Real Problem with a well Known Gunsmith; need advice - Page 2

Real Problem with a well Known Gunsmith; need advice

This is a discussion on Real Problem with a well Known Gunsmith; need advice within the Related Gear & Equipment forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Seems like a bunch of SOP "I dunno"'s for a shop that's supposed to do custom work - not impressed....

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Thread: Real Problem with a well Known Gunsmith; need advice

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array nedrgr21's Avatar
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    Seems like a bunch of SOP "I dunno"'s for a shop that's supposed to do custom work - not impressed.


  2. #17
    Distinguished Member Array Gideon's Avatar
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    Well I wrote Bob a long email explaining it all and will call today. Other than JD's comment I've never heard a negative and I hear a lot of good things about their guns but I think they have some sloppy processes. All you can do is give a man a chance to do right. If I was him I'd cover the cost of the sights and then some more. We'll see...enjoy the day guys.
    Gideon

  3. #18
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    From what you wrote, it seems reasonable to me that you packed your parts in the shipment, it got opened and they were accidentally tossed with the packing. Whoever opened the box isn't aware of what they did and/or aint talking about it.

    There's not a lot of employees who would just walk in the bosses office and say, "you know that guy that says he sent us those parts that we don't have? I might have tossed them in the trash by accident, I'm responsible".
    Turn the election's in 2014 to a "2A Revolution". It will serve as a 1994 refresher not to "infringe" on our Second Amendment. We know who they are now.........SEND 'EM HOME. Our success in this will be proportional to how hard we work to make it happen.

  4. #19
    Distinguished Member Array Gideon's Avatar
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    Well I left a message for Bob and no call back. I'll try him again next week. Usually if your polite and professional, good business men will be reasonable.

    Here's an example, ever heard of Vargo camping products? If you're into backpacking you need to check out their titanium hexagon wood stove for backpackers. Anyway, I bought it and found the door hinge was the tinest bit off. I wrote the owner, Brian Vargo to let him know and told him I'd try to "bend" the hinge tabs a little to get it working properly. I tried and couldn't and told him. An hour later he emails me a tracking number for the new one he just mailed me.

    Moral of the story? He's hearned a life long customer. I went to his sight (Vargo Outdoors) and placed an order for a few more backpack camping things I needed and I'll tell everyone every chance I get. The replacement stove he's sending will turn out to be good advertising and sales.

    If you're at all into backpacking or ultralight backpacking you owe it to yourself to check on his titanium products. Anyway, i'm hoping Bob at Fusion will be similarly minded.

    Enjoy your weekend all!

  5. #20
    Distinguished Member Array Gideon's Avatar
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    Well I got a call back, not from Bob but one of his gunsmiths Dave. They're only cutting the price of milling and new sights a tad. About $130 to mill the slide and then $89 for the low profile night sights. That's cheaper than normal but not by much. I'm surprised Bob didn't return my call or email personally.

    I'm not one to pitch a fit and frankly I simly need to get this slide done and back on the gun but I won't be going back to them in the future. I'd dreamed of having them build a 9mm CCO 1911 for me but I could never spend that kind of money with them after this. I don't think it's intentional; I'm really thinking it was an accident or someone other than Bob or Dave know's what happened but isn't stepping forward. Anyway, as kind as I'm trying to be the bottom line is that it's poor business practice. The way they always seemed confused about what I wanted done when I'd called, the way they simply can't see the logic in what I'm saying now, it all points to some guys who may build great guns but are not on top of their business. I wouldn't risk the price of a custom gun and frankly I wouldn't have them do my sights now if I wasn't desperate to get it back. Between the self proclaimed gunsmith that did the initial hack job to this, I've been with out these guns for more than half a year and when it's all said and done I'll have almost as much into the whole sights ordeal as I do in the guns' themselves!

    Sometimes things just don't work out. However, when it is done, I'll end up with a couple of .45's that I like that are simply rugged work horse 1911 .45s.

    So, your mileage may vary but I'd be cautious about dealing with Fusion firearms.

    Gideon

  6. #21
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
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    I'd just go local next time... a lot less risk involved.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  7. #22
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    A close friend built a Fusion kit 2 years ago, with the mutual goals of saving some money and learning the intricacies of building a 1911. He had the Kuhnhausen book in one hand and the telephone in the other throughout the build. Well, the hammer and trigger didn't fit the "finished" frame, the furnished pins were oversized, and there were numerous other problems from start to finish. Fusion sent him a few small bits, he was able to exchange some others, and others he just had to buy on his own. He spoke with Bob S. multiple times and got some help, but was also told to pretty much disregard the Kuhnhausen book since it was dated information. When the build was finished he had multiple parts left over, and a non-working gun. He had anticipated having a local 'smith go over his work and fix small details, but that turned into a $300+ job that required even more replacement parts. By the time he had a reliable working gun, he probably could have had a Wilson, Baer or Brown.

    I was interested in Fusion when my friend started his build, but not after all the struggles he had.
    Smitty
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  8. #23
    Member Array TxRhino's Avatar
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    Gideon, I am new here and don't know you from Adam but you are being way to nice about this, and I'm the guy that most people say is way to nice to people that **** up my stuff or when the repair man is late, etc.

    If it were me, and keep in mind I have a super long fuse, I would call them again and demand to speak with the owner. I would explain the situation and see what discount he will offer. If its lame like the offer you already got I would have them send back all of your parts as is and pay someone else to finish the gun out of principle. I would also make it clear to him your a respected member on this forum and plan to write a lengthy review of their poor service. If he has any business sense he will offer you a deal. 1 trusted negative comment about a business will carry more weight than 10 positive....so every businesses goal should be to make every customer happy, and of they won't do that you should give your money to someone else.

    Just my $.02

  9. #24
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    I will remember this thread when I go the custom 1911 road. It looks like Fusion is off my short list.

    Bob if you're reading this maybe you should work on tightening things up.
    QKShooter, DMan and thephanatik like this.
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

  10. #25
    Distinguished Member Array Gideon's Avatar
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    I appreciate the moral support guys. I belive it all works out in the end. I tend to be "understated" in situations like this. I believe it work out better that way and I'm less likely to blow up and then find out I was at fault somehow. I learned a little and when they call me to get my billing info when the job is complete....well you just never know. Despite the saga of these sights, it will be nice to have nice low (Novack) night sights on this.

    It's a long story but this compact is a RIA compact 45. It came with the military short trigger which I personally love along with a commander style hammer and beavertail. I added a Wilson tactical thumb safety and then I fitted a Wilson Combat round butt main spring housing. For some reason it didn't bother me using a dremel on the frame and it actually turned out pretty good for a first effort. I used cold blueing to touch it up which doesn't match the finish but someday I want to send it off to get the the front strap checkered to 30 LPI and I'll have to have it refinished then.

    It's been totally reliable and because it's all steel the felt recoil is not too bad. You may recall I had a Colt New Agent in .45 and ended up getting rid of it because of the recoil. The difference between a lightweight frame and the all steel is significant and the round butt MSH makes a bigger difference than you might think.

    Anyway, it's a in expensive gun; at least it was before all of this sight business but it's a nice workhorse gun, reliable and just fit's me.

    We'll see in about two weeks how it all turns out. When I get it back I'll have to post a picture of it. Nothing fancy but it really feels like "my" gun if that makes any sense.

    Enjoy the rest of your week!
    Gideon

  11. #26
    Distinguished Member Array deadguy's Avatar
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    Sorry about your experience Gideon.

    I personally had a great one with Fusion, having dealt with both Bob and Dave. I ordered a 10mm CCO and got a 10mm CCO just the way I ordered it. Missed the quoted time by 3 months but I know why and I'm fine with it.

    Every company has its issues and how they handle them after the fact is key. It sucks that this has been handled the way it has. I won't order another Fusion, but it isn't because of my experience or any quality issues with my gun. I love it.

    By the way, call Lou at Business End Customs about that 9mm CCO you want. He does a really good job and will build it for you from the ground up.
    There's nothing like a funeral to make you feel alive

  12. #27
    Distinguished Member Array Gideon's Avatar
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    I never came back to post the "final story". Thought I'd just let it go but after thinking about it, I decided not to. I'm pretty sure I was "dismissed" by Fusion. When I got my slides back the first thing I noticed was a little baggy with the extractor from one of them. Didn't even take time to re-install it after milling the slide but did at least leave it in the baggy. Did send back the one used/installed old style rear night sight. One of the new front night sights is a bit odd in that the white ring is only on the left side. It glows and all that but instead of seeing a white circle around it in the daylight it's as if they missed something and you only have the white ring on the left side. Not major but for someone who's a bit picky about their gear it drives me nuts.

    Both guns shoot ridiculously low now. And I'm talking more than a foot at 7 yards. the rear sight on one just about flew the coop after a few mags. Had to sight it in and then blue locktite the threads. The other was loose enough to wiggle with my fingers. To be fair I don't know what the standard is for sight work on a slide only. Since they can't really shoot the gun I can't expect it to be sighted in but I am surprised the guns are both so low. Not really anything I can do about that. I was able to get the windage easy enough for 7-10 yards.

    So all in all I probably spent more on the whole mess of trying to replace those GI sights than I paid for the guns . I'm including my first trip to a local gunsmith who wasn't a gunsmith and then this whole fiasco with Fusion.

    Your mileage may vary but I personally will never spend another of my hard earned dollars with Fusion Firearms again. I suspect if you go to them to buy one of their higher end custom guns you'll be fine but if you send them a lowly RIA and have an issue, they may just slap those sights on, not bother to really tighten them and ship'em back to you with the extractor in a bag.

    Lessons learned?
    -Better to buy a gun with the features you want from the mfg.
    -I did learn how to install a 1911 extractor
    -There's a real need for a qualified gunsmith in SE Missouri

    Having said that I love my two RIA's. for the most part they're a matching set except one has white 3 dots and the other night sights. I installed a rounded butt mainspring housing on each and thin grips. I'd always hoped to have them checkered (25 LPI) and refinished but I have so much in them now it's ridiculous so I'll probably just keep them as they are. With my luck, if I send them off the checkering will come back all wavy! The compact doesn't seem to like JHP's as much as it did before all this started but the mid-size continues to shoot anything all day long. Both have triggers as good as the Springfield mil-spec and Colt I had.

    So I like my guns, they're worn rugged workhorses. Have to get that compact tweaked a bit so it'll do better on JHP; for now I'll carry FMJ in it, JHP in the mid-size.

    Here's the compact:

    RIA Compact.JPGRIA Compact.JPG

  13. #28
    New Member Array wjsweet's Avatar
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    Interesting write up. SE MO? Should use Wilson or NH.

  14. #29
    Senior Member Array Fausty's Avatar
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    file an insurance claim.
    My metal band: Born under Sirius

    Glock 23, mic holster, clipdraw, abdominal carry.

  15. #30
    Distinguished Member Array Gideon's Avatar
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    Not sure how this could go under any insurance I have Fausty :) I'm chaulking it up as a lesson learned even if I'm not exactlysusure what that lesson is :)

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