Representative Joe Walsh (R-IL) has drafted a bill that would block ...

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Thread: Representative Joe Walsh (R-IL) has drafted a bill that would block ...

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    Representative Joe Walsh (R-IL) has drafted a bill that would block ...


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    Senior Member Array Lotus222's Avatar
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    The UN has become a joke. Can't we just peace-out on those lunatics? I like where Joe's head is, though.

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    Senior Member Array Old Sarge's Avatar
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    I thought a while back that this was one of the underhanded items Obummer was trying to slip to unsuspecting gun owners, by running it thru the UN, to abolish guns in the USA. Hopefully, this'll never happen, but ??????

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    If I had the Secret Service and/or the Diplomatic Security Service protecting me everytime I stepped out the door, I wouldn't need to own guns either.

    But then I'd still want to.
    Retired USAF E-8. Remember: You're being watched!
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    I'm surprised Rahm let him do that.... huh! will wonders never cease?
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    I believe if anybody tries to circumvent the Constitution of the USA by signing a treaty,they should be tried as a traitor and hung in public view,I remember an oath I took when I was sworn into the USAF I swore to uphold the constitution of the USA,and to protect her from all ememies foreign and domestic
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    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
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    It's great to see a congressman who doesn't understand that the Senate has to ratify the treaty or that Clinton forced in a loophole that guarantees each country maintains control of gun laws within their borders. I'd also like to see evidence that Obama wants anything to do with it. He ducked the gun issue like it was plutonium during the last campaign. He's a craven political weasel, he's not going to risk a single percentage point in the polls, particularly on an issue that gains him nothing.

    This is cynical political grandstanding pushing a boogie man. Even if we grant that Obama wants this treaty, does Rep. Walsh think he has any chance of passing his bill with a veto-proof margin?

    Edit: Corrected to reflect that Walsh isn't a senator and I'm freaking blind.
    Last edited by torgo1968; December 2nd, 2011 at 11:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dukalmighty View Post
    I believe if anybody tries to circumvent the Constitution of the USA by signing a treaty,they should be tried as a traitor and hung in public view,I remember an oath I took when I was sworn into the USAF I swore to uphold the constitution of the USA,and to protect her from all ememies foreign and domestic
    I don't remember there being any term limits to that oath either.
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    Get out of the UN !!!!!
    peckman28 likes this.
    " The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." Thomas Jefferson

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    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    It's great to see a congressman who doesn't understand that the Senate has to ratify the treaty or that Clinton forced in a loophole that guarantees each country maintains control of gun laws within their borders. I'd also like to see evidence that Obama wants anything to do with it. He ducked the gun issue like it was plutonium during the last campaign. He's a craven political weasel, he's not going to risk a single percentage point in the polls, particularly on an issue that gains him nothing.

    This is cynical political grandstanding pushing a boogie man. Even if we grant that Obama wants this treaty, does Rep. Walsh think he has any chance of passing his bill with a veto-proof margin?

    Edit: Corrected to reflect that Walsh isn't a senator and I'm freaking blind.



    ^^^^^^^^^^Baloney^^^^^^^^^^^^



    Obama is so anti, your challenge to refute that claim is laughable.

    Anyone half-heartedly paying attention to politics would know it.



    Quote from article:

    President Obama, not surprisingly, welcomes the treaty. He knows that he is unlikely to get such radical proposals through the Congress, so the UN provides him a backdoor way to enact gun control.

    Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is also on board and began pushing for the treaty as soon as she was confirmed in her position. “The United States is prepared to work hard for a strong international standard in this area,” she said.


    This is why Walsh needs a lot of support;
    From article:

    Rep. Walsh highlights for his House colleagues the necessity of his proposal, noting that:

    •It is the constitutional power of Congress to determine United States foreign policy through the ratification of international treaties;
    •U.S. Presidents, by signing on to treaties, have opened the door for international organizations to unilaterally regulate the lives of citizens of the United States;


    •International and transnational organizations force their rules on people of the United States through conventions, multilateral agreements, and nonratified treaties, such as agreements that affect the private ownership of firearms by law-abiding citizens; and

    •United States sovereignty is risked by domestic legal applicability of international treaties and executive agreements that have not been voted on and congressionally adopted through formal processes.
    If you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans.

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    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oneshot View Post
    Obama is so anti, your challenge to refute that claim is laughable.
    I didn't deny that Obama is anti. I denied that he will act on it.

    Anyone half-heartedly paying attention to politics would know it.
    Anyone half-heartedly paying attention to my post would see that I wasn't defending Obama nor claiming that he isn't pro-gun.

    President Obama, not surprisingly, welcomes the treaty. He knows that he is unlikely to get such radical proposals through the Congress, so the UN provides him a backdoor way to enact gun control.
    And senate ratification?

    Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is also on board and began pushing for the treaty as soon as she was confirmed in her position. “The United States is prepared to work hard for a strong international standard in this area,” she said.
    I never said Clinton was against it. I did point out that a provision protecting internal gun laws was forced in by the U.S. delegation.

    Rep. Walsh highlights for his House colleagues the necessity of his proposal, noting that:

    •It is the constitutional power of Congress to determine United States foreign policy through the ratification of international treaties;
    •U.S. Presidents, by signing on to treaties, have opened the door for international organizations to unilaterally regulate the lives of citizens of the United States;


    Bullet point one contradicts bullet point two. If Congress has to ratify treaties (the Senate does), then the president can sign whatever he wants, it will be meaningless legally.

    •International and transnational organizations force their rules on people of the United States through conventions, multilateral agreements, and nonratified treaties, such as agreements that affect the private ownership of firearms by law-abiding citizens; and
    The evidence for this is what?

    More importantly, you ignored the main point of my reply. Obama, no matter how anti he is, isn't going to touch this issue. He's got an uphill battle to get re-elected in the first place, he's not going to throw away swing states pushing for something like this, which he knows would cause a hurricane of controversy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    I didn't deny that Obama is anti. I denied that he will act on it.



    Anyone half-heartedly paying attention to my post would see that I wasn't defending Obama nor claiming that he isn't pro-gun.



    And senate ratification?



    I never said Clinton was against it. I did point out that a provision protecting internal gun laws was forced in by the U.S. delegation.

    [/b]

    Bullet point one contradicts bullet point two. If Congress has to ratify treaties (the Senate does), then the president can sign whatever he wants, it will be meaningless legally.



    The evidence for this is what?

    More importantly, you ignored the main point of my reply. Obama, no matter how anti he is, isn't going to touch this issue. He's got an uphill battle to get re-elected in the first place, he's not going to throw away swing states pushing for something like this, which he knows would cause a hurricane of controversy.


    Your point was that he wouldn't touch the gun rights issues......
    AND that you wanted evidence suggesting he was for it, indicating that perhaps you were of the idea and the notion that he wasn't aniti-gun.

    Sorry I was unable to read that from your wording.
    The evidence shows he doesn't have to show his true anti stance with how they are trying to allow the UN to circumvent our laws.

    If by some chance this ninny manages to get re-elected, he will grab the anti-gun ball and run with it, as he will have nothing to lose.
    If you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans.

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    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oneshot View Post
    Your point was that he wouldn't touch the gun rights issues......
    AND that you wanted evidence suggesting he was for it, indicating that perhaps you were of the idea and the notion that he wasn't aniti-gun.

    Sorry I was unable to read that from your wording.
    No problem, sorry I wasn't clear enough

    The evidence shows he doesn't have to show his true anti stance with how they are trying to allow the UN to circumvent our laws.
    The U.N. can't circumvent our laws, and Obama won't try.

    If by some chance this ninny manages to get re-elected, he will grab the anti-gun ball and run with it, as he will have nothing to lose.
    I said even before he took office that he wouldn't try any major gun legislation in his first term because he didn't want to lose control of Congress (oops), and he wanted to be re-elected. Gun control is a poisonous issue. You can get away with not being pro-gun, but you can't get away with being actively anti. A second term changes things to a certain extent. Obviously he is freer to act on his beliefs and principals *coughhehasnonecough*. However, he still has to deal with the congress that he will be given (which is already situated such that no meaningful gun control can get through and will likely be even more pro-gun after this election) and he'll have one more congressional election to deal with.

    I think there's a higher chance he'd try something in his second term, but I don't think he will. Like all presidents, he's an ego-maniac concerned about his legacy. I think he's going to spend his second trying to pass programs that are relatively popular and non-controversial. Hopefully I'll be right again.

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