California and the Second Amendment

California and the Second Amendment

This is a discussion on California and the Second Amendment within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; So I was reading this article on Fox about some of the stuff that the state reps are proposing and there's an analist that basically ...

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    California and the Second Amendment

    So I was reading this article on Fox about some of the stuff that the state reps are proposing and there's an analist that basically states that because the Libs have a "super-majority" in the state Congress, they expect anything that gets proposed to pass... To ad insult to injury, even the Republican minority are out there trying to pass new firearm restrictions.

    So here's my thought, and I've said this before on other threads, but I'd like to hear what you folks think. If, let's say, California leads the charge in squeezing the life out of the Second Amendment, will the residents who don't follow the same political mindset pull an Atlas Shrugged and start to flee the state, or will people put their principles behind their jobs and homes and consider leaving more trouble than their rights are worth?

    Mind you, California has some of the strictest gun control laws in the country already, so if they are able to pass even a good portion of this crazy stuff, legal gun ownership will be, in all practical terms, non-existant, and if they don't try succceed in actually taking them away from current owners they'll restrict, tax and register ammunition to the point that they might as well take the firearms.

    Here's the story, for those interested:

    California testing limits of gun-control rules in wake of Newtown shooting | Fox News
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    Distinguished Member Array RightsEroding's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TX expat View Post
    will the residents who don't follow the same political mindset pull an Atlas Shrugged and start to flee the state, or will people put their principles behind their jobs and homes and consider leaving more trouble than their rights are worth?
    California's population flat-lining | california, population, migration - Opinion - The Orange County Register

    Calif residents don't need the excuse of further gun limitations to flee the state.
    "When those who are governed do too little, those who govern can, and will, do too much." Ronald Reagan

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    Member Array John Luttrel's Avatar
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    Well, I'll say this much about it; most of us that live in other states look at it and feel that the citizens of Kali, deserve every bit of enslavement they get, as they are the ones who continually vote this idiots into office. It's not the politicians fault, they had these extremist views before they were voted in, it's the people's fault; you're only chances at fixing it is to challenge everything they do that's unconstitutional in court, vote or move away.
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    I live in California and my wife and I had already made the decision to leave prior to the latest furor. This used to be a great place to live - great weather, beautiful scenery, nice ocean. Now, we are pretty fed up with the high taxes, lack of services, ridiculous laws, etc. The firearms atmosphere here is terrible and it is only going to get worse. This is an urbanized state and most people have no contact with firearms, hunting, the outdoors, etc. We are out of here as soon as we can.
    TX expat and PAPADALE1 like this.

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    With kali being hell bent on turning into a communist state maybe we should look into bartering them away to china in exchange for debt forgiveness. Of course we would have to get our members out of there first and throw some people back in, but I think our children will thank us for unsaddling the debt from them.
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    Judging by past behavior, unless they are ready to retire, very few will relocate solely over restrictive gun laws. Of course, in the past California's economy was booming and so for many, moving to another state would also mean they would take an economic hit. In this economic environment, and with the current popularity of firearms, I think more may be willing to move but you have to set that against the upheaval and expense of relocating, leaving all your friends behind, etc. Inertia and the status quo is always the path of least resistance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RightsEroding View Post
    California's population flat-lining | california, population, migration - Opinion - The Orange County Register

    Calif residents don't need the excuse of further gun limitations to flee the state.
    I totally agree, but look how many pro-2A people are still there. The state is not all liberals. 4 million California voters voted for Romney and while I'm not going to equate voting for Romney = pro-2A, I think it's fairly safe to assume that a healthy minority of them do. So even if you say 25%, that's still a million people. They may be flatlining and unhappy about that, but if conservative minded people started leaving en masse, and taking their businesses and tax dollars with them, the state would have a much bigger problem than gun violence.
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Luttrel View Post
    Well, I'll say this much about it; most of us that live in other states look at it and feel that the citizens of Kali, deserve every bit of enslavement they get, as they are the ones who continually vote this idiots into office. It's not the politicians fault, they had these extremist views before they were voted in, it's the people's fault; you're only chances at fixing it is to challenge everything they do that's unconstitutional in court, vote or move away.
    Well, to be fair, they may vote against those extreme liberals every chance they get; they are just outvoted. However, I basically do agree with you. If you live there, and your taxes support that state, then you are, by default, part of the problem regardless.

    I do understand the costs and all the complications that make moving away from a state an extreme measure, but I've also lived (as an adult) in a number of states myself, so I realize that if you want it, you will find a way to make it happen.
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    Member Array blanco64's Avatar
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    I moved out of California for all of those reasons and more. From what I understand, California has had a net negative population growth for years. I've read about numerous companies moving out because of tax, labor, environmental, etc. laws. From a financial standpoint it's one of the worst run states in the nation, and they continue to want to run the rest of the country that way.

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    Thumbs down California Disaster

    California has many problems, most of the major ones are fiscal. The California Constitution was written in an age of Populist and Agrarian backlash against those darn money-changers, and as a result of that, and some other structural problems, California is pretty much doomed. They allow the nonsensical Referendums coupled with an inability to raise meaningful revenue (Proposition 13) and are hence trapped in Dante's Fiscal Inferno.

    The Fiscal problems pretty much hid themselves during the "Golden Age" because of Capitalist driven growth, and now, as the economies slow, the pain is exacerbated. That is triggering the death spiral in the state, and the overhang of Public Pensions and Debt will turn California into a Black-Hole for Money. California is one of the 11 states highlighted as a state where workers are out-numbered by non-workers, and that will NOT improve. As a matter of interest, Illinois is one of those 11 too.

    Hold onto your wallets, because when the Public Pensions in California start failing along with Municipal and State Bonds, they ARE going to go to Washington D.C. and beg, grovel and the like.......and hope that Washington DC does NOT cover that fiscal mess or the rest of the Country is doomed likewise. The other 10 or so will line up............

    The gun control laws in California are similar to the Fiscal mess. They'll make it harder and harder, and try to drive the 2A out of business...........Watch the crime rates then. That will really make California the "Golden State".

    California has almost achieved zero population growth. According to the California Department of Finance, state population has stagnated at sub-1-percent rates for an unprecedented seven consecutive years. The slow growth was a result of negative domestic migration, declining international migration and declining births. Unless we fix our education system and create opportunities for everyone, California is entering a death spiral.
    The families leaving California are the heart of the community and the workforce – upwardly mobile young families. As the middle disappears, the population adopts two modes: an older, wealthier population and a younger, poorer population.
    Two populations, one wealthy and one poor, living side-by-side with limited upward mobility for the poorer population is a prescription for problems, especially if there is a racial component.
    Many of the California Escapees come to Colorado due to our quality of life, and interestingly enough, many of them want to "change" Colorado to what they left.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock and Glock View Post

    The gun control laws in California are similar to the Fiscal mess. They'll make it harder and harder, and try to drive the 2A out of business...........Watch the crime rates then. That will really make California the "Golden State".

    Many of the California Escapees come to Colorado due to our quality of life, and interestingly enough, many of them want to "change" Colorado to what they left.
    You are absolutely correct. We have the most lame firearms laws in the country; such as the high cap magazine restrictions, the "bullet button" law for the AR15, etc. CCWs are almost impossible to get unless you live in a county with a population under 500,000.

    And, yes I think the same thing you see in Colorado is happening in Oregon and Washington. That's why we are now considering Utah, although we have some concerns regarding social acceptance there since we are not Mormons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock and Glock View Post
    California has many problems, most of the major ones are fiscal. The California Constitution was written in an age of Populist and Agrarian backlash against those darn money-changers, and as a result of that, and some other structural problems, California is pretty much doomed. They allow the nonsensical Referendums coupled with an inability to raise meaningful revenue (Proposition 13) and are hence trapped in Dante's Fiscal Inferno.

    The Fiscal problems pretty much hid themselves during the "Golden Age" because of Capitalist driven growth, and now, as the economies slow, the pain is exacerbated. That is triggering the death spiral in the state, and the overhang of Public Pensions and Debt will turn California into a Black-Hole for Money. California is one of the 11 states highlighted as a state where workers are out-numbered by non-workers, and that will NOT improve. As a matter of interest, Illinois is one of those 11 too.

    Hold onto your wallets, because when the Public Pensions in California start failing along with Municipal and State Bonds, they ARE going to go to Washington D.C. and beg, grovel and the like.......and hope that Washington DC does NOT cover that fiscal mess or the rest of the Country is doomed likewise. The other 10 or so will line up............

    The gun control laws in California are similar to the Fiscal mess. They'll make it harder and harder, and try to drive the 2A out of business...........Watch the crime rates then. That will really make California the "Golden State".







    Many of the California Escapees come to Colorado due to our quality of life, and interestingly enough, many of them want to "change" Colorado to what they left.
    Great observations on their fiscal problems. I am always amused by all the liberal strongholds that have the tightest reigns on gun ownership are almost without exception the worst examples of violent crime run rampant.

    Personally, I'd never live in any of those places and even our vacation dollars don't get spent there. Sadly, Colorado is one of my favorite states and if they keep heading down that path, I'm going to have to put them on the 'no visit' list as well. That will not make me happy...
    blanco64 likes this.
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    Distinguished Member Array zamboni's Avatar
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    I don't know about people moving out of California.

    angry+black+bear+%u0025281%29.jpg

    But once word gets out to the carnivorous wildlife community they will be moving in looking for food.

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    People are already fleeing the state. Businesses are leaving because of tax burdens and unreasonable environmental regs. I hope the state can be saved, it is already on life support.
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    Dont be so quick to write off all the residents of California. Many of us are conservative patriots, we just happen to be surrounded by liberal bastions like SF/LA. Make no mistake, In our current national political climate what you see in CA can be in your backyard too if we don't stand and fight together. I am all for states rights and one day California may well indeed run me, another producer of society out of what could be such a great state.

    At this point for me its not as bad as it sounds to live here. The area I live is very conservative. My sheriff/PD issues CCW's to ALL law abiding citizens. I saw the writing on the wall with "gun control" and knew even if it didn't go through on a national level I would be screwed on a state level. I have all the guns and ammo I will need for the rest of my life as I spent over $30,000 in guns/ammo before the "panic" set in. I have over 70,000 rounds of various caliber's so i'm really not worried about any of there "control".

    Now the fiscal situation is something I have no control over. I can foresee a day when my taxes can no longer pay for the basic public services my family depends on. Liberalism always FAILS. When it gets to the point that public services such as education, police, and fire are impacted to the point of detriment of my family I will then leave. As of now i'm surrounded by family and have a job making six figures so ill batten down the hatches and ride the storm out.

    My advice is keep a vigilant watch out in your state. What you see here can be coming to you sooner than you think. Be prepared for the worst.

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