Fetal homicide law.... Sort of.

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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    Fetal homicide law.... Sort of.

    This is the partial text of the Oklahoma open carry bill currently going through the motions, as it would have been modified by an amendment by Sen. Wilson. be sure to read both amended sections. The new text the "honorable senator" would have added is underlined.

    Mr./Madame President:

    I move to amend House Bill No. 2522, Page 5, Line 2 ½, as follows:

    By adding a new Section 2 and Section 3 to read as follows;
    And by renumbering subsequent section.


    Submitted by:

    _______________________
    Senator Wilson

    Wilson-JM-FA-HB2522
    4/30/2012 8:00 AM




    SECTION 2. AMENDATORY 21 O.S. 2011, Section 1289.25, is amended to read as follows:
    Section 1289.25.
    PHYSICAL OR DEADLY FORCE AGAINST INTRUDER
    A. The Legislature hereby recognizes that the citizens of the State of Oklahoma have a right to expect absolute safety within their own homes or places of business.
    B. A person or an owner, manager or employee of a business is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:
    1. a. The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, occupied vehicle, or a place of business, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against the will of that person from the dwelling, residence, occupied vehicle, or place of business;, and
    b. The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred; or
    2. The person who uses defensive force is a pregnant woman who knew or had reason to believe that her pregnancy would result in harm to herself or the risk of her life and the defensive act is an abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes.
    C. The presumption set forth in subsection B of this section does not apply if:
    1. The person against whom the defensive force is used has the right to be in or is a lawful resident of the dwelling, residence, or vehicle, such as an owner, lessee, or titleholder, and there is not a protective order from domestic violence in effect or a written pretrial supervision order of no contact against that person;
    2. The person or persons sought to be removed are children or grandchildren, or are otherwise in the lawful custody or under the lawful guardianship of, the person against whom the defensive force is used; or
    3. The person who uses defensive force is engaged in an unlawful activity or is using the dwelling, residence, occupied vehicle, or place of business to further an unlawful activity.
    D. A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force, if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.
    E. A person who unlawfully and by force enters or attempts to enter the dwelling, residence, occupied vehicle of another person, or a place of business is presumed to be doing so with the intent to commit an unlawful act involving force or violence.
    F. A person who uses force, as permitted pursuant to the provisions of subsections B and D of this section, is justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action for the use of such force. As used in this subsection, the term “criminal prosecution” includes charging or prosecuting the defendant.
    G. A law enforcement agency may use standard procedures for investigating the use of force, but the law enforcement agency may not arrest the person for using force unless it determines that there is probable cause that the force that was used was unlawful.
    H. The court shall award reasonable attorney fees, court costs, compensation for loss of income, and all expenses incurred by the defendant in defense of any civil action brought by a plaintiff if the court finds that the defendant is immune from prosecution as provided in subsection F of this section.
    I. The provisions of this section and the provisions of the Oklahoma Self-Defense Act shall not be construed to require any person using a pistol pursuant to the provisions of this section to be licensed in any manner.
    J. As used in this section:
    1. “Dwelling” means a building or conveyance of any kind, including any attached porch, whether the building or conveyance is temporary or permanent, mobile or immobile, which has a roof over it, including a tent, and is designed to be occupied by people;
    2. “Residence” means a dwelling in which a person resides either temporarily or permanently or is visiting as an invited guest; and
    3. “Vehicle” means a conveyance of any kind, whether or not motorized, which is designed to transport people or property.
    SECTION 3. AMENDATORY 21 O.S. 2011, Section 711, is amended to read as follows:
    Section 711. Homicide is manslaughter in the first degree in the following cases:
    1. When perpetrated without a design to effect death by a person while engaged in the commission of a misdemeanor.
    2. When perpetrated without a design to effect death, and in a heat of passion, but in a cruel and unusual manner, or by means of a dangerous weapon; unless it is committed under such circumstances as constitute excusable or justifiable homicide.
    3. When perpetrated unnecessarily either while resisting an attempt by the person killed to commit a crime, or after such attempt shall have failed.
    4. When perpetrated by a fetus of a pregnant woman who:
    a. knew or had reason to believe that her pregnancy would result in the risk of her life,
    b. was unable to obtain a lawful abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes under the laws of this state, and
    c. died as a result of her inability to obtain an abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes under the laws of this state.
    So the good Senator would have defined abortion as self-defense, and if the woman was unable to get an abortion charge the now-deceased fetus with manslaughter.

    The things people will do to stop our rights in their tracks...
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    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.

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  3. #2
    Member Array TxRhino's Avatar
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    I hate reading legal stuff like that, especially sense it's not my state. What is the paraphrased version?

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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    The important parts are:

    A person or an owner, manager or employee of a business is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if: [You're legally presumed to have had reasonable fear and justification for using deadly force if:]
    ....
    2. The person who uses defensive force is a pregnant woman who knew or had reason to believe that her pregnancy would result in harm to herself or the risk of her life and the defensive act is an abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes. [If the person using defensive force is pregnant, believes the pregnancy is going to harm her and the "defensive force" is an abortion.]
    Homicide is manslaughter in the first degree in the following cases: [Self-explanatory]
    ....
    4. When perpetrated by a fetus of a pregnant woman who:
    a. knew or had reason to believe that her pregnancy would result in the risk of her life,
    b. was unable to obtain a lawful abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes under the laws of this state, and
    c. died as a result of her inability to obtain an abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes under the laws of this state.
    [If a pregnant woman believed her pregnancy might harm her, she was unable to obtain an abortion for any reason and she dies. Making the fetus guilty of manslaughter in the first degree.]
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    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.

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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    The important parts are:

    A person or an owner, manager or employee of a business is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if: [You're legally presumed to have had reasonable fear and justification for using deadly force if:]
    ....
    2. The person who uses defensive force is a pregnant woman who knew or had reason to believe that her pregnancy would result in harm to herself or the risk of her life and the defensive act is an abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes. [If the person using defensive force is pregnant, believes the pregnancy is going to harm her and the "defensive force" is an abortion.]
    Homicide is manslaughter in the first degree in the following cases: [Self-explanatory]
    ....
    4. When perpetrated by a fetus of a pregnant woman who:
    a. knew or had reason to believe that her pregnancy would result in the risk of her life,
    b. was unable to obtain a lawful abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes under the laws of this state, and
    c. died as a result of her inability to obtain an abortion as defined in Section 1-730 of Title 63 of the Oklahoma Statutes under the laws of this state.
    [If a pregnant woman believed her pregnancy might harm her, she was unable to obtain an abortion for any reason and she dies. Making the fetus guilty of manslaughter in the first degree.]
    And while it may seem to be just a bill about abortion (the politics of which I'd prefer we not get into a discussion regarding), remember this is tacked onto the open carry bill.
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    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.

  6. #5
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    This thread is closed for the following reason:

    9. We have learned from bitter experience that discussions of certain subjects (politics, religion, abortion, sexual orientation, etc) often degenerate quickly. For this reason, we DO NOT allow the discussion of these topics.
    No additional threads will be allowed on the proposed changes.

    And while it may seem to be just a bill about abortion (the politics of which I'd prefer we not get into a discussion regarding), remember this is tacked onto the open carry bill.
    I appreciate the distinction and comment. Discussion will be allowed on the OC Bill, but NOT this particular amendment.
    Richard

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