Ex-Army Officer: Nation's gun cancer spreads - Page 2

Ex-Army Officer: Nation's gun cancer spreads

This is a discussion on Ex-Army Officer: Nation's gun cancer spreads within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Its very sad somebody that "intelligent " is so foolish The wording he quotes " A well regulated militia " means nothing even close to ...

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  1. #16
    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Its very sad somebody that "intelligent " is so foolish
    The wording he quotes " A well regulated militia " means nothing even close to what he states. The word "Regulate" circa 1776 had a completely different meaning. Iirc it meant "properly" functioning. Back in those days a drillings (combo) gun was regulated meaning its multiple barrels were in synchronized tohit the same spot. The word regulate has more to do with training and has nothing to do with Government control. Militia means every able bodied etc...its got nothing to do with the military.

    Therefore, "a well regulated militia " I.e. a well trained properly functioning group of able bodied civilians is necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!


  2. #17
    AzB
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    “The supposed quietude of a good man allures the ruffian; while on the other hand, arms, like laws, discourage and keep the invader and the plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. The balance of power is the scale of peace. The same balance would be preserved were all the world destitute of arms, for all would be alike; but since some will not, others dare not lay them aside. Horrid mischief would ensue were one half the world deprived of the use of them; the weak would become a prey to the strong.”

    – Thomas Paine
    Az

    -- Luck favors the well prepared.

  3. #18
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    In a different area is was common Lts of his ilk became casualties of friendly[or less than friendly ] fire. Of course you had to engage in real combat action for this to happen.

  4. #19
    Member Array Holger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    In a different area is was common Lts of his ilk became casualties of friendly[or less than friendly ] fire. Of course you had to engage in real combat action for this to happen.
    I was all ready to verbally kick this jack*** in the junk for attempting to (falsely) provide "expert testimony" in his anti-2A rant. He was likely very liberal in his pre-Lt days and remains so today. I'm not sure where he did ROTC, but the fact he lives in Princeton probably means it was up in the northeast. Besides, he left the military almost 20 yrs ago and it really has no bearing on his beliefs today.

    However, THIS comment is just beyond stupid. I don't care what era to which you're referring, implying it's a good thing to "frag your officers" is right out of the anarchist/leftist/marxist playbook and has no place in our military. You're a lesser man for writing this post.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    I missed the part where he swore to uphold and defend only the parts of the Constitution he liked or agreed with.
    ^^^^^^^^YEP^^^^^^^^^


    What a buffoon.This dumbell should go live in China,Russia Japan, and any other craphole that does not trust its people.
    What part of" right of the PEOPLE to keep and bear arms "
    does'nt he get.
    I guess its not the same as the " right of the people peaceably to assemble, in the first amendment

    Amendment 1 - Freedom of Religion, Press, Expression. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note

    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Amendment 2 - Right to Bear Arms. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note

    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

    IT DOES NOT TAKE A PHILADELPHIA LAWYER TO FIGURE THIS OUT
    If you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans.

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  6. #21
    Member Array 120mm's Avatar
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    Seriously - There are more anti-gun folks among the Officer ranks of the military than probably anywhere else you'll find. As a Commissioned Officer, I find my "peers" to be nearly universally ignorant and anti-curious about learning about guns and nearly universally FOR controlling people in every aspect of their lives.

    Military Officers are generally among the least freedom loving people you will ever meet. Which bodes poorly for the republic, I fear.

  7. #22
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    4 years? Well thank you for your service Lt...

    Is there a wonder why he's still not in? I'm sure he heard during his "years" of service the following words...and they apply today..."Go sit in the corner L-T....we got this....can you round up a 100yds of flightline?"

    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post
    Seriously - There are more anti-gun folks among the Officer ranks of the military than probably anywhere else you'll find. As a Commissioned Officer, I find my "peers" to be nearly universally ignorant and anti-curious about learning about guns and nearly universally FOR controlling people in every aspect of their lives.

    Military Officers are generally among the least freedom loving people you will ever meet. Which bodes poorly for the republic, I fear.
    You know, I was about to disagree with you....until I read your whole post...

    But I have to agree with your words "universally ignorant and anti-curious...universally FOR controlling people". I can't tell you how many people I've had to correct/argue with in regards to the 2A and gun ownership. THEY got freaked out because they saw someone OCing (in VA)...then I explained the law to them. They were amazed that someone could just buy a gun and carry it (openly)...."why no training? Because in NY...." (and this is when the fight started )

    It comes from the mentality that officers are responsible for everything that happens on their watch...that the only way to prevent mishaps is through training.....hello? Friday afternoon "safety briefs"? Thus, if you did not training your people to "don't drink and drive" then it becomes a leadership failure to "take care of troops"....ignorant, I know. But if you did do everything you're "supposed" to do...then you're off the hook (CYA mentality).

    Some still believe that only military and police should have guns...not sure how much of that is a product of their upbringing....or influenced through the military. I do have a tendency to get on my soapbox and discuss the freedoms we are defending...the Constitution we swore to "support and defend"..."without mental reservation or purpose of evasion"--this part I use to have them question themselves as to why they joined and swore an oath. You don't defend the parts you like and the parts you don't.....you defend the entire Constitution. Most don't like to hear that...I don't care.

    So, in light of the former Lt's opinion, I wonder how he feels about the oath he took?
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

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  8. #23
    Member Array Holger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post
    Seriously - There are more anti-gun folks among the Officer ranks of the military than probably anywhere else you'll find. As a Commissioned Officer, I find my "peers" to be nearly universally ignorant and anti-curious about learning about guns and nearly universally FOR controlling people in every aspect of their lives.

    Military Officers are generally among the least freedom loving people you will ever meet. Which bodes poorly for the republic, I fear.
    Odd. My experience in fighter squadrons the past 15 years is the exact opposite. The overwhelming majority of the officers I fly with own guns, from handguns to ARs to shotguns.

    I'm quite concerned about a military officer that speaks in such broad generalizations. Perhaps your branch of service has a problem, or merely it's just the ones you've served with. Or maybe it's just you, I don't know. I'd say your experience is probably extremely limited in scope, and I'd be cautious about applying gross generalizations across the officer corps.

  9. #24
    VIP Member Array edr9x23super's Avatar
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    It is clear that while the guy may have his own interpretation of the 2nd Amendment, it is clearer that he also never read the federalist papers.....The founding fathers intentions were very clear when you combine what is written in the constitution with what is contained in the Federalist papers.....
    "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined". - Patrick Henry

  10. #25
    Member Array 120mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    You know, I was about to disagree with you....until I read your whole post...

    But I have to agree with your words "universally ignorant and anti-curious...universally FOR controlling people". I can't tell you how many people I've had to correct/argue with in regards to the 2A and gun ownership. THEY got freaked out because they saw someone OCing (in VA)...then I explained the law to them. They were amazed that someone could just buy a gun and carry it (openly)...."why no training? Because in NY...." (and this is when the fight started )

    It comes from the mentality that officers are responsible for everything that happens on their watch...that the only way to prevent mishaps is through training.....hello? Friday afternoon "safety briefs"? Thus, if you did not training your people to "don't drink and drive" then it becomes a leadership failure to "take care of troops"....ignorant, I know. But if you did do everything you're "supposed" to do...then you're off the hook (CYA mentality).

    Some still believe that only military and police should have guns...not sure how much of that is a product of their upbringing....or influenced through the military. I do have a tendency to get on my soapbox and discuss the freedoms we are defending...the Constitution we swore to "support and defend"..."without mental reservation or purpose of evasion"--this part I use to have them question themselves as to why they joined and swore an oath. You don't defend the parts you like and the parts you don't.....you defend the entire Constitution. Most don't like to hear that...I don't care.

    So, in light of the former Lt's opinion, I wonder how he feels about the oath he took?
    I was going for "officers tend to be rank-conscious, risk averse micro-managers", myself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Holger View Post
    Odd. My experience in fighter squadrons the past 15 years is the exact opposite. The overwhelming majority of the officers I fly with own guns, from handguns to ARs to shotguns.

    I'm quite concerned about a military officer that speaks in such broad generalizations. Perhaps your branch of service has a problem, or merely it's just the ones you've served with. Or maybe it's just you, I don't know. I'd say your experience is probably extremely limited in scope, and I'd be cautious about applying gross generalizations across the officer corps.
    27 years, entered through the Navy, mostly Army service and currently working for the USAF. The last US Army poll on gun control puts Officers in the 65 percentile of "for" gun control.

    I am currently serving in a joint assignment (as a contractor; I am still active reserve) and when discussing this issue among the 20-some officers I currently work with, only three don't look at me like I have a penis growing from my forehead when I discuss concealed carry.

  11. #26
    Distinguished Member Array ArmyCop's Avatar
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    I'm prior military, combat vet. Civilian "Street Wise" to some extent. I have to say - many in the military have lead sheltered lives in not having much "street" experience - living in areas where you darn better be armed up for family and self protection. Lots of military don't own their own personal firearms and many retire same way - no guns in their household. Depending on their particular job in the military never handle a firearm after basic training except for the yearly qualifications. I'd say this guy has lived one of the sheltered lives. Bases in good areas, living on base more secure than outside...
    For God, Family and Country!

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    “The supposed quietude of a good man allures the ruffian; while on the other hand, arms, like laws, discourage and keep the invader and the plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. The balance of power is the scale of peace. The same balance would be preserved were all the world destitute of arms, for all would be alike; but since some will not, others dare not lay them aside. Horrid mischief would ensue were one half the world deprived of the use of them; the weak would become a prey to the strong.”

    – Thomas Paine
    Those men of that time really knew how to speak! Seems as they where all masters of the language.

  13. #28
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    Nation's gun cancer spreads

    By Patrick Walsh

    After graduating from college, I served four years as an infantry officer in the Army's 25th Infantry Division. I fired everything from 9mm pistols to .50-caliber machine guns, routinely qualifying as "expert" with an M16A2 rifle.
    So does this mean he never actually left Schofield and went in harm's way?

    LMAO because he uses this 4-years as an Infantry officer as if it, in and of itself, entitles him to the world should listen cachet.

  14. #29
    Member Array Holger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post
    27 years, entered through the Navy, mostly Army service and currently working for the USAF. The last US Army poll on gun control puts Officers in the 65 percentile of "for" gun control.

    I am currently serving in a joint assignment (as a contractor; I am still active reserve) and when discussing this issue among the 20-some officers I currently work with, only three don't look at me like I have a penis growing from my forehead when I discuss concealed carry.
    My experience as a 15 yr commissioned officer (both active and full-time Guard) certainly don't mirror yours. I don't want to (and won't) turn this into an Army-USAF peeing contest regarding 2A sentiment, but I am curious why the opinions seem so different. I can think of, off-hand, at least ten O's I work and fly with that have CHPs and another ten that hunt or shoot regularly.

    And we certainly don't hate freedom. Maybe Army officers don't trust the enlisted force with guns. And, with at least TWO former enlisted soldiers on this thread insinuating it's okay to kill officers with whom they disagree politically, maybe I can't blame them!

    You've had quite the career...well done.

  15. #30
    VIP Member Array Brass63's Avatar
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    "To put it another way, Virginia Tech doesn't happen if Seung-Hui Cho is brandishing a sword. Columbine doesn't happen if Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold are wielding Louisville Sluggers. Charles Whitman doesn't kill 14 people at the University of Texas at Austin if he takes up his sniping position armed with a longbow."
    Weren't there several recent incidents in China where men killed and wounded dozens of school children with knives?
    The United States Constitution © 1791. All Rights Reserved.

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