Daytona Beach Police ask for Gun Shop records

This is a discussion on Daytona Beach Police ask for Gun Shop records within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Link Apparently, someone has murdered four women with a .40 caliber S&W Sigma (I'm still not clear on how they know it was a Sigma). ...

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Thread: Daytona Beach Police ask for Gun Shop records

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    Distinguished Member Array SpringerXD's Avatar
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    Daytona Beach Police ask for Gun Shop records

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    Apparently, someone has murdered four women with a .40 caliber S&W Sigma (I'm still not clear on how they know it was a Sigma).

    So now they have a POLL up, asking if the gun shops should release the records.

    I see the potential for a serious can of worms being opened here.
    Last edited by SpringerXD; July 8th, 2010 at 04:18 PM.
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    Police can and have always been legally able to look at records(4473's) to determine who bought what when investigating a case and it's fairly common.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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    The make of the weapon can sometimes be determined by the number of grooves in the rifling, also the width of the grooves and lands that shows on the spent bullets. ex. Marlin microgroove rifles can be identified by the bullets.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Police can and have always been legally able to look at records(4473's) to determine who bought what when investigating a case and it's fairly common.
    My question is does this only apply to individual arms being investigated for a crime or blanket requests? IE, "we want to see whether John Doe bought a .40 S&W Sigma." Or, "we want to see who bought any of the .40 S&W Sigmas sold last year." That would seem to be 2 very different requests.

    I know they can look at the 4473, just wondering what the limitations were regarding how they can search them.
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    It could go both ways. If they have a suspect in mind then they could look to see if they purchased the weapon related to the crime.

    I am not aware of the blanket requests, because in reality very few crimes are solved using records.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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    NRA is reporting that FL state law bars LEOs from asking for such data.
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    NRA is reporting that FL state law bars LEOs from asking for such data.
    Hmmm,interesting.

    The Detectives dont go into pawn shop looking for "hot" guns and then check the paper work to see who sold them?
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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    Quote Originally Posted by paramedic70002 View Post
    NRA is reporting that FL state law bars LEOs from asking for such data.
    Under certain conditions Florida law does prohibit the release of records. I believe the POA for FFL's In Florida is the Department of Law Enforcement, not BATFE.

    Florida State Statue 790.335 (2): PROHIBITIONS No state government agency or local government, special district or other political subdivision or official, agent or employee of such state or other governmental entity or any other person, public or private, shall knowingly or willfully keep or cause to be kept any list, record, or registry of the owners of those firearms.
    (3) EXCEPTIONS The provisions of this section shall not apply to:
    (a) Records of firearms that have been used in committing any crime.
    (b) Records relating to any person who has been convicted of a crime.
    (c) Records of firearms that have been reported stolen...
    (d) Firearms records that must be retained by firearms dealers under Federal law including copies of such records transmitted to law enforcement agencies. However, no state governmental agency or local government, special district or other political subdivision or official, agent or employee of such state or other governmental entity or any other person, private or public, shall accumulate, compile, computerize, or otherwise collect or convert such written records into any form of list, registry, or database for any purpose.

    It goes on for another page but that is the gist of the statute.

    It would seem that the alleged suspect, if there is one, is protected for now.

    Federal Law requires the dealer to keep the records for 20 years but Florida law bars the records from being released. The suspect, if there is one, may not have been formally charged yet and or his attorney is fighting the release of the dealer's ATF bound book and corresponding form 4473.
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    Distinguished Member Array SpringerXD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rglyons View Post
    The make of the weapon can sometimes be determined by the number of grooves in the rifling, also the width of the grooves and lands that shows on the spent bullets. ex. Marlin microgroove rifles can be identified by the bullets.
    Thanks for the info because I never realized that.
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