"I will take off my uniform and stand with freedom" - Page 2

"I will take off my uniform and stand with freedom"

This is a discussion on "I will take off my uniform and stand with freedom" within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by linuss Any law that is unconstitutional is therefor not a law, and unenforceable, per the Supreme Court. Law comes out tomorrow saying ...

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Thread: "I will take off my uniform and stand with freedom"

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by linuss View Post
    Any law that is unconstitutional is therefor not a law, and unenforceable, per the Supreme Court.

    Law comes out tomorrow saying the government can take someones property without due process, guess what? That's unconstitutional. Due process is required as already stated.
    The point is being missed. There are three entities which have the legal authority to determine if a law is
    constitutional. These are Congress when it passes a law-- as all laws passed by Congress are presumptively
    Constitutional; The President when he decides to veto a law because he feels it is not constitutional; and the
    various courts all across the country, ultimately our Supreme Court.

    The rest of us can grouse, chat, opine, type to the net, but it means nothing in the scheme of things as it is not a determination
    we are given to make; at least not within our present constitutional framework and 200 + years of jurisprudence.

    You point to a hypothetical in which you say due process is denied. Who exactly is it that determines
    what due process is, and when it has been denied. It isn't you and me. It is our judges and justices at all
    levels.

    I've posted earlier that I thought the new NY law may be unconstitutional but on grounds entirely different
    from 2A. In fact, I think objections to NY's law on 2A are hopeless. The grounds I am concerned with
    is the apparent uncompensated "taking" by making the possession of something once lawfully owned, presently
    unlawful, and not compensating for the money spent on whatever: high cap, AR, AK, XD9M. In any case,
    my opinion on the matter doesn't count. We have a judiciary for that determination, and we have a Plaintiff's Bar
    to bring forward such matters, and in a worst case scenario we have a criminal defense Bar to raise such issues.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
    Andrew Jackson


  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Well maybe he shouldn't enforce eviction notices because they are unpopular and somewhere somehow
    someone has decided for himself that they aren't constitutional by some convoluted form of reasoning.

    He may be playing to a base that elects him, but he is not upholding his side of the bargain
    with respect to following the law as he is encouraging future law breaking, and that is unseemly
    when it comes from any LEO for any reason.

    “Public safety professionals serving in the executive branch do not have the constitutional authority, responsibility, and in most cases, the credentials to determine the constitutionality of any issue,” Arapahoe County Sheriff Grayson Robinson said in a statement. Law enforcement officials should leave it to the courts to decide whether a law is constitutional or not."

    Colorado sheriff blasts colleagues over refusal to enforce gun laws - U.S. News
    Totally expected from you!
    TheConcealer and KoolBreeze like this.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Why is that you use throw that word ANARCHY around so much? It aint happening.

    I just had a lenthy conversation with our DA yesterday after he taught the legal portion of the CHL class in which we had 45 students.
    We talked about this very thing.

    He is totally on board with not enforcing UnConstitutional laws...ecpecially those that infringe upon the Second Amendment. He wont do it, our Judges wont do it, and our LEO's wont do it.
    I see living here as much more peacable and safter then say, Chicago or L.A.

    I haven't seen any anarchy yet, and it certainly wont come from a Sheriff not enforcing some bogus federal law. Go live for a week in the slums of Detroit and then come tell me about anarchy.
    Exactly.

    This is peaceful, civil disobedience of anti second amendment legislation. Or its a higher obedience to the Second Amendment as written and as intended. All law flows from the foundational principles in the US Constitution and Bill of Rights.

    Stop the dramatic, histrionic argumentation of going to extremes like "anarchy" or were headed to the second coming of The Road Warrior.
    cmdrdredd likes this.
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  4. #19
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    Liberals crack me up. They get pissy when police want to enforce a federal law (immigration), get pissy when police DON'T want to enforce federal laws (gun control) and applaud when police refuse to enforce federal law (federal drug laws vs state drug laws)

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Well maybe he shouldn't enforce eviction notices because they are unpopular and somewhere somehow
    someone has decided for himself that they aren't constitutional by some convoluted form of reasoning.

    He may be playing to a base that elects him, but he is not upholding his side of the bargain
    with respect to following the law as he is encouraging future law breaking, and that is unseemly
    when it comes from any LEO for any reason.

    “Public safety professionals serving in the executive branch do not have the constitutional authority, responsibility, and in most cases, the credentials to determine the constitutionality of any issue,” Arapahoe County Sheriff Grayson Robinson said in a statement. Law enforcement officials should leave it to the courts to decide whether a law is constitutional or not."

    Colorado sheriff blasts colleagues over refusal to enforce gun laws - U.S. News
    Are you serious here?

    Are you saying you are so far to the left that you can't tell the difference between someone who is not paying their rent or mortgage and they are served an eviction notice and a law that basically is asking law enforcement to disarm the people?
    F350 and J.Thompson like this.
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  6. #21
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    Seems to me there's something even more fundamental. Our concept of government is based largely on voluntary compliance with laws which citizens broadly accept. It isn't a police state (yet). If congress were to pass laws which were WIDELY perceived as illegitimate and/or unjust, there would likely be widespread non-compliance (like during Prohibition). The fastest way to invite anarchy is to undermine public perceptions of legitimacy.

    PC
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  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Well maybe he shouldn't enforce eviction notices because they are unpopular and somewhere somehow
    someone has decided for himself that they aren't constitutional by some convoluted form of reasoning.

    He may be playing to a base that elects him, but he is not upholding his side of the bargain
    with respect to following the law as he is encouraging future law breaking, and that is unseemly
    when it comes from any LEO for any reason.

    “Public safety professionals serving in the executive branch do not have the constitutional authority, responsibility, and in most cases, the credentials to determine the constitutionality of any issue,” Arapahoe County Sheriff Grayson Robinson said in a statement. Law enforcement officials should leave it to the courts to decide whether a law is constitutional or not."

    Colorado sheriff blasts colleagues over refusal to enforce gun laws - U.S. News
    So LEO are just mindless drones operating on orders? Doesn't sound like a country I want to live in! Sounds like Hitler and the nazis. Don't think...just do as I say.
    cmdrdredd, F350 and mg27 like this.

  8. #23
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    Re: "I will take off my uniform and stand with freedom"

    Not to thread jack but I must clarify a grossly misused word. Anarchy means self governance NOT lawlessness.

    www.getcorded.com

  9. #24
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    The Declaration of Independence (DOI) did a pretty good job of defining the consent of the governed as a concept. The Constitution codified the consent of the governed and licensed the federal government to perform certain tasks.

    The states have done a lousy job of controlling the Feds - an entity which they created and limited. The DOI also did layout the duty of citizens when the government oversteps its bounds. I hope we don't get to that stage, but it appears to be pretty close.
    J.Thompson and azretired like this.
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    Now that is what I am talking about! If I ever meet this man I will shake his hand and say thank you. Not to many Cops like him these days it dont seem. The next Civil War is Brewing folks:)!
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  11. #26
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    Originally Posted by Hopyard
    Well maybe he shouldn't enforce eviction notices because they are unpopular and somewhere somehow
    someone has decided for himself that they aren't constitutional by some convoluted form of reasoning.

    He may be playing to a base that elects him, but he is not upholding his side of the bargain
    with respect to following the law as he is encouraging future law breaking, and that is unseemly
    when it comes from any LEO for any reason.

    “Public safety professionals serving in the executive branch do not have the constitutional authority, responsibility, and in most cases, the credentials to determine the constitutionality of any issue,” Arapahoe County Sheriff Grayson Robinson said in a statement. Law enforcement officials should leave it to the courts to decide whether a law is constitutional or not."

    Quote Originally Posted by cmdrdredd View Post
    Are you serious here?

    Are you saying you are so far to the left that you can't tell the difference between someone who is not paying their rent or mortgage and they are served an eviction notice and a law that basically is asking law enforcement to disarm the people?
    AND he doesn't seem to care when his lord, master and savior ignores CONSTITUTIONAL LAW like refusing to enforce DOMA, granting defacto amnesty to illegals; making non-recess recess federal appointments without consent of the Senate yada yada yada..........

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by ksholder View Post
    The states have done a lousy job of controlling the Feds - an entity which they created and limited. The DOI also did layout the duty of citizens when the government oversteps its bounds. I hope we don't get to that stage, but it appears to be pretty close.
    Sadly that happened when someone went "Oh wait, federal trumps state!" and began applying to to darn near everything under the guise of things like the 'commerce clause'.


    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    making non-recess recess federal appointments without consent of the Senate yada yada yada..........
    Luckily a federal court deemed that unconstitutional the other day... now can we impeach him for going against the constitution per a federal court?



    Then again, I don't want Biden in charge. Shoot, we're screwed either way...

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Well maybe he shouldn't enforce eviction notices because they are unpopular and somewhere somehow
    someone has decided for himself that they aren't constitutional by some convoluted form of reasoning.

    He may be playing to a base that elects him, but he is not upholding his side of the bargain
    with respect to following the law as he is encouraging future law breaking, and that is unseemly
    when it comes from any LEO for any reason.

    “Public safety professionals serving in the executive branch do not have the constitutional authority, responsibility, and in most cases, the credentials to determine the constitutionality of any issue,” Arapahoe County Sheriff Grayson Robinson said in a statement. Law enforcement officials should leave it to the courts to decide whether a law is constitutional or not."

    Colorado sheriff blasts colleagues over refusal to enforce gun laws - U.S. News
    Dude, you're just never going to get it. And, that's a shame. <facepalm>
    “A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.” --George Washington

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by BWBracelets View Post
    Not to thread jack but I must clarify a grossly misused word. Anarchy means self governance NOT lawlessness.

    Black Widow Bracelets paracord bracelets
    Perhaps, but that isn't how it is commonly used; and not how it is defined in Wiki--- but of course that isn't "authoritative.

    "Anarchism is generally defined as a political philosophy which holds the state to be undesirable, unnecessary, or harmful,[1]

    Definition of ANARCHY (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/anarchy)
    1
    a : absence of government
    b : a state of lawlessness or political disorder due to the absence of governmental authority
    c : a utopian society of individuals who enjoy complete freedom without government
    2
    a : absence or denial of any authority or established order
    b : absence of order : disorder <not manicured plots but a wild anarchy of nature — Israel Shenker>

    That all sure sounds like lawlessness to me.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
    Andrew Jackson

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Now, I'll start to worry and worry a lot when a sheriff declares that he won't follow the law as
    understood by the DA and the state's attorney general, because then you have anarchy.
    No, then you have checks and balances. The whole point of a multi-headed system like ours is so that when one gets out of line, another can oppose it. Ultimately it is the people who are supposed to settle the difference with their vote.
    F350 likes this.
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