Getting Too Good of a Safe, Backfiring.
This is a discussion on Getting Too Good of a Safe, Backfiring. within the Related Gear & Equipment forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I've been thinking about getting a large safe lately but can't afford one right now. So I've been thinking about things and here is what ...
January 17th, 2008 12:15 AM
Getting Too Good of a Safe, Backfiring.
I've been thinking about getting a large safe lately but can't afford one right now. So I've been thinking about things and here is what I've come up with.
-I hide everything related to firearms in my house (cleaners, holsters, etc) so if someone breaks in they don't have a dead givaway that I own weapons.
-A safe is a good idea in general but also screams "something nice inside"
-If someone is really wanted to get into your safe they'll just wait for you to get home then make you open it.
-Everyone knows that valuable things are in safes, so i don't want to up this percentage.
-Most safes look pretty low quality to me until you get into commercial safes, and those look pretty burly. Then again will it really matter.
I guess there is never an answer bc we don't know what will happen, just hoping to hear others thoughts.
So, is getting a high grade commercial safe something you think will backfire (meaning temp the intruder bc it's a demonstration way above a normal safe that I have something really nice). Or do you think they'd never really know the difference, a safe is a safe to the average crack head stealing my tv?
January 17th, 2008 12:28 AM
A Stack On style safe is asking to be carried away or if bolted down, pried open with the most basic of tools. A real safe will deter all but the guy will all the time in the world which means you are already incapacitated.
In my youth we used some spaces built into the ceilings and behind cabinets that worked well- too well as my father couldn't find some of his guns. This will protect them from the casual rand sacker but will do nothing for fire protection.
Which reminds me I will have to carefully dismantle my mother's house to find the lost items some time in the future.
January 17th, 2008 01:31 AM
You raise valid points. Safes do scream "there's something valuable inside", and a big thing like a safe is difficult to hide.
The good news is, your average burglar or gangbanger probably doesn't have the means or patience to crack one, and they're too heavy for a couple of dudes to just carry out. So they do have their place.
When, eventually, I have the money to build a house, I intend to sink a large safe into the concrete under a room in the basement, or maybe in the garage. It could be hidden under a false drain grate or etc...
Even if someone DID find it, there's no way they're getting it out of the concrete, and cracking it would be a much harder job too I'd bet. But I doubt they'd find it.
Just my two cents.
Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.
- Margaret Mead
"Booger Hook Off the Bang Switch" - unknown
January 17th, 2008 01:54 AM
Don't do it under the basement floor, I learned that the hard way after a pipe broke. If you're doing new construction or a remodel, build in a reinforced safe closet with a vault door. You can even do it inside a closet with your clothes in front of the door.
January 17th, 2008 04:34 AM
I believe that there is no possible downside to owning a safe. I don't think that your fears are realistic that a couple of small time thugs would find your safe and then take the added risk/problems of waiting around and taking you hostage.
Originally Posted by markp
They may possibly try and open or steal your safe if they have time, so make sure that quality and installation are priority. What is the point of buying a nice commercial safe if the guys could just remove it easily from the house
As a backup, don't forget to update and make sure that your homeowner's insurance covers what ever may be in that safe.
Glock 26 w/ CTAC IWB
"Speak softly and carry a big stick; you will go far" - Theodore Roosevelt
January 17th, 2008 04:47 AM
Yes, of course a decent safe suggests something valuable is in there. A crappy safe does to, though perhaps to a somewhat lesser degree. Only a dolt of a burglar would consider that relevant. It's a safe, for the safer storage of something more valuable than that safe, such as money, jewelry, cash, firearms or all of the above. Get used to it. It's the nature of the beast.
Originally Posted by markp
That said, consider what an accessible "safe" suggests to a burglar. Any one worth his salt will see it as an opportunity. Thus, the only real course of action is to acquire the best safe you can afford, if your intention is truly to protect those valuables.
Keep in mind the basic tenet of safes, as well: they only buy you time, and that according to the quality of safe, how securely they're bolted in place (ie, to the foundation of the house), and how well you guard that precious time via a separate house alarm service that calls police when triggered. Because, in the end, if a burglar has two days to get into your safe, bet on one thing: he will.
So. Does that make you feel better, or worse? It is what it is. Unless you find a spot in the attic that'll protect your valuables via not being seen at all, there's little better than a well-made safe bolted to the foundation inside a house with active alarms tied to the alarm service/police. Even then, it's only buying you time. If the safe isn't enough to cover the value of those things, then (as others have mentioned) that's where homeowner's insurance covers the loss. It's about all you can do, short of building a house around a "bunker" style safe.
What I've done: gotten the best safe I could afford, but hunted around for some time looking for a screamin' deal on a used unit; bolted to the foundation of the house; stuffed into a corner; monitored alarm system; homeowner's insurance covering the safe and the valuables. Beyond that, if it gets taken, it does. Nothing goes in there that's not replaceable. YMMV.
Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
self defense (A.O.J.).
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the number of victims?
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January 18th, 2008 09:48 AM
I've been the victim of a burglary, and I can say I was really happy I had a big gun safe. Whoever broke in went through everything, from the darkest corners of my underwear drawer and closet, and even the water heater closet. Yes, they found my safe, and pounded away at it. But they couldn't get in.
I consider myself fairly decent at hiding things in plain sight, so they missed some very nice pieces of 18k jewelry I had stashed about the place.
I also had a handgun and one shotgun out that they were only inches away from finding. I accidentally left the handgun out (it was hidden, but I had always locked it up when I was away for a weekend), and I always have the shotgun out. I believe there were at least two intruders, one searched upstairs and one searched downstairs, and then the downstairs guy found my safe and called the other one over. I think that's the only reason they didn't find the two guns that weren't locked up - as soon as they found the safe, they dropped searching everything else and concentrated on that. The only room they didn't get to was my office upstairs - it was left completely untouched, even with all the expensive computer equipment they could've stolen or demolished out of frustration.
So I'm happy I have my safe. It made them lose time and energy, and in the end, the only thing they stole was my vintage watch.
"Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power." - Yoshimi Ishikawa
January 20th, 2008 06:00 PM
Thanks for the feedback.
Agreed, a safe is just about as much as you can do, beyond that it's out of your control. I plan on buying a high quality commercial safe and bolting it down.
Most models I'm looking at are at least 2,400lbs. Even if that wasn't bolted it'd be pretty hard to move.
January 20th, 2008 06:13 PM
When I got a safe, I knew I didn't want to do what a cousin of mine did: place it prominently, in full view of anyone coming-in the house. I'm a fairly trusting sort, but there's no need for my safe to be in casual line-of-sight to someone on a service call or visitors in general to my home. A burglar may well come across it, but I prefer to do anything I can to prevent foreknowledge of it.
January 20th, 2008 08:11 PM
As aforementioned,if its in your house,hiding place, safe, or safe in hiding place,...Given enough time or 'buddies' they can,and will get to it if they want it that bad. Alot of folks say just adds time,but I can say that ALOT of common burglery thugs after a couple minutes often give up. IE the more time it takes,the higher the chance they will give up.
I like the idea of a safe sunken into cement,but...I'm not sure if safes ever need repair/upkeep that might be hindered due to its "mount" or location. If I was going to build a house,I thought of having a safety closet. Get a high end "security" door, and very nice lock set, reinforce some of the walls/doorframe,and place the safe within said closet,...but that seems like overkill.
"To blame a gun for a mans decision is to foolishly attribute free will to an inanimate object"- Colion Noir.
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