This is a discussion on Crimson Trace or Lasermax. within the Related Gear & Equipment forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I bought a S&W 442 revolver a few months ago. I have shot about 300 rounds through it and I am quite accurate with it. ...
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I bought a S&W 442 revolver a few months ago. I have shot about 300 rounds through it and I am quite accurate with it. I carry it inside my pocket on strong side as a backup and sometimes as a main carry when I need to. I have been debating whether I should get a Crimson Trace Laser grip for it. What do you guys think? All advice and comments are welcome.
"If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous... If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid for?" [Clint Smith - Thunder Ranch]
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I won't buy a carry gun that does not have a CT laser available for it. Period. That's what I think.Originally Posted by alachner
I do most of my training with the laser off, because getting hits with it on feels like cheating. In a real fight, cheating is good!
The lasers that lack an on-off switch can be easily disabled with some masking tape over the laser.
NRA Life Member; Range Safety Officer
www.armedcitizensnetwork.org - member
Glock 30, 19, 26; Ruger LCP (2), LCR, Mini 14; Remington 870; Marlin 336 .30-30
CT Lasers
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- I have a LG-405 for my S&W 638 and I love it. It's more comfortable than the stock grips and also reduces recoil. When I put the 638 in single action mode, it's even easier.
Cornered Cat has a great write up on lasers.
http://corneredcat.com/Gear/lasergood.aspx
- I agree 100%. I have a CT laser on all of my carry guns. It's just another tool in your toolbox and shouldn't replace training with sights or point shooting. It's also a very good training aid for dry firing.
Normally I would recommend the CT, but I tried the CT for the XD pistols, and hated them. Maybe it's just me, but the CT for the XD pistols is a sleeve, and it's a lot rounder than the XD grip. This made for a really inconsistent grip at the draw. I had to readjust my grip about half the times I drew it.
I switched to the Lasermax for my XD, and it is a lot better since the grip is unaffected.
Last edited by livewire; January 3rd, 2011 at 10:01 PM. Reason: clarification
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I shot 50 ronds with new Crimson Trace on my Walther PPK/S yesterday. I love it! Got it mainly because my no line trifocals re hare to focus on front sight...have to hunt around, tilting my head back, just to be able to focus on front sight. Now I have both eyes open, and focused on TARGET. No bifocal involved. The bulge on right grip that houses laser precludes using my Desantis Dual Carry holster, so I just ordered a Galco Yaqui Paddle. Another wrinkle is that since the laser bulge overlaps the lower 1/4 " of the rear of the slide, the left thumb doesn't have much room to grip the slide when racking a round into the chamber or clearing a jam. One nice thing is that the Walther is an old school classic, developed in 1929, and the CT does not interrupt those classic Bondish lines.
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CT for me...have 2 sets and love them.
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CT. Just received my 3rd one last night for my P226. The other 2 work great. Practice, practice, practice without using the CT. It is simply and aid in low light conditions IMO. Much has been written and discussed about laser grips. I am of the school, that if it can help in an ugly situation, well it's a good thing. Just don't rely on it as the end all.
...T. Ray
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Being a lefty, I have been frustrated with the lack of a CT laser for a J-frame. I'm kicking around the idea of a Lasermax to fit the 642, just not sure because it doesn't seem to activate as easily as the grip activated CT.
What Would Gumby Do?
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I am a big fan of CT. They are excellent on 1911's. I don't particularly like the clip on grips for the polymer guns since it increases the size of te grip. I find that the Laser Guard works better for polymer guns. I do not like Laser Max. I have one installed on a Sig 229. I find that I have to stop and clean the tip of the laser after shooting a couple of magazines.
"To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of people always possess arms..."
--Richard Henry Lee, 1788
"The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." - Thomas Jefferson
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Well, I guess I am the odd man out again. I have used both CT and Lasermax. I much prefer the LaserMax. Just my opinion but I love that the Lasermax doesn't add anything to the gun as far as changing the geometry of the gun at all. My gun looks exactly the same as one without it. Youd have to really look to see the difference.
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I have Lasermax on my G21sf. Great gear. The pulsating laser is to allow you to see it even in bright light situations, and it really works. Outdoor tests by myself have demonstrated a remarkable ability to see the laser even at high noon on a target. In addition, the switch is right were my finger rests when it is "straight and off the trigger" The support thumb is right on it from the other side, and the laser can be activated from either direction.
I like it, and could see many good uses for just such a thing (point shot training, intimidation in a SD situation, etc...).
That which does not kill us leaves us broken and bleeding...
Don’t mess with the guy who can barely stand up. His remaining options for self-defense don't include your survival.
Convenire Volui Spectatus
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+1 for Crimson Trace, you won't be disappointed
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CT Lasergrips are the ones for me. I don't like the lasermax for several reasons: #1 I hate the pulsing beam. It just messes with my eyes. #2 I don't like the placement of the on off button. It's not as easy for me to manipulate as the CT actuator buttons. I like the instant on off buttons on CT far trump LM. The LM is nowhere near a natural reach in that regard. Not without a major shift on the grip of the gun which will almost guarantee the point of impact will shift. To me that is completely unacceptable. I am in the process of fitting all my EDC guns with Lasergrips. I just put them on my M642 'Smith. I am having them put on my Sig Sauer C3 along with some other work my gunsmith is doing. I have them on my XD 45 compact that I'm currently trying to sell. If you're interested contact me, the package is complete. Gradually, I will put them on my other 1911 and my Beretta M92, as I can afford it. I will wait eagerly for a model to come out for my H&K P30. The only gun I probably won't so equip will be my next big purchase in a M&P 45 compact. For THAT, I'm going to do this: M_P_J-Point-480x339.jpg http://bowietacticalconcepts.com/
Last edited by ExSoldier; February 26th, 2011 at 06:12 AM.
Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.
I just sold one of each, for different guns. The Lasermax for my XD didn't have the problems you bolded though, but each gun has a different Lasermax design because they replace factory parts. On the XD, the switch is on the takedown lever, on either side. With my hands, my trigger finger lined up just right on one side, and my support hand thumb lined up perfectly on the other.
I personally prefer the Lasermax for one simple reason, on my XD (no replaceable grips), the parts are all integral, whereas the Crimson Trace I tried for it changed the shape of the grip. Now, if you have a pistol where the grips come off (like the set I had for my LCR, or a set for a 1911), then this isn't a problem, but for the polymer bodied guns, this can be an issue.
Plus, the 'low and to the right' offset of the CT bothered me. I actually sighted mine in relative to the POA. . . so the POI was high and to the left the same amount, rather than have the beam 'cross' at a certain distance like they recommended. Sure, I was nitpicking because at defensive distances this isn't going to matter, but it still bugged me.
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At first the "off set" issue was an "issue" for me until I saw the results on the range. At any distance from muzzle to 50 feet the shots were dead "on." Even one handed from the hip. When I used the sights, the dot sits right on top of the front sight. Yes, as you go past the 50 foot line the impact of the rounds will begin moving to the left but only a small amount till the range increases to far more than what a shooter will be capable of under life and death pressure. Also, I did some experiments on a small private outdoor range and discovered that my POA was still dead on if I was holding the gun above a barrel and peeking around the side of the barrel to see the dot. Try THAT with a Lasermax! Odd shooting positions heavily favor the CT grips over the integral module. I also found that the CT grips didn't "feel" any different to me on my XD than on any other gun. The angles are all still the same. Maybe your hands are more "discerning" than mine, though. LOL
Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.
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