running of serial number - Page 7

running of serial number

This is a discussion on running of serial number within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Oh really? How so. Please enlighten us....

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Thread: running of serial number

  1. #91
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    Oh really? How so. Please enlighten us.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  2. #92
    Ex Member Array NotMallNinja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Oh really? How so. Please enlighten us.
    I'll sit down and grab some to watch the fireworks begin.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post


    Try that one on the side of the rode and tell us how that works out for ya.
    Don't you worry skippy! Been there done that.
    Nice try.

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotMallNinja View Post
    At best those cases only apply to the following states for the 9th Circuit:

    Alaska
    Arizona
    California
    Guam
    Hawaii
    Idaho
    Montana
    Nevada
    North Marianna Islands
    Oregon
    Washington

    and for the 5th Circuit:

    Louisiana
    Mississippi
    Texas

    And if they hold true there would appear to be a whole lot of accessory makers and firearms makers who are violating the restrictions.
    You should also add the 1st, 4th, 8th, and 10th Circuits too. I forget the particulars but they said pretty much the same thing. A lot of them having never defined "altered" or "obliterated" are basing their decisions on the 9th circuit decision. This is one of those issues that may never reach SCOTUS as all of the circuits I have found so far are in agreement.

    As far as accessories go, not my problem. The Pachmayr Signature grips on my S&W have a nice little hole in the bottom so the serial number is easy to see.
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  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    You should also add the 1st, 4th, 8th, and 10th Circuits too. I forget the particulars but they said pretty much the same thing. A lot of them having never defined "altered" or "obliterated" are basing their decisions on the 9th circuit decision. This is one of those issues that may never reach SCOTUS as all of the circuits I have found so far are in agreement.

    As far as accessories go, not my problem. The Pachmayr Signature grips on my S&W have a nice little hole in the bottom so the serial number is easy to see.
    Assuming the others are following suit with the 9th you are more than likely correct that cert won't be granted. However, circuit splits, as you know, are one of several indicators as to whether or not a cert will be granted.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    The fuss is it is taking up my personal time, has nothing to do with the stop , and has nothing to do with officer safety to run the number. It is a fishing expedition. Do you want to spend time having them check out sn's of a TV that they can read that is sitting on your back seat?
    I don't care. It's trivial. They want to see my receipt and call the store, whatever, I have bigger problems.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    Ok, I'll buy the opinion of the ATF.....If I want a second I will go to Eric Holder. Not arguing just want to see it with my own eyes. Plenty of folks according to your IOI are in violation of law then by utilizing certain grips on different guns. I guess you go your way and I will go mine on this one.

    I don't see how "alter" in any sense of the English language can be confused with "covering"..you intentionally cover your sn when in a holster. Since you have a POC on this issue would yoou mind asking her if you put on different grips and it covers the sn if that is illegal? It would be nice to know.

    As far as the issue at hand, it is her opinion it sounds like. Many times a LEO arrests someone to only find out their opinion on the law or understanding was incorrect. In fact, it seems to happen more so with gun laws than many other laws.
    Officer learns you CCW. Officer asks for your weapon, as they do all the time, for the duration of the stop. When the officer has the weapon in his hand, he has the right to view the serial number to ensure it hasn't been altered. This means he can remove the tape. Once the tape is off the serial number is in "plain view", so the officer is free to record and run it.

    The way to stop cops from running the serial number just for the fun of it is to file a complaint with their department. Tape isn't going to change anything.

  8. #98
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    Tennessee is not a must notify state.

    Sorry about your troubles. Im ganna guess your in Memphis? You dont have to answer that. Just that I find most of MPD to be incredibly rude. My EMS uniform dosnt buy even a shred of proffesional courtesy from them.
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  9. #99
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    Officer learns you CCW. Officer asks for your weapon, as they do all the time, for the duration of the stop. When the officer has the weapon in his hand, he has the right to view the serial number to ensure it hasn't been altered. This means he can remove the tape. Once the tape is off the serial number is in "plain view", so the officer is free to record and run it.

    The way to stop cops from running the serial number just for the fun of it is to file a complaint with their department. Tape isn't going to change anything.
    Most stops do not involve a LEO asking for your weapon. Definitly not all the time. Don't know where you cam up with that. As far as the tape...I was not talking about the LEO removing it. I am disagreeing that it is not illegal as you have stated before. It does not alter or modify the weapon. Stay on track. If you think I am wrong on that dispute it. So far yourself and one other poster as tried to prove it is illegal. The only source that is used to prove it is illegal is the word of an IOI that just came back from dove hunting.

    You said this in regard to what I consider a big deal of a LEO running the sn:
    I don't care. It's trivial. They want to see my receipt and call the store, whatever, I have bigger problems.
    No room for debate there. You don't seem to mind that the 4th amendment means crap. There is no reasonable suspicion to run the sn. The only reason the sn is in plain view is because the LEO seized the weapon under the guise of officer safety. If you don't mind being detained further (which you are) then go for it. Most folks seem to think their time is more important than to have a LEO that is afraid of your gun (seizing it) running its numbers on nothing more than a fishing expedition.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ionracas View Post
    Tennessee is not a must notify state.

    Sorry about your troubles. Im ganna guess your in Memphis? You dont have to answer that. Just that I find most of MPD to be incredibly rude. My EMS uniform dosnt buy even a shred of proffesional courtesy from them.
    "Gee, officer, I'm sorry you got shot five times, but you'll have to wait until I finish treating this other guy's hangnail first."

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  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    And what REASONABLE ARTICULATABLE SUSPICION would he have that the serial number had been tampered with? Using your "they have the right to make sure the serial number hasn't been tampered with" they have the "right" to stop cars and make sure the vin has not been tampered with.

    And by the way- government and their minions DO NOT have rights, they have authority!
    That's not the direction I went. Set aside your dislike for my position on carrying onto private property on other threads and read the words I actually type on this thread.

    Once the car has already been pulled over for other totally unrelated reasons....once the cop has disarmed you, which they regularly do...once the gun is already in the cop's hands for completely unrelated reasons...at that point that cop can remove any tape to view the serial number.

    Tape isn't going to stop anything.

  12. #102
    Ex Member Array NotMallNinja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    Once the car has already been pulled over for other totally unrelated reasons....once the cop has disarmed you, which they regularly do...once the gun is already in the cop's hands for completely unrelated reasons...at that point that cop can remove any tape to view the serial number.

    Tape isn't going to stop anything.
    The discussion in this thread ArmyMan is not what the cops can do it is what they can or cannot legally do. Of course a cop can do pretty much whatever he or she believes their career can handle. It's silly to even debate whether he [b]can[/] do it.

  13. #103
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    That's not the direction I went. Set aside your dislike for my position on carrying onto private property on other threads and read the words I actually type on this thread.

    Once the car has already been pulled over for other totally unrelated reasons....once the cop has disarmed you, which they regularly do...once the gun is already in the cop's hands for completely unrelated reasons...at that point that cop can remove any tape to view the serial number.

    Tape isn't going to stop anything.
    Where are you getting your stats from? Almost every person in this forum has said that the officer dows not disarm them. In fact, it seems very rare that they do.

  14. #104
    Ex Member Array NotMallNinja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    Once the car has already been pulled over for other totally unrelated reasons....once the cop has disarmed you, which they regularly do...once the gun is already in the cop's hands for completely unrelated reasons...at that point that cop can remove any tape to view the serial number.

    Tape isn't going to stop anything.
    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    Where are you getting your stats from? Almost every person in this forum has said that the officer dows not disarm them. In fact, it seems very rare that they do.
    I'm guessing from his fourth point of contact.

  15. #105
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    Where are you getting your stats from? Almost every person in this forum has said that the officer dows not disarm them. In fact, it seems very rare that they do.
    I'm sure that its different everywhere you go. What flys as routine in one locality might not ever be seen in another. Thats the thing, we have 50 different states represented here with 50 different laws. When people argue they are arguing from their locality and some fail to see that its not that way everywhere else.

    Gotta love the internet.
    ArmyMan and JD like this.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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