New knee-jerk legislation resulting from the AZ shooting (MERGED)

This is a discussion on New knee-jerk legislation resulting from the AZ shooting (MERGED) within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by azchevy It is very hypocritical of you. Hypocritical? About what or to whom? I do not share this particular view of magazines ...

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Thread: New knee-jerk legislation resulting from the AZ shooting (MERGED)

  1. #61
    Ex Member Array hamlet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by azchevy View Post
    It is very hypocritical of you.
    Hypocritical? About what or to whom?

    I do not share this particular view of magazines that you have, that does not make me hypocritical, nor is having any view of magazines or any view of anything hypocritical.

    It is possible to own a handgun and not think what some others who own a handgun think -

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  3. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by charlie1826 View Post
    My mistake, thanks Bark'n.
    No Prob... With the number of different forums, and with the difference in wording of thread titles, it's easy to do. I've done it myself on several occasions.

    On such hot topics as this tragic shooting event which has captured the nation, everyone is gonna be posting something about it. So it's worth taking an extra look to make sure you are starting a thread which is going to unique and new and not redundant. I bet we have close to a dozen different topics buzzing around over this one incident.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  4. #63
    Senior Member Array rolyat63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    I know...

    My post was taking your lead, as a rhetorical query, to state the bigger answer to the bigger question; Who is Carolyn McCarthy, what is her motivation and why.

    Honestly I feel for her as a human being.
    I do not at all agree with her stances and positions, but I do as a human and a spouse as well as parent do very much understand her 'feelings' and by that where she has come from.

    Same for the dad of the 9 yr. old killed who yesterday is reported as stating to the press; "Nothing good ever comes from guns.".
    Of course we know this to not be a truth.
    But in kind we all can very much understand the roots of his statement in that moment...And I would bet the keys to my home that he will be aligned at the hip with Carolyn McCarthy and her ilk in the weeks/months/years to come.

    SNIPPED
    - Janq
    Good post!! On the bolded part I am hoping you are wrong. I saw the report where he said that nothing good comes from guns. A little while later on Fox I saw him say no additional regualtions need to be made. I have tried to find a copy of it but can't. It is a sad situation and like you said I could clearly see how he could make the statements, especially that soon. Based on the latter report maybe he has had some time to reflect.
    rolyat63
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  5. #64
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    Fair warning...sell all your barrel shrouds, NOW! Sheeeeeeesh!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmZZV...eature=related
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

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  6. #65
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    No Prob... With the number of different forums, and with the difference in wording of thread titles, it's easy to do. I've done it myself on several occasions.

    On such hot topics as this tragic shooting event which has captured the nation, everyone is gonna be posting something about it. So it's worth taking an extra look to make sure you are starting a thread which is going to unique and new and not redundant. I bet we have close to a dozen different topics buzzing around over this one incident.
    That's the "buzz". Can't wait until I make the next gun show and see the prices. Frankly....I've had my fill of everybody's knee jerk reactions and ado.....betting on the future and worrying about things that should have been taken care of a long time ago. The profiteers, the media mongers, the circling vultures, those who see a chance to thrive under the circumstances at the expense of others. At this point in my life....I'm just plain sick of seeing it happen over and over again.

    "Redundant"
    That's a good word to describe it alright.

  7. #66
    Member Array Cornelius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by varob View Post
    Both. Take these away and it won't mean much to be an American.
    +9000

    I'm very fearful of government officials exploiting tragedies to "fix" problems that are so rare that they don't need fixing. I will not negotiate away the Bill of Rights, especially so that some elitists in our country can feel safer at our expense.
    Ek = 1/2 (m*v^2)

  8. #67
    Member Array Cornelius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    Fair warning...sell all your barrel shrouds, NOW! Sheeeeeeesh!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmZZV...eature=related
    Wow, that's depressing.

    Guess we need to pass the gun control bill to see what's in it, eh?

    At most employers down here on terra firma, anyone that inept at his/her job would be terminated effective immediately. This really conflicts with Rep Clyburn's assertion that "we are held to a higher standard".

    Congress, please read and understand the legislation you try to pass. That's all we ask!
    Ek = 1/2 (m*v^2)

  9. #68
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    Fair warning...sell all your barrel shrouds, NOW! Sheeeeeeesh!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmZZV...eature=related
    That is brilliant. Vote or be for a law banning something that you don't even know what it is.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  10. #69
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamlet View Post
    Hypocritical? About what or to whom?

    I do not share this particular view of magazines that you have, that does not make me hypocritical, nor is having any view of magazines or any view of anything hypocritical.

    It is possible to own a handgun and not think what some others who own a handgun think -
    If you don't get it you never will. When people think it unreasonable for you to own a handgun and try to ban them maybe you will get it. You are indoctrinated by a ny state of mind. My weapons And hicap magazines have never jumped off the shelf and attacked anyone.

  11. #70
    Member Array Cornelius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamlet View Post
    Hypocritical? About what or to whom?

    I do not share this particular view of magazines that you have, that does not make me hypocritical, nor is having any view of magazines or any view of anything hypocritical.

    It is possible to own a handgun and not think what some others who own a handgun think -
    It's hypocritical because it misses the point of having a gun: you're being given the same tool that a criminal could use against you so you at least have a fighting chance.

    In many situations, a high-capacity magazine would be beneficial to fending off multiple attackers. Especially in states bordering the southern border, where militarized cartels (ie- ex-Mexican special forces working for the gangs) have been crossing the border illegally with fully automatic rifles and have attacked homes in groups of 4+ (don't make me dig up the articles, I'm too lazy right now). Should AZ, NM, and TX homeowners be deprived of tools to protect against this because some NYers don't see a reason to own them? Don't you see the logical disparity?

    It'd be a pointless ban. Edit - Actually, not only pointless- but counterproductive.
    Ek = 1/2 (m*v^2)

  12. #71
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    I can name several murder cases, where a "gun" .... was never used. Machete's , strangulation, buried alive, knife, baseball bat, bombs, car, poison and it goes on and on. So, it obviously does not take a gun for someone to commit murder ...... and if every gun in the USA was confiscated, it still wouldn't stop murders in the USA. So , what does it solve ? We have to solve the problems to reduce the likelihood. It has gone on since Abel, and will continue to be a part of society.

    The "gun" however does one thing that none of the other things do, equalizes things so that we can hopefully avoid being one of the victims.
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  13. #72
    VIP Member Array livewire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by azchevy View Post
    My weapons And hicap magazines have never jumped off the shelf and attacked anyone.
    And here I thought that I could train mine to protect me when I was asleep. . . darn.




    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    I can name several murder cases, where a "gun" .... was never used. Machete's , strangulation, buried alive, knife, baseball bat, bombs, car, poison and it goes on and on. So, it obviously does not take a gun for someone to commit murder ...... and if every gun in the USA was confiscated, it still wouldn't stop murders in the USA.

    {snip}

    The "gun" however does one thing that none of the other things do, equalizes things so that we can hopefully avoid being one of the victims.
    +1

    If this nutjob couldn't get to a pistol, he might have used a pipe bomb. Take a second and think what that would have looked like.

    Of course, I'm sure that if he hadn't been sold the gun at a shop, he could have gotten it for the running cost of a crack rock in his area. . .and that close to Mexico, I'm sure that isn't very much at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cornelius View Post
    It's hypocritical because it misses the point of having a gun: you're being given the same tool that a criminal could use against you so you at least have a fighting chance.

    In many situations, a high-capacity magazine would be beneficial to fending off multiple attackers. Especially in states bordering the southern border, where militarized cartels (ie- ex-Mexican special forces working for the gangs) have been crossing the border illegally with fully automatic rifles and have attacked homes in groups of 4+ (don't make me dig up the articles, I'm too lazy right now). Should AZ, NM, and TX homeowners be deprived of tools to protect against this because some NYers don't see a reason to own them? Don't you see the logical disparity?

    It'd be a pointless ban. Edit - Actually, not only pointless- but counterproductive.

    Well said Cornelius,

    Another point: many people that live in environments like described above can have a great advantage to having a pistol caliber carbine. There's something to be said for having a 9mm Glock and an AR-15 chambered in 9mm that takes Glock magazines. In that case, having 15 and 30 round mags that are interchangeable between the two makes sense.

    Also, I mentioned in another thread that 30 round mags are great for range work, less reloading magazines means more shooting, more shooting means more practice, and more practice means more proficiency and minimizing the chance of collateral damage if the next active shooter event has a CCW holder in a position to stop the threat.

    So, hamlet, your point about regulating 30 round magazines was?
    Last edited by livewire; January 11th, 2011 at 02:36 AM. Reason: Merged a couple of posts.

  14. #73
    Ex Member Array hamlet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by azchevy View Post
    If you don't get it you never will. When people think it unreasonable for you to own a handgun and try to ban them maybe you will get it. You are indoctrinated by a ny state of mind. My weapons And hicap magazines have never jumped off the shelf and attacked anyone.
    I don't think I'm the one indoctrinated by a state of mind.

    You do not know my state of mind much less if it's indoctrinated, you know you're thoughts about my state of mind and your belief indoctrination is responsible for it. As far as what you actually know concerning me: you know the sentence I wrote.

    The sentence was a statement confined to 30+ magazines and regulations - for the purpose of a response to the thread topic: That's what you know. The "it" - and that I should get this "it" - and that I don't get this "it" - and that people will take my guns away and that then I will get the "it" - well, you know your beliefs about all that. But they're your beliefs - not me.

    Your thought that your guns and magazines don't jump off the wall and attack people you apparently believe counters my reasons for not thinking it unreasonable to regulate 30+ magazines. But you don't know what those reasons are let alone if guns-not-attacking-people has anything to do with them.

    You know what you know, the rest lies behind your forehead. Not being able to distinguish the difference between the two and equating reality with your own opinions, is a hallmark of indoctrination. It's great positive is the comfortable feeling one is always right. It's great negative is that one isn't - but doesn't know that and has no way of finding out. Indoctrination makes us dumb.

  15. #74
    Ex Member Array hamlet's Avatar
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    [livewire9880]................."So, hamlet, your point about regulating 30 round magazines was?" what you saw 48 hrs ago.

  16. #75
    Ex Member Array hamlet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cornelius View Post
    It's hypocritical because it misses the point of having a gun.................
    Missing the point, even when that's actually the case, is not hypocrisy - it's missing the point.

    My statement "I don't think it's unreasonable to regulate 30+ magazines" does not miss the point of having a gun. It misses YOUR point in having a gun.

    .....which is way past even considering if your point is accurate but instead jumps over any awareness such a question could even exist and instantly lands on the surety your own point in having a gun - is reality. And everyone should therefore have it.

    What's behind our forehead is not the same as what's in front of it.

    The forehead is our friend. To forget it is to become self-righteously stupid.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The OP having started a thread that is not about me, my hypocrisy, not getting "it", or whatever....I'd like his topic to have the focus now, from me at least. I gave my specific view of his topic a ways back, so...............I'm done.

    Best To All - And A Peaceful Year - (And a prayer or silence inside for all these suffering victims and their families.)

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