Cuomo Calls Gun Confiscation "An Option"

This is a discussion on Cuomo Calls Gun Confiscation "An Option" within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Keep it within to forum rules. This is a general warning for this thread. I just had to do some paring/editing. If I need to ...

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Thread: Cuomo Calls Gun Confiscation "An Option"

  1. #31
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    Keep it within to forum rules. This is a general warning for this thread. I just had to do some paring/editing. If I need to do any more, of if there is any further discussion of illegal activities, infractions will be given.
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  3. #32
    VIP Member Array Ghost1958's Avatar
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    I dont think any politician on either side of the fence honestly believes that the government can just sweep across the country taking the publics guns without igniting a firestorm nobody in their right mind could possibly want.
    I could be wrong but I think most of this is propose a lot to get a little like a high capacity mag ban for while and a bid by some liberal politicians to bring attention to themselves in an attempt to pander to the more rabid anti gun nuts in their voter blocks.
    JMO.
    Last edited by Ghost1958; December 26th, 2012 at 11:05 PM. Reason: spelling

  4. #33
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    Re: Cuomo Calls Gun Confiscation "An Option"

    Let them propose the most outrageous things they can. The crazier the better, the crazier it is the less likely they get anything done!!

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  5. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    I thought folks here want to be known as law abiding citizens. Think a little about the harm comments like the above
    do when the anti-folks get a hold of them.
    I have no problem abiding by laws that are constitutional. If you break a law that in unconstitutional, who is in the wrong?

    Honest question, Hop. Where would you draw the line?
    If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

  6. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by DontTreadOnI View Post
    I have no problem abiding by laws that are constitutional. If you break a law that in unconstitutional, who is in the wrong?

    Honest question, Hop. Where would you draw the line?
    Honest answer: Wherever Congress and The Supreme Court draw it. That is their job to decide what the law is, and once they decide we all need to obey. Like it or not. Nowhere in our constitution is a right of rebellion or resistance permitted.
    Civil or criminal resistance to any law can and certainly would be met with overwhelming force, and we have had
    a few pretty good examples of that during my life time. Let's be sensible here. You can't claim to be an upstanding honest law abiding citizen while publicly proclaiming that you would knowing and deliberately violate a law that in your opinion isn't right.

    Molon labe is great sloganeering but if push comes to shove it is certain suicide. Dancing on that slogan doesn't promote
    the rights of gun owners, it harms. And, I say this with very considerable respect for Dave H who uses that in his signature
    line.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
    Andrew Jackson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Honest answer: Wherever Congress and The Supreme Court draw it. That is their job to decide what the law is, and once they decide we all need to obey. Like it or not. Nowhere in our constitution is a right of rebellion or resistance permitted.
    Civil or criminal resistance to any law can and certainly would be met with overwhelming force, and we have had
    a few pretty good examples of that during my life time. Let's be sensible here. You can't claim to be an upstanding honest law abiding citizen while publicly proclaiming that you would knowing and deliberately violate a law that in your opinion isn't right.

    Molon labe is great sloganeering but if push comes to shove it is certain suicide. Dancing on that slogan doesn't promote
    the rights of gun owners, it harms. And, I say this with very considerable respect for Dave H who uses that in his signature
    line.
    I'm betting the law abiders in 1930's Germany had a very similar debate.
    Here is something more recent, which you have probably already seen:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...v=-taU9d26wT4#!
    "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk."
    Tuco

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    Distinguished Member Array RightsEroding's Avatar
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    Hang on. I said that in our society (here in the USA, in the 21st century)
    Hold on there pardner. That is NOT what you said in your response. Head back and re-read it.
    The U.S nor the 21st century do not have a corner on the market when it comes to wars or violence.


    violence is not an acceptable way of solving problems.
    You then posted about 4 international wars, our revolutionary war, and the civil war. The latter 2 are germane to the
    question of suitability of violence to solve problems.
    Can you plainly explain what is acceptable? Your definition?
    War has been acceptable for thousands of years. That does not mean I endorse it or recommend it as a solution.
    It is a fact of life we have wars. It should be the last option, but alas, that is not always true either.

    We could go back even further to biblical wars. Wars initiated AND endorsed AND commanded by God against a people.
    If you want to find fault with God's decision making process, I will not stop you.

    However, both had huge huge costs associated with them.
    Human language fails me in response to your statement above.

    Allow me to answer thus: FREEDOM IS NOT FREE
    I read this inscribed on a very large marble stone at Arlington National Cemetery.

    The freedoms I enjoy as well as those I see eroding were paid for with the ultimate price. I am unwilling to pay again for real estate already owned.

    I wish pretty words and promises by humans would solve problems; I have rarely seen that w/o the threat of a very big stick behind the promises.


    It is still my understanding that our moderators maintain a policy that advocacy of illegal activities is not permissible.
    Where did I ever put forth the notion of any illegal activity? Citing historical truths does not mean I condone or recommend. Your accusation leveled is offensive to me.
    "When those who are governed do too little, those who govern can, and will, do too much." Ronald Reagan

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  9. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Nowhere in our constitution is a right of rebellion or resistance permitted.
    Article the third "...... or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
    Sadly, rebellion and resistance has been redefined by our courts and legislators.
    "When those who are governed do too little, those who govern can, and will, do too much." Ronald Reagan

    Do what you can; then do what you must

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    When firearms possession becomes a crime, we will be criminals.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911_Kimber View Post
    Is this what the U.S. is coming to? Politicians ignoring constitutional rights? Confiscation of private property from lawful citizens? treatment of innocent law abiding citizens as criminals?
    ^^^^^^The polititians would view passing laws ^^^

    against firearms as they did when they passed laws against marijuana, cocaine, and others which at one time were legal, or there were no laws against .
    Now look at all the criminals and felons because of it.
    If you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I'm betting the law abiders in 1930's Germany had a very similar debate.
    Here is something more recent, which you have probably already seen:
    NRA: The Untold Story of Gun Confiscation After Katrina - YouTube!
    Thanks for sharing that video. Let's pray that what happened in N.O. does not portend what will happen nationwide later on.
    HANK
    Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.

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    Let me get this straight. If Congress and the Supreme Court who in reality were never given any powers to infringe on the 2A by the Constitution, say "OK the law now is that nobody has the right to keep and bear arms", that is somehow tolerable legal and constitutional and in your opinion Hopyard all citizens should just give up their guns and thats it???
    " It is sad governments are chief'ed by the double tongues." quote Ten Bears Movie Outlaw Josie Wales

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Honest answer: Wherever Congress and The Supreme Court draw it. That is their job to decide what the law is, and once they decide we all need to obey. Like it or not. Nowhere in our constitution is a right of rebellion or resistance permitted.
    Civil or criminal resistance to any law can and certainly would be met with overwhelming force, and we have had
    a few pretty good examples of that during my life time. Let's be sensible here. You can't claim to be an upstanding honest law abiding citizen while publicly proclaiming that you would knowing and deliberately violate a law that in your opinion isn't right.

    Molon labe is great sloganeering but if push comes to shove it is certain suicide. Dancing on that slogan doesn't promote
    the rights of gun owners, it harms. And, I say this with very considerable respect for Dave H who uses that in his signature
    line.
    Really, what ever they pass ... just sit down and shut up ? That's your answer ?? I would suggest it's a good thing that Martin Luther King & Ghandi didn't listen to you. I can give you a list of similar examples that would fill up a page. We could start with Tinnamen square, White dressed Ladies in Cuba, people jumping the walls to get out of the Soviet Union, and run right down the list. What about Aparthied in South Africa, should they have just shut up and 'accepted it' ?

    I think you are painting with an extremely broad brush. I would also suggest, that this country was founded based upon people standing up and fighting for their liberties, freedoms and rights ..... and you want everyone to stop doing that now ?

    LOL ... in most cases it was never the protestors that were violent ... the violence came from those in power, who were determined to beat those resisting into submission. That's not new.

    Who fought the Police and were arrested during demonstrations ? ..... those in the Tea Party .... or the Occupy Wall Street protestors & or Acorn members beating up those with a different opinion ? Oh, let's not forget the UNION protests in Michigan, and who and what party was supporting that. And , you are telling people here to be 'reasonable' ?

    Hummmm, rather interesting. The World really is "upside down" afterall.

    Personally, I haven't seen any gun folks, anyone in the GOP, Tea Party, nor of the Libertarian party getting violent or out breaking the laws ...... seems like they've been taking their battles to the Congress and to the Courts, thru the NRA & 2nd Amendment foundation, and supporting politicans running for office with conservative or pro-gun views.
    Last edited by Eagleks; May 7th, 2013 at 04:56 AM.
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  14. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Honest answer: Wherever Congress and The Supreme Court draw it. That is their job to decide what the law is, and once they decide we all need to obey. Like it or not. Nowhere in our constitution is a right of rebellion or resistance permitted.
    Civil or criminal resistance to any law can and certainly would be met with overwhelming force, and we have had
    a few pretty good examples of that during my life time. Let's be sensible here. You can't claim to be an upstanding honest law abiding citizen while publicly proclaiming that you would knowing and deliberately violate a law that in your opinion isn't right.

    Molon labe is great sloganeering but if push comes to shove it is certain suicide. Dancing on that slogan doesn't promote
    the rights of gun owners, it harms. And, I say this with very considerable respect for Dave H who uses that in his signature
    line.
    Sorry Hop, just saw this. Let me propose a crude and yes, improbable, scenario for you, but one that could conceivably come about sometime in the future. Let's say Congress decides that all adult males must sodomize a young boy at least once a year and it must be viewed by an official viewer and certified or you lose your rights of citizenship and you get incarcerated. Now let's say that the courts actually blessed this and signed off on this as being constitutional. Would you still be standing there saying that anything Congress does and the court blesses is constitutional and we should just submit to it and not rebel?

    If you say yes, can you please provide the constitutional justification for such acts i.e., where Congress would have its authority to make such an act where the court gets its authority to bless it.

    If you say no, then we found a place where you would actually draw the line, in contravention of your prior statement. Now that we know that you would draw a line, can you please inform us where you would put it?
    Last edited by ksholder; May 7th, 2013 at 07:08 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1911_Kimber View Post
    Is this what the U.S. is coming to? Politicians ignoring constitutional rights? Confiscation of private property from lawful citizens? treatment of innocent law abiding citizens as criminals?
    Yes. It is what we're coming to. The lack of respect and honor is now running deep, and the unthinking belief that an "interest" in doing something qualifies as having the right or authority to do that thing. Many of our temporarily-hired staff think exactly this way, Constitution be damned.

    IMO, it's outright treason when put into action, and it should be dealt with as such (including the 'short drop and sudden stop').
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    ...We could start with Tinnamen square, White dressed Ladies in Cuba, people jumping the walls to get out of the Soviet Union, and run right down the list. What about Aparthied in South Africa, should they have just shut up and 'accepted it' ?
    We don't even have to leave our own country. Just a few days ago (May 4th) was the anniversary of the Kent State shootings. 67 rounds fired by National Guard in a matter of 13 seconds, killing 4 students and wounding 9 others (one permanently paralyzed). All completely unarmed.

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