Is 750 pound safe on second floor too heavy?
This is a discussion on Is 750 pound safe on second floor too heavy? within the Related Gear & Equipment forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Ok, this link is helpful, ignore the fact that it's about aquariums: how large an aquarium can my floor support
So yes, a design live ...
April 22nd, 2010 06:18 PM
Ok, this link is helpful, ignore the fact that it's about aquariums: how large an aquarium can my floor support
So yes, a design live load of 40 pounds per square foot means that floor is designed to hold up 40 pounds on each and every square foot of the floor. So imagine pouring a thick enough concrete slab to hit that weight at every point of the floor. Obviously the refrigerator, the safe, and the people, exceed that 40 pounds, but there are lots of square feet in the room that are totally empty that make it work out for the total span.
April 22nd, 2010 06:25 PM
I am with you guys on the math not making sense. I looked it up as well and didn't beleive the numbers were so low. I figured I must not be understanding the calculation. That is why I posted. I figured if others in a similair situation were doing it sucessfully it is probally OK in my case as well.
As someone said earlier the most intelligent thing to do would be to have an engineer look at the original building plans and give me a go no go decision.
However, by the time I dig up plans and find an engineer I will have more money invested in the process than the darn safe. Not to mention I will just get bored with the process and move onto something else further delaying my need to pull the trigger and get that safe.
Sorry for the unintended puns.
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April 22nd, 2010 06:56 PM
Okay, I've had my 5000 lb safe upstairs for 100 years with no problem...other than the house tilts a little in that direction, like 20 degrees or so.
Originally Posted by tmizzi
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April 22nd, 2010 07:16 PM
yep. i have a 125 gallon saltwater tank on my 2nd floor. between the tank, sump, stand and contents of the thing we are talking about well over 1500 lbs. Of course the foot print is 72" x 20".
Originally Posted by jbs
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April 22nd, 2010 07:57 PM
I'm just thinking of it this way. If you would get 6...200 pound people standing as close as possible together in the corner of any decently well constructed 2nd floor room...would the floor collapse? That's 1,200#
I don't think so.
April 22nd, 2010 08:18 PM
Floor load tables are written to limit deflection of the floor to a minimal normally (length of span/360) it is not the breaking strength of the floor. Lumber will deflect a long way before it breaks.
A 1000# safe in the corner is not going to stress a modern properly framed floor. If it was placed in the middle of the room you might see some bounce in the floor but still would be unlikely to break through. That being said I wouldn't place it between the water bed and the fish tank.
My biggest concern would be if the bottom wasn't flat the legs would break through the decking, that's were the couple of sheets of plywood under it would help.
Standard disclaimer- I can't make any guarantees without seeing your house, and I might be a complete idiot that has no idea what he's talking about, so listen to my advice at your own risk
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April 22nd, 2010 08:40 PM
"That being said I wouldn't place it between the water bed and the fish tank." <~~~~
April 22nd, 2010 09:43 PM
Standard construction practices will see an average floor rated for 600 lbs per square foot.
Thats two fat people standing together kissing.
I would say that placing the safe upstairs would be fine. If you want to be conservative, place it in a corner,which is typically the strongest part of the house.
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April 25th, 2010 05:05 PM
So wait, the whole thing is wood frame? Or is the downstairs CBS/poured concrete?
Originally Posted by tmizzi
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April 25th, 2010 05:36 PM
Sort of looks like the Tower of Piza as you're driving up to the house, huh?
Originally Posted by OldVet
Six sq. ft. (36"x 24") holding 900 lbs. Ask the architect of builder of the house if you're not sure.
You probably don't have a problem but it might be a good idea to check for sure.
I will say that as I move into my next house and get a large safe I plan on putting it on the first level. Might have a second smaller one on the second level but that big baby is going on the ground.
Good luck and let us know what you find out.
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April 25th, 2010 10:06 PM
I thought if I bought a new house, I would build a vault in part of the basement and have a fire steel door to it.... figure that should take care of it. Of course it has to be water tight too.
April 26th, 2010 03:53 PM
Putting the safe on the second floor should be no problem if the apartment is built to modern building codes. But, the above, quoted answer really does provide you with a large margin of error. Just to make sure (in my old farm house) I put an inch thick piece of 4' x 8' marine plywood in the corner where I want the safe to sit and cover it with a piece of carpet (just for cosmetics and to keep my wife happy). The plywood spreads out the load of the safe and contents over a wide floor and joist area (and, if it is the very corner of a room, the wall studs that support that part of the house) and reduces pressure on any localized point. For the record I don't screw/bolt the plywood to the floor or joists. I don't think this helps to spread out the load particularly but I sure am no expert.
It depends on its footprint. I would if possible position it above a first floor wall and place 3/4" plywood under it in a manner to spread the load over several floor joists.
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April 26th, 2010 11:25 PM
There's been a lot of reasonable sounding but ultimately inaccurate advise in this thread. Read the link regarding aquarium weights to get a real idea of what's involved. 750lbs may be just fine, but whether or not a couple fat guys can jump up and down without falling through really doesn't prove anything about what size safe you can have.
As for bolting it in place, you absolutely should. Think of all the ancient cultures that moved blocks weighing many tons using only basic rollers, pulleys and levers. Massad Ayoob mentions several cases of this being done in his books. One poster said he had his professionally installed in less than 20 minutes. Criminals can "uninstall" it the same way. Maybe faster since they don't care if they damage your home or safe in the process. They'll probably try not to overly-damage the safe's contents so as to preserve the resale value, but I doubt they'll lose any sleep over it. Even if they don't take the whole thing, it's easier for them to pry it if they can tip it onto its back.
April 27th, 2010 09:14 AM
The store that sold and delivered my safe says they don't move safes up to second floors any more. It isn't the weight of the safe on the floor, it's the combined weight of the safe, moving dolly, and crew on the stairs.
April 27th, 2010 09:23 AM
I'd definitely buy it with "delivered, in place" part of the contract. I did that, and it sure did take a big burden off me having to figure out how to move it off the truck, and into it's final resting place.
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