HR822 Passes in House

This is a discussion on HR822 Passes in House within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by xXxplosive Maybe the vote in the Senate can be set aside untill after he leaves............dunno. With 75% of the US population in ...

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  1. #16
    Senior Member Array Maverickx50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xXxplosive View Post
    Maybe the vote in the Senate can be set aside untill after he leaves............dunno.
    With 75% of the US population in favor of gun ownership (at a minimum) and many/most of them in favor of carry rights. Guess I'd prefer to get those guys on their ivory hill to show their hand/position for or against gun rights now, before the elections. Can always bring in back up after the faces change in our legislature and white-house.
    I carry to protect myself and my loved ones from the BG's. Not to solve societies problems. That said: if more carried the deterrent would only have a positive overall effect on those problems.

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  3. #17
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Frankly, I've had a complete reversal of my thoughts on this bill following discussions here... I hope it does get tied up in committee and forgotten... I prefer the Senate bill.

    States which currently have marginal issue laws for their own citizens may elect to revert to Illinois type laws or NYC laws... And the majority populations in those states live in urban areas that control the state legislature (like IL, NY, CA).

    While an ideal democratic/representative republic is supposed to follow the will of the many, it should also protect the rights of the few... Carry permit holders are a tiny minority in the demographics of this country. I don't trust the government to protect my rights...
    All that said....
    It could be worse.
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  4. #18
    VIP Member Array livewire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xXxplosive View Post
    Maybe the vote in the Senate can be set aside untill after he leaves............dunno.
    Depends on who you mean by "he". Obama isn't the one who decides what goes to the Senate floor, that's Harry Reid and the rest of the Senate leadership. Though I would imagine that the President's wishes probably come into play, he doesn't have any direct control over that. That's why he has a Veto pen.
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    Member Array bh153dc's Avatar
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    I am probably the minority with Oakchas. This is a direct infringment of the 10th amendment. Lets look at the state of AL. You submit your CCW permit form. A local Sheriff does a back ground check which takes usually up to 7 days. After that, you pick up your license and are good to go. Now lets look at say, SC. You have to of course allow a background check but you also must attend the SC Conceal Carry Permit class. Eight hours of range time and education. Do you think that the elected officials of SC will feel comfortable with the way that someone procured a AL CCW license. What restriction will states put on out of state licenses. Something like, out of state licenses will ONLY be allowed in the following areas............ And I hate to say this but a Federal CCW license can not be too far away! And anytime the FED GOV'T issues a license they can now increase the fee and the qualifications at will. This is why the 10th amendment is so important! Allow the states to regulate themselves, and contact your state reps if your state does not have a reciprocity agreement with another state that you want to carry in.

    The fix to ALL of this is that open carry be allowed! We already have the right to open carry from the 2nd Amendment. The right to KBA shall not be infringed upon.
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    Member Array 43hertz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xXxplosive View Post
    Maybe the vote in the Senate can be set aside untill after he leaves............dunno.
    IIRC, a bill introduced in one session of congress expires for consideration at the end of that congress.

    Reid will likely pocket this bill and it will die in the Senate. There is no rule that requires it to ever come to a vote or be attached to anything.

    It's probably DOA.

    I don't wan't it to pass for the reasons that Oakchas mentioned above. I'm a states rights guy because the Feds have a way of perverting good intentions.

    If I'm factually wrong on anything here, please feel free to correct me, preferably to with a working link or source.

  7. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by bh153dc View Post
    I am probably the minority with Oakchas. This is a direct infringment of the 10th amendment. Lets look at the state of AL. You submit your CCW permit form. A local Sheriff does a back ground check which takes usually up to 7 days. After that, you pick up your license and are good to go. Now lets look at say, SC. You have to of course allow a background check but you also must attend the SC Conceal Carry Permit class. Eight hours of range time and education. Do you think that the elected officials of SC will feel comfortable with the way that someone procured a AL CCW license. What restriction will states put on out of state licenses. Something like, out of state licenses will ONLY be allowed in the following areas............ And I hate to say this but a Federal CCW license can not be too far away! And anytime the FED GOV'T issues a license they can now increase the fee and the qualifications at will. This is why the 10th amendment is so important! Allow the states to regulate themselves, and contact your state reps if your state does not have a reciprocity agreement with another state that you want to carry in.

    The fix to ALL of this is that open carry be allowed! We already have the right to open carry from the 2nd Amendment. The right to KBA shall not be infringed upon.
    Few states (if any) will bother to do anything about the differences in license requirements state to state or restrict the places out of state license holders may carry v where their own residents may carry.

    Why? Because there is so dang little crime from CHL holders that 6 months after this gets signed (hopefully) the legislators will have moved from their usual bluff and bluster to the next crisis of the moment. There won't be enough of a problem to reach their consciousness.

    It would probably take some true premeditated murders by license holders, or true armed robberies by license holders, before the lazy legislators could move themselves to bother.

    This is going to be off the radar very quickly. The really big issue will be all the law suits from false arrests that happen in NYC, NJ, and by the Port Authority. Maybe some in Maryland too. Like it said in a different thread the NY POST still talks of FOPA as "a little known law." That's where we'll have our problem. Local LEOs who don't know the law and local DAs who think they are smart asses who can get around it, and local judges who will do what they want to do until a higher court slaps their wrist.

    Problems won't come from interfering legislation, IMO.
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    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    I'd really like to believe that Hopyard. If it passes both houses and gets a signature... I hope you're right.
    All that said....
    It could be worse.
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  9. #23
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    I hope they keep HRB822 rolling, It's what the majority of responsible permit holders need to protect their families when traveling out of state.
    Why?? Because at the last second, the Police are minutes away.

  10. #24
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    HB822 is NOT a states rights issue and any appeal to the 10th Amendment means you need to read the 10th Amendment again.

    The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
    The 2nd Amendment, as part of the Constitution, is a prohibition to the states and the SCOTUS has recently reaffirmed that in the McDonald case. I may not agree with how the SCOTUS said the 2A applies but it still does so a Federal bill that reaffirms the 2A is not a states rights issue.
    Hopyard, peckman28 and noway2 like this.

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    The NY law says the NY CCW is valid anywhere in NY except NYC. you need the state licence validated in NYC if you want to carry there. I can't imagine the out of state CCW will be valid in NYC since this bill says you need to abide by state regulations...

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjg1118 View Post
    The NY law says the NY CCW is valid anywhere in NY except NYC. you need the state licence validated in NYC if you want to carry there. I can't imagine the out of state CCW will be valid in NYC since this bill says you need to abide by state regulations...
    You guys from upstate will continue to be out of luck with NYC, but the city won't be able to touch out of state permit holders---not that they won't give it a try. Re-read the statute.

    It is sad, but there will be many people arrested and burned and turned into paupers until NY and NYC get dragged into reality; but dragged they will be; and sooner the better.

    Just out of curiosity, to help gauge how NYC might respond. Have there been any willful violations of LEOSA by NYC? Anyone know? If so, anyone know the outcome when things went through the courts?
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
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  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by 43hertz View Post
    IIRC, a bill introduced in one session of congress expires for consideration at the end of that congress.

    Reid will likely pocket this bill and it will die in the Senate. There is no rule that requires it to ever come to a vote or be attached to anything.

    It's probably DOA.

    I don't wan't it to pass for the reasons that Oakchas mentioned above. I'm a states rights guy because the Feds have a way of perverting good intentions.

    If I'm factually wrong on anything here, please feel free to correct me, preferably to with a working link or source.
    IIRC, Reid gets a lot of support from the NRA. If he sits on this bill, he can expect his opponent to get that support. I realize he has 5 more years on his term, but the NRA has pretty good long-term memory.
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  14. #28
    Senior Member Array Maverickx50's Avatar
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    Looks like this bill is already dead in the Senate. Geez I'm surprized......NOT
    I carry to protect myself and my loved ones from the BG's. Not to solve societies problems. That said: if more carried the deterrent would only have a positive overall effect on those problems.

  15. #29
    VIP Member Array tkruf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverickx50 View Post
    Looks like this bill is already dead in the Senate. Geez I'm surprized......NOT
    Where did you hear that? Link?
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  16. #30
    Senior Member Array Maverickx50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkruf View Post
    Where did you hear that? Link?
    Saw something on it in passing. should have saved the site. It said Reid refused to allow it to be added to something else. I'll see if I can find it again

    I always see stuff after it's OLD news here so I didn't really consider adding the link. sorry. hope I'm wrong.
    I carry to protect myself and my loved ones from the BG's. Not to solve societies problems. That said: if more carried the deterrent would only have a positive overall effect on those problems.

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