A Safer Society with Guns by Jeff Jacoby

This is a discussion on A Safer Society with Guns by Jeff Jacoby within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Decent article: A Safer Society with Guns - Jeff Jacoby...

Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: A Safer Society with Guns by Jeff Jacoby

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array MotorCityGun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    MichiGUN
    Posts
    949

    A Safer Society with Guns by Jeff Jacoby

    “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” - Ben Franklin

    NRA Life

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    Senior Member Array sdprof's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Near the Black Hills of SD
    Posts
    965
    Yep, that article drives home the point.

    While we cannot truly show that more guns in the hands of law abiding citizens is responsible for the decreases in crime, we can show that the wider gun ownership and carrying do NOT cause blood to flow in the streets.

    So, to paraphrase Ronald Reagan, "Mr Government, tear down those gun restricting laws."
    ~~~~~
    The only common sense gun legislation was written about 224 years ago.

    I carry always not because I go places trouble is likely, but because trouble has a habit of not staying in its assigned zone.

  4. #3
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Oshkosh, Wisconsin
    Posts
    1,330
    Most places are starting to allow conceal carry everywhere. If they have a sign saying no weapons of any kind THEY are responsible for the safety of the people inside the building and their insurance shoots through the roof. Lots of people are just realizing this, especially in Wisconsin and are changing their policies. Not completely relevant.. but something to keep in mind if you don't already know. ^^
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  5. #4
    Senior Member Array sdprof's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Near the Black Hills of SD
    Posts
    965
    Quote Originally Posted by Burns View Post
    Most places are starting to allow conceal carry everywhere. If they have a sign saying no weapons of any kind THEY are responsible for the safety of the people inside the building and their insurance shoots through the roof. Lots of people are just realizing this, especially in Wisconsin and are changing their policies. Not completely relevant.. but something to keep in mind if you don't already know. ^^
    In most places, whether the business prohibits weapons or not had zero effect on insurance costs or liability. This was discussed on some forum or another by a real insurance underwriter - it's a non-issue for most, if not all, commercial policies.

    The business is liable for injuries due to their willful acts, and for gross negligence. It would be hard to make a case against them for the actions of a third party.
    ~~~~~
    The only common sense gun legislation was written about 224 years ago.

    I carry always not because I go places trouble is likely, but because trouble has a habit of not staying in its assigned zone.

  6. #5
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Oshkosh, Wisconsin
    Posts
    1,330
    I was told that by a county deputy and law enforcement trainer. If they don't allow citizens to protect themselves they are then responsible for the protection of the people in the building. No offense to your source but I would rather take the advice of an officer in my county.

    also, a lot of businesses first put up signs not allowing any weapons in the buildings. They are now almost all taken down. What other reason would there be other than the insurance cost?
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  7. #6
    Ex Member Array pir8fan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Mooresville, NC
    Posts
    373
    Just one more example of how the antis don't have a clue and their fears are never validated.

  8. #7
    Senior Member Array acepilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    NW WI
    Posts
    556
    Quote Originally Posted by Burns View Post
    Most places are starting to allow conceal carry everywhere. If they have a sign saying no weapons of any kind THEY are responsible for the safety of the people inside the building and their insurance shoots through the roof. Lots of people are just realizing this, especially in Wisconsin and are changing their policies. Not completely relevant.. but something to keep in mind if you don't already know. ^^
    Are you aware of any legal cases proving this? My employer has posted no weapons signs and we have no security guard or electronic pass key entries, etc. I'd like to be able to point them to some case law to see if they could be persuaded to drop the no weapons policy. Probably not likely, but I can dream, can't I?
    Ace
    Gotta Fly or Gonna Die

  9. #8
    Senior Member Array acepilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    NW WI
    Posts
    556
    Quote Originally Posted by Burns View Post
    I was told that by a county deputy and law enforcement trainer. If they don't allow citizens to protect themselves they are then responsible for the protection of the people in the building. No offense to your source but I would rather take the advice of an officer in my county.

    also, a lot of businesses first put up signs not allowing any weapons in the buildings. They are now almost all taken down. What other reason would there be other than the insurance cost?
    I think I would trust a lawyer even more than the county mounty.
    Ace
    Gotta Fly or Gonna Die

  10. #9
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Oshkosh, Wisconsin
    Posts
    1,330
    Quote Originally Posted by acepilot View Post
    Are you aware of any legal cases proving this? My employer has posted no weapons signs and we have no security guard or electronic pass key entries, etc. I'd like to be able to point them to some case law to see if they could be persuaded to drop the no weapons policy. Probably not likely, but I can dream, can't I?
    I don't I was told in person. I would look it up though I'm sure you could find some info on it and try to convince them. (the info was from Winnebago County but I assume it should be the same for all of Wisconsin. Good luck haha. Even with the sign up you can get permission from the owner to carry if they trust you.

    If you have any doubts about it you could indeed contact a lawyer, but this deputy has experience in it and has seen it firsthand so I trust it.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  11. #10
    Member Array DanDglassman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    99
    Quote Originally Posted by sdprof View Post
    In most places, whether the business prohibits weapons or not had zero effect on insurance costs or liability. This was discussed on some forum or another by a real insurance underwriter - it's a non-issue for most, if not all, commercial policies.

    The business is liable for injuries due to their willful acts, and for gross negligence. It would be hard to make a case against them for the actions of a third party.
    My understanding is that there IS case law to support a business being liable. I understand that Wal-mart was successfully sued by a "good samaritan" that intervened in a purse snatching inside a posted (no-gun) Wal-mart. The individual was a CCW carrier forced to leave his weapon in his car. Mr. CCW was injured by Mr. Scumbag and won a suit against Wal-mart. I am told that this is why Wal-mart removed their gun-buster signs.

    Of course, it appears that jurys have it in for Wal-mart. I think their "big corporate image" puts them at a disadvantage in front of jurys.

  12. #11
    Member Array MisterAvis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Bible Belt
    Posts
    224
    A bunch of you guys probably already know John Lott. Here's an hour long presentation, heavy on data, called "More Guns, Less Crime" ... now if the kid would just quit coughing.
    "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every one who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined." -Obligatory Founding Father Quote

  13. #12
    VIP Member Array rammerjammer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Omaha, Nebraska
    Posts
    3,330
    Quote Originally Posted by Burns View Post
    I was told that by a county deputy and law enforcement trainer. If they don't allow citizens to protect themselves they are then responsible for the protection of the people in the building. No offense to your source but I would rather take the advice of an officer in my county.

    also, a lot of businesses first put up signs not allowing any weapons in the buildings. They are now almost all taken down. What other reason would there be other than the insurance cost?
    A cop is the last person I would go to for legal advice.
    "Was there no end to the conspiracy of irrational prejudice against Red Ryder and his peacemaker?"

    Revolvers, “more elegant weapons for a more civilized age.”

  14. #13
    VIP Member
    Array Mike1956's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Marion County, Ohio
    Posts
    10,030
    Quote Originally Posted by Burns View Post
    I was told that by a county deputy and law enforcement trainer. If they don't allow citizens to protect themselves they are then responsible for the protection of the people in the building. No offense to your source but I would rather take the advice of an officer in my county.

    also, a lot of businesses first put up signs not allowing any weapons in the buildings. They are now almost all taken down. What other reason would there be other than the insurance cost?
    Are either one of those fellows tort attorneys?
    "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk."
    Tuco

  15. #14
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Oshkosh, Wisconsin
    Posts
    1,330
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Are either one of those fellows tort attorneys?
    No but like I said, I trust what I was told was the truth (for my county at least). If others choose not to believe it I have no problem with it and welcome anyone to prove me wrong, I'm just sharing what I was told.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  16. #15
    Member Array shooter380's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    182
    OP, thanks for this post of a well written thoughtful article.
    (2Co 11:3 KJV) But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

jacoby guns
,

safer society with guns

,
safer society with more guns
,
societies that don't allow guns
Click on a term to search for related topics.