Maybe it's time to end the American experiment.

This is a discussion on Maybe it's time to end the American experiment. within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; There are so many obvious differences in the different parts of this country that I see it becoming impossible to keep it together. For that ...

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 33
Like Tree22Likes

Thread: Maybe it's time to end the American experiment.

  1. #1
    Ex Member Array gunslingergirl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    162

    Maybe it's time to end the American experiment.

    There are so many obvious differences in the different parts of this country that I see it becoming impossible to keep it together. For that matter why should people and states be held against their will?

    The vast majority of the country is pro gun ownership. The only areas that are anti-gun are the west coast and north eastern states and Washington DC. Why should the rest of us be subjected to their demands? They are also mostly the highest tax states with the least benefits for the working person or small business.

    Maybe it's time to separate into individual states or regional alliances similar to Europe. For example the socialist west coast states are a good match with each other, they have sufficient resources. The western mountain states all pretty much think alike except Nevada is full of Californians now. The midwest pretty much sticks together, except for Illinois which can fend for itself I guess. Chicago is lost any way. The South will always stand, and the Northeast could just be quarantined for the good of the hemisphere, except perhaps Vermont, but maybe we could airlift in supplies like Berlin.

    What do you think?

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    VIP Member
    Array Echo_Four's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Land of the mostly free
    Posts
    2,628
    I am literally laughing out loud thinking about a Vermont Air Lift.
    FreeFalling, mano3 and myrkr like this.
    "The only people I like besides my wife and children are Marines."
    - Lt. Col. Oliver North

  4. #3
    VIP Member Array Crowman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    West Allis WI
    Posts
    2,761
    Nice thoughts......

    I am not a legal scholar so I will just pose the question. Is it possible that state rights could trump some if not all the federal gun laws. As I recall the Supreme Court recently ruled on the Arizona law issue of illegal immigrants. If I recall right some was ruled unconstitutional but the rest fell under state rights. So if states make law to the contrary federal laws that do not conflict with the 2nd amendment wouldn't that constitutionally acceptable. Yes -- No -- Maybe???
    "One of the greatest delusions in the world is the hope that the evils in this world are to be cured by legislation."
    --Thomas B. Reed, American Attorney

    Second Amendment -- Established December 15, 1791 and slowly eroded ever since What happened to "..... shall not be infringed."

  5. #4
    VIP Member
    Array Echo_Four's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Land of the mostly free
    Posts
    2,628
    As long as the gun is involved in interstate commerce Congress will claim they can regulate it and would likely win over a state's right claim. Now if a gun was wholly made in WI, you used ammo made in WI with components that were made in WI, then your state may be able to say that the feds can't regulate that gun, but that's about as far as that will work.
    "The only people I like besides my wife and children are Marines."
    - Lt. Col. Oliver North

  6. #5
    VIP Member Array Hiram25's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Wyoming, DE
    Posts
    10,781
    My personal opinion, we need to do away with the Electoral College, so every vote in this country is equal to every other vote. Why should votes in some states be worth more than those in others?

    As per the OP, don't know if we would ever get there, but it's an interesting scenario!
    sixgun, tclance, OldCorps and 4 others like this.
    Hiram25
    You can educate ignorance, you can't fix stupid
    Retired DE Trooper, SA XD40 SC, S&W 2" Airweight
    dukalmighty & Pure Kustom Black Ops Pro "Trooper" Holsters, DE CCDW and LEOSA Permits, Vietnam Vet 68-69 Pleiku

  7. #6
    Senior Member Array Caertaker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    SE Michigan
    Posts
    1,001
    As I understand it the Electoral College was conceived and implemented to guard against the tyranny of democracy. It is more important than ever now that people have taken to voting themselves a share of the national treasury. My personal opinion is you can tinker and wring your hands and gnash your teeth as much as you want but its over and has been for quite some time. People are just now waking up to the fact.

    Quotes from Benjamin Franklin:
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."

    "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."

    "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty."
    "I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power, than by violent and sudden usurpations” – James Madison 1788

  8. #7
    Member Array billstaf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    200
    Hey, don't be so quick to write off entire sections of the country. It is true that there are a lot of libs out here on the west coast, but it is equally true that there are a whole bunch of us out here who also like our guns and intend to keep them. I would expect all of you folks in fly-over country to support our gun rights too. Drawing artificial lines won't get you anywhere.
    soonershoote likes this.
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

  9. #8
    Senior Member Array CanuckQue's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Maritimes Canada
    Posts
    1,041
    If it's a set of rights that you truly believe in, then wouldn't it make sense to politically fight to keep people under that umbrella?
    Mental illness incidents are used to threaten gun rights.
    The March of Dimes headed off the Universal Iron Lung coverage debate, just sayin'.
    Alternately, for those with a toolshed and ideas.


  10. #9
    MJK
    MJK is online now
    Senior Member Array MJK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    St. Louis
    Posts
    803
    This idea is neither realistic nor practical. The War Between the States was fought between 1861 and 1865 at the cost of over 600,000 lives to ensure our republic remained united. I believe it has been well-established that secession is not a viable path in these United States. I'm in A. Lincoln's corner on this one.
    [T]he unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people. ---Tenche Coxe, The Pennsylvania Gazette, Feb. 20, 1788.

  11. #10
    VIP Member Array Sticks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    3,407
    Quote Originally Posted by gunslingergirl View Post
    ...Maybe it's time to separate into individual states or regional alliances similar to Europe. For example the socialist west coast states are a good match with each other, they have sufficient resources. The western mountain states all pretty much think alike except Nevada is full of Californians now. The midwest pretty much sticks together, except for Illinois which can fend for itself I guess. Chicago is lost any way. The South will always stand, and the Northeast could just be quarantined for the good of the hemisphere, except perhaps Vermont, but maybe we could airlift in supplies like Berlin.

    What do you think?
    I daydreamed a like scenario back in pre 2008 along the same lines. End result was IIRC the original 13 (East coast) a rather large no-mans-land, then the rest of the country, after years of fighting and mass evacuations on both sides trying to get to either side before the walls went up. And the rest of the world watched in morbid fascination as the USA imploded...and at this point, laughing and applauding the whole time as the self proclaimed world police went out of business. Made for good fiction.
    miller_man likes this.
    Sticks

    Grasseater // Grass~eat~er noun, often attributive \ˈgras-ē-tər\
    A person who is incapable of independent thought; a person who is herd animal-like in behavior; one who cannot distinguish between right and wrong; a foolish person.
    See also Sheep

  12. #11
    Senior Member Array RightsEroding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    963
    Quote Originally Posted by gunslingergirl View Post
    For that matter why should people and states be held against their will?
    Sounds nice, but alas, the idea presents from a faulty notion that the American people are represented and that those reps do the peoples bidding.
    It was once close to this, but no longer.

    Maybe it's time to separate into individual states or regional alliances similar to Europe. For example the socialist west coast states are a good match with each other, they have sufficient resources.
    A portion of the USSR tried this...Didn't exactly work out too well.

    You can't have it both ways...(i.e) Ok with federal aid but NO to anything the state may not like.
    We are already deeply divided as a nation; this is precisely what the socialist agenda wanted, and believe it or not, they have made strong headway.
    The entitlements continue for every group under the sun as well as forced national care; this too is exactly (Why) we can not get out from under the fist
    of this current regime we are under.

    ..and anything we do should never be compared with anyone else...especially Europe!
    "When those who are governed do too little, those who govern can, and will, do too much." Ronald Reagan

    Do what you can; then do what you must

  13. #12
    Distinguished Member Array Exacto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    1,489
    All 50 states have petitions to seceed already with enough signatures to send to the dictator now. So there is an undercurrent of division and it's growing.
    Doodle likes this.
    Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunder bolt...... Sun Tzu.

    The supreme art of war is to defeat the enemy without fighting........ Sun Tzu.

  14. #13
    Senior Member Array CanuckQue's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Maritimes Canada
    Posts
    1,041
    In Canada, we have the Quebec Bloc trying to secede, too. We've much different cultures (if we just look at the Bloc advocates), but economically we're much, much more advantaged by not splitting.
    Mental illness incidents are used to threaten gun rights.
    The March of Dimes headed off the Universal Iron Lung coverage debate, just sayin'.
    Alternately, for those with a toolshed and ideas.


  15. #14
    VIP Member Array Sticks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    3,407
    It would be interesting to have border checkpoints at every state line. Passports, papers, visa's, trade agreements...
    Sticks

    Grasseater // Grass~eat~er noun, often attributive \ˈgras-ē-tər\
    A person who is incapable of independent thought; a person who is herd animal-like in behavior; one who cannot distinguish between right and wrong; a foolish person.
    See also Sheep

  16. #15
    Senior Member Array palmgopher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    tennessee
    Posts
    722
    these politians no longer care what the voters want. they go by what they think is better for us. we are nothing but subjects that put them in office if they feed us enough crap. once in office they do just enough to keep us from voting for the other guy and do what they want the rest of the time. oh yeah and the scare the public into doing what we want is working great for the dems. if you vote for republicans they will take away all your free stuff so vote for us and we will give you more free stuff. sad!!!!

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

maybe it's the guns

,

the second amendment and states rights: a thought experiment

Click on a term to search for related topics.