dog out. The last time was only about 15 mins because I was in a hurry so I just gave them consent to search instead of going through the hassle.
    -It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...

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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
    Yes, I have sat in the back of a patrol car for an hour twice. They run my permit and the serial number of my gun. The frist two times was mainly because I wouldn't give them consent to search my vehicle. So I had to wait for them to get a drug sniffing dog out. The last time was only about 15 mins because I was in a hurry so I just gave them consent to search instead of going through the hassle.
    Interesting. Thanks. This is providing me with some insight I don't have.

    OK, here is another question;

    Does anything about you or your vehicle scream drug dealer/criminal?
    "Just blame Sixto"

  4. #33
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Interesting. Thanks. This is providing me with some insight I don't have.

    OK, here is another question;

    Does anything about you or your vehicle scream drug dealer/criminal?
    To be fair, that is an unfair question.

    Reason being in that although we all have a specific image of what a drug dealer might appear to be, dress, look like and even drive as a vehicle.
    Fact is drug dealers look like everybody and anyone, even in specific regions and housing areas.
    They come in every age group too, from K-12 type to being senior citizens with grey hairs as grandmas.
    Just like any other criminal type.

    This falls under the no longer a major national topic but was not minor condition as related to 'DWB' (Driving While Black/Brown).

    Asking a person if anything about them seems drug dealer criminal could and does apply to everyone and literally anyone...

    Do you have tats of any sort?
    Do you have piercings of any sort?
    Do you wear jewelry of any sort?
    Do you have less than perfectly straight and/or white colored teeth?
    Do you wear shoes?
    Do you ride a motorcycle?
    Is your vehicle brand new?
    Is your vehicle not new?
    Is your vehicle extremely clean and well kept?
    Is your vehicle dirty and unkempt?
    Do you have tinted windows?
    Are you age 7 or older?
    Are you a human being able to breath oxygen?

    Really what exactly does a 'criminal' look like?
    Every criminal I've ever seen for any and all crimes looks like a human being, and that's about as narrow as I can call it....Even for rapists (women do rape as well as do men).

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  5. #34
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    You have a point Jang, perhaps my question was unfair. I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, I'm just trying to get a little insight from a perspective that I don't have. My black friends either don't have these problems, or they are cops too. To be honest about it, I have two non LEO friends that are black... I know its not a huge sample to pull from, but its what I got. That is why I am asking here.

    But, real world, there are certain things that scream out to me "Drug Dealer". It might be a the large sedan that sits a little strange on the suspension, multiple temp tags issued on the same vehicle, the car registered to a female, when its obviously a guys car, etc. That is what I'm trying to get at with that question.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  6. #35
    VIP Member Array Rollo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Interesting. Thanks. This is providing me with some insight I don't have.

    OK, here is another question;

    Does anything about you or your vehicle scream drug dealer/criminal?
    I drive a silver 2002 Mitsubishi Galant. Well kept. Indianapolis colts Liscence plate. No bumber stickers but I do have a Downs sydrome advocate ribbon. Non tinted windows. Music is never loud as all I ever listen to is NPR haha. I dress business semi dress. Dress pants, some sort of pollo or button down dress shirt. Dress coat. If I wear jeans I usually have a button down dress shirt with it.
    -It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...

  7. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
    I drive a silver 2002 Mitsubishi Galant. Well kept. Indianapolis colts Liscence plate. No bumber stickers but I do have a Downs sydrome advocate ribbon. Non tinted windows. Music is never loud as all I ever listen to is NPR haha. I dress business semi dress. Dress pants, some sort of pollo or button down dress shirt. Dress coat. If I wear jeans I usually have a button down dress shirt with it.
    You sound evil, mean and nasty.

    How about the areas you were in when this happened? Was it Hickville USA, a big city, or a nice suburb?
    "Just blame Sixto"

  8. #37
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    No worries SIXTO, and no disrespect intended nor offense taken at all.

    I point these thing out because well as fact everybody and anybody by specific look/spec has committed any and every crime imaginable.

    The best example I can think of that _everyone_ will understand is the DC Sniper case.
    I was living in VA at that time and the earliest shooting in Manassas happened at the gas station where then I used to go to get my gas.

    Everybody in every circle civilian as well as law enforcement too upon realizing this was a serial shooter were assuming and on the look out for a white male as within an age range. The FBI then were on TV stating same.

    Imagine everyone surprise when the shooter is found to be not one but two people, and they are an older post middle age Negro male as well as a teen protege also Negro.

    Criminals.

    They look like you, me and everybody.
    What makes them stand out to the most part are their actions and thoughts, which aren't always obvious and easy to discern by following patterns.

    I personally would never imply that a fellow member might be a 'criminal' as by choice of action or behavior.
    We must assume that we all are lawful citizens in our private and personal life choices. Besides why shouldn't a person be able to choose to live their life as they deem best and most comfortable for them?
    That is what carry is all about at it's core, and sadly some folk who choose to carry OC get run up on with assumption of being less than lawful mindset persons.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  9. #38
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    I'll admit I was surprised about the DC sniper too. That's a good example to use.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  10. #39
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    this is an intersting topic i had never or would never had given any thought to otherwise....thanks for bringing it up and more thanks for the participation and sharing...

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Really? I find this very surprising in today's world. Maybe I'm just naive, being a white boy my whole life. I would think presenting your permit and acting normal would go the same distance as it would for me.

    Here is an honest question, and I'm asking because I don't know; Have you actually sat in the back of a patrol car for an hour because of your permit? Or is it a fear that you have?
    If you have, does Indiana have a automated system to look up permits, or must that be done by hand?

    I can't think of a single time I treated a black permit holder any different than I would have if he had been white. Same for my coworkers. I did have a black lady with a CCW that was a total jerk, and she didn't have a fun afternoon at all; but it was because she was a jerk among other things. Of course she tried to make it out because he was black he was being hassled.
    first of all, i'm glad that you've decided to approach your job with integrity, and not treay anyone any differently than anyone else. more LEOs need to follow your lead.

    unfortunately, you were correct about your naivete. it's difficult to explain to a caucasian what it's like to be profiled because of your ethnicity without sounding bitter.

    when i first got my license to carry concealed, and did it, whenever i passed a cop, i had an irrational fear i'd be made, and get arrested, even though what i was doing was entirely legal. i blame that on being a witness to years of police abuses in NYC.

    i'm fairly confident that if i weren't hispanic, i wouldn't have had nearly the amount of issues i've had while OCing.

  12. #41
    VIP Member Array Rollo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    You sound evil, mean and nasty.

    How about the areas you were in when this happened? Was it Hickville USA, a big city, or a nice suburb?
    Small city would probably be the best way to describe it. We have are fair share of hicks though. It's really just the way it is around here. To be totally blunt I probably would have been fine the times I have been stopped if I wouldnt have been armed. Around here it comes down to Black people = OK but black people with guns =
    -It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...

  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPS Marine View Post
    Each and every LE contact I have had has been positive, even up to this afternoon and evening when someone tried to confront me while carrying and called the Police. The Police came and spoke to me professionally, simply ASKING if I was clear. That was the end of that. Later that evening, he called the Police again, and two different Officers came. I had to walk past them to get to my vehicle. They glanced and said nothing.

    Once again, I am home safe.

    No matter what race you are, if you show the Police respect, that dramatically changes the way you are approached. Also, the way you are dressed plays a big part...
    Welcome to the forum from South FL
    Nice first post; I agree with you.
    "The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"

  14. #43
    Distinguished Member Array 21bubba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    To be fair, that is an unfair question.

    Reason being in that although we all have a specific image of what a drug dealer might appear to be, dress, look like and even drive as a vehicle.
    Fact is drug dealers look like everybody and anyone, even in specific regions and housing areas.
    They come in every age group too, from K-12 type to being senior citizens with grey hairs as grandmas.
    Just like any other criminal type.

    This falls under the no longer a major national topic but was not minor condition as related to 'DWB' (Driving While Black/Brown).

    Asking a person if anything about them seems drug dealer criminal could and does apply to everyone and literally anyone...

    Do you have tats of any sort?
    Do you have piercings of any sort?
    Do you wear jewelry of any sort?
    Do you have less than perfectly straight and/or white colored teeth?
    Do you wear shoes?
    Do you ride a motorcycle?
    Is your vehicle brand new?
    Is your vehicle not new?
    Is your vehicle extremely clean and well kept?
    Is your vehicle dirty and unkempt?
    Do you have tinted windows?
    Are you age 7 or older?
    Are you a human being able to breath oxygen?

    Really what exactly does a 'criminal' look like?
    Every criminal I've ever seen for any and all crimes looks like a human being, and that's about as narrow as I can call it....Even for rapists (women do rape as well as do men).

    - Janq
    So please correct me if I am wrong. But are you saying that you look at everyone the same? That no one who may displaying some of the popular stereotypes increases your awareness. If not I believe that you are either being short sighted or blissfully unaware.

  15. #44
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    I'm pretty sure Jang was saying just the opposite. Its not that everything is the same, but that a threat or in this case, a drug dealer, can come in any form. The proverbial "Wolf in sheep's clothing" if you will.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  16. #45
    Senior Member Array rolyat63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    You have a point Jang, perhaps my question was unfair. I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, I'm just trying to get a little insight from a perspective that I don't have. My black friends either don't have these problems, or they are cops too. To be honest about it, I have two non LEO friends that are black... I know its not a huge sample to pull from, but its what I got. That is why I am asking here.

    But, real world, there are certain things that scream out to me "Drug Dealer". It might be a the large sedan that sits a little strange on the suspension, multiple temp tags issued on the same vehicle, the car registered to a female, when its obviously a guys car, etc. That is what I'm trying to get at with that question.
    SIXTO - I've seen you and/or other LEOs mention male driving the female registered vehicle as a tickler to get your SA up. I drove a car for two years that was in my wifes name. She bought it while I was in Afghanistan so it was in her name. I say this realizng you guys got a job to do and there are a lot of bad people and a good portion of them can't buy: guns, cars, homes etc... That being said it is like many on here say we should not be harassed for doing something legal such as OC. Likewise, driving a car that is not registered to you should not be a reason when juxtaposed with another legal activity such as having a legal CCW and driving in a "bad" part of town and then god forbid you are black. Statistically those stops are gonna get some bad guys but at what cost?

    What percentage of hits in the dragnet is accetpable for infringing ones peaceable journey to investigate if it's a BG? It's really a rhetorical question, I don't mean to sound flip. It's a conumdrum because I see the reasons for it but dislike that a US citizen with all of the protections of the Constitution can get put in the back seat until he "proves" he's not breaking the law.
    rolyat63
    NRA Certified Pistol Instructor

    A gun in the hand is a million times more valuable than a cop on the phone!

    FL Concealed Weapon or Firearm Program

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