Times Ledger erroneous gun article

This is a discussion on Times Ledger erroneous gun article within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; This is a letter I just sent to the Times-Ledger: Greetings. Recently, your paper ran an article by Stephen Stirling concerning the seizure of an ...

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Thread: Times Ledger erroneous gun article

  1. #1
    Senior Moderator
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    Times Ledger erroneous gun article

    This is a letter I just sent to the Times-Ledger:

    Greetings.

    Recently, your paper ran an article by Stephen Stirling concerning the seizure of an FN 5.7mm pistol from some criminals in New York.

    This is the article in question:

    Police in Far Rockaway arrested and charged three youths with criminal possession of a weapon Wednesday after a search of their home yielded a powerful type of handgun that has been responsible for more than two-thirds of police officer deaths since 1994, according to the Queens district attorney.

    Police executed a court-authorized raid of the home of William Davis, 21, brother Clarence Davis, 18, and friend Gquan Lloyd, 18, Wednesday morning and found a notoriously powerful Fabrique Nationale 5.7 handgun along with another less-powerful handgun and a bag of cocaine, according to DA Richard Brown. The gun, called a "cop killer" by many for its ability to pierce 48 layers of bullet-proof Kevlar, is the first of its type to be recovered by authorities in New York City.

    "The FN 5.7 is a lethal handgun imported from Belgium and capable of easily penetrating most police vets and plates," Brown said. "While this is the first time that such a deadly weapon has been recovered in New York City, its presence is troubling and makes the job of street cops that much more dangerous."

    Since 1994, 425 of the 616 police officers killed in the line of duty have been killed with a FN 5.7, the DA said.
    The three Far Rockaway residents, all of the Hammel Houses on 81-10 Rockaway Beach Blvd., were arraigned Thursday on charges of criminal possession of a weapon and a controlled substance at Queens Criminal Court in Kew Gardens. If convicted, each could spend up to 15 years in prison.
    This article is laden with a myriad of factual errors, any of which could have been detected with few moment's basic fact checking.

    The FN 5.7mm handgun was introduced to the market in 2004. The claim that 425 police officers have been killed with the 5.7mm should have been an immediate red flag - that would translate to around 2000 officers a year since 2004. A little tiny bit of fact checking - like reading the Brady Campaign piece on the 5.7 (http://www.bradycampaign.org/ler/fnh/faq.php) - would have immediately revealed the problem with the claim.

    Had anyone's interest been piqued by that thunderous error, they might have checked into the armor piercing claims and discovered that the ammunition that is capable of defeating level IIIA body armor is not available to anyone outside of government and law enforcement agency purchases. (http://www.fnhusa.com/contents/tw_57x28mm.htm)

    So this seems to indicate two things:

    1. A little basic fact checking is in order. A grade school child could have come up with the information provided above after a few short minutes on the internet. Perhaps you should hire one to check Stephen's work before publication fro the sake of your own reputation.

    2. Taking a quote from a DA (who apparently knows nothing about this topic) and running it as gospel is a recipe for looking like fools. Something to consider for later.
    It got me thinking - maybe a large part of the anti-gun sentiment being pumped out by the Mayor's office and this DA arises from nothing more that basic ignorance.

    It worked for the Assault Weapons Ban - even today, there are people who think these firearms are "machine guns".

    Certainly proves that this particular media outlet is completely ignorant about firearms - but that won't stop them from running a very negative article about them.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

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  3. #2
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    Poor research Matt and a desire to if possible hype up any gun articles combine to as you say, further misinform the masses and extend or even amplify all the erroneous info out there.

    They do us a great disservice - partly intentionally sometimes but often too thru as you say, shere ignorance - which I find inexcusable.

    Good for you writing in about it - it just might help - we can dream.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

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    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  4. #3
    Distinguished Member Array randytulsa2's Avatar
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    Fools everywhere up there.

    Just one more reason to stay the hell away from that cesspool and hope that global warming isn't completely hooey- maybe NYC will soon go the way of Atlantis.....

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    VIP Member Array Old Chief's Avatar
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    That many mistakes could not have been done unintentionally. The anti gun media publishes only the stories that sound right to them with no regard to the facts at all.

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    VIP Member Array rodc13's Avatar
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    Nice job, Matt.

    We see poor or no research all too often. A lot of times writers simply quote something they've read on the Internet in one blog or another, perpetuating the wild claims someone else has made. You have much, much more credibility if you make sure of your facts before spouting errors at the top of your voice.

    Let's make sure we're doing our homework when we provide rebuttals to pieces like that, as well. We don't want to get into the role of fighting disinformation with more disinformation. Facts are our friends.
    Cheers,
    Rod
    "We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded!" Dick Winters

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    Member Array distortion9's Avatar
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    LOL, great letter Matt. I especially liked your suggestion of hiring a grade school child to check Stephens work....NICE.

    I'm really looking forward to their response.

  8. #7
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    "The FN 5.7 is a lethal handgun imported from Belgium and capable of easily penetrating most police vets and plates," Brown said. "While this is the first time that such a deadly weapon has been recovered in New York City, its presence is troubling and makes the job of street cops that much more dangerous."
    Since 1994, 425 of the 616 police officers killed in the line of duty have been killed with a FN 5.7, the DA said.
    It would be nice if they would just check what they write for continuity. The two quotes above are in the exact relationship that they appear in the story. The first quote says this is the first time such a deadly weapon has been recovered in NYC and that it makes the job of street cops more dangerous. The next paragraph is also a quote from the say DA. In it he says that since 1994 425 officers have been killed with a FN 5.7. Now which is it? Is this the first one or have have been enough to kill 425 officers. We can't have it both ways. The most obvious conclusion is that neither the author of the article nor the DA have the slightest idea of what they are saying or writing.

    Of course with Bloomberg at the helm it is no wonder the DA is a blithering, braindead idiot. But what is the writer's excuse.
    George

    Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein

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