After Newtown: Very interesting series on PBS

After Newtown: Very interesting series on PBS

This is a discussion on After Newtown: Very interesting series on PBS within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; First of at least two parts on PBS last night... then there was a special Frontline . Here's a link to watch online if you'd ...

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  1. #1
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    After Newtown: Very interesting series on PBS

    First of at least two parts on PBS last night... then there was a special Frontline.

    Here's a link to watch online if you'd like... Not as anti as you might expect.. and some fairly good history... and some gun porn.

    Video: After Newtown | Watch After Newtown Online | PBS Video
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    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose


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    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    The second in the series was NOVA looking at the minds of mass killers... Also very interesting... And included the mom and child from the blog heard round the world after Sandy Hook... I am Adam Lanza's Mother

    Followed by a show on some ideas being used to secure schools...

    The "slant" on all of theses shows has been a little towards pointing the finger at the firearms... "If they weren't available no one could use them."

    But in all, probably the most comprehensive look at the "totality of the situation." And, there's a lot our side can learn here...

    If you haven't watched any of these, you're at least 4 hours behind... So far, the NRA was represented mostly by President Keene... and one clip from LaPierre.

    There's more in the series to watch: After Newtown Much of it will be worth watching, IMO. It won't all be rallying cries for "Guns, guns, and more goshdarn guns" (JD)... but I do think there is a lot we can learn from the series.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

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    Senior Member Array NETim's Avatar
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    And the anti's, do they learn that hassling law-abiding citizens isn't the solution?
    Don't try to be fancy. Shoot for the center of mass. The world is full of decent people. Criminals we can do without. -- Jeff Cooper (19202006)

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    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NETim View Post
    And the anti's, do they learn that hassling law-abiding citizens isn't the solution?
    The antis never learn anything... they're "conservative" in their belief that they are right... They have come to their conclusions through hard work ignoring facts... They don't know the difference between a mag and a clip... A real Assault Weapon from a Semi Automatic rifle with black plastic furniture.

    Your sig line says it best, for our side as well as theirs...

    We say stop the mentally ill and the criminals from getting guns.... you want to know what's involved in that? or do you just want it done? are you willing to pay for it thru taxes, or do you want to cut entitlements like SS and Medicare to pay for it?

    You want armed RSOs in schools... Maybe just cut DOD and police forces...


    We (broad brush) don't like "If you see something, say something" Because it's a Communist model... But it worked in Roy school... And stopped a planned mass attack. By kids who were going to "out Columbine" Columbine.

    All of the mass murders took planning... from 2 weeks worth to 2 years worth... in every case, somebody outside of the killing cadre, knew or heard inklings of the plans, or at the least the knowledge that the perpetrator was a danger ... And said nothing... or was unable to get something done...

    If our side doesn't become part of the solution... we can't help but be perceived as part of the problem... They say take take take. we say no no no....

    They have ideas... we just say no no no... LaPierre at least offered an idea of armed guards and perhaps volunteer teachers... But no one is figuring out how to implement it on a national scale...

    The rest of us just sit around and chant no no no...


    So, fine. Don't learn anything... be right. But when we fail to offer ideas, based on the other sides own findings... We don't help ourselves... you can sit there and be smug...

    But then, we become very like the child who has his toys taken away... And you know what? The toys are still taken away... Even though we did nothing wrong but possess them.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

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    Member Array Momokahn's Avatar
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    I feel sorry for the children and their family's of Newtown or any tragedy. It pi$$es me off that these networks give any publicity to these events just to give the next nut job some motive to try and outdo the last nut job. I speak from experience living in Wichita, Kansas and we had BTK (Dennis Rader) here and that is all he did for years, trying to outdo all other serial killers that preceeded him. I know we can't hide our heads in the sand but these networks know exactly what they are doing. They feed fuel to the next fire that they will be able to cover and put whatever slant they wish to put on it.

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    Senior Member Array bklynboy's Avatar
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    Oakchas, very well said

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    Member Array IBGoodToGo's Avatar
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    A lot of the problem with mass shooting is the SSRI Drugs. Lots of excellent video's on this page.

    Sandy Hook ? Tragedy, Drugs, Rights and Common Sense | Thrive
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    VIP Member Array Brass63's Avatar
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    I just finished watching the "After Newtown...Guns in America" episode, and really have mixed feelings about it.
    Some of the info was okay...and some was flat out wrong (e.g. most illegally-used guns are purchased illegally at gun shows...via 'the loophole'.)
    But in the end what bothered me most is the lack of context in the broadest sense.
    Historical context...since the dawn of human history...humans have slaughtered each other...via clubs, slings, swords, bombs, machetes, firearms, fists, etc.
    Sure, there have been brief periods of relative peace/security...but then it's back to war, anarchy, genocides...state-sponsored violence on a vast scale.
    The progressive mindset behind this series (and the gun-control movement) is one that believes a violence-free utopia can be achieved by removing the tools of violence from the individual (though left in the hands of the governing/powerful). Of course, this is nonsense. Checks and balances are necessary on both sides of the equation.
    Fatality context...when compared to deaths caused by preventable physician error...or with negligence behind the wheel (drinking, texting, speeding, etc.), accidents (drowning, falls, poisoning, etc.), unplanned pregnancy, etc., etc...firearm violence, and especially 'assault-weapon' violence, is way down the list numerically.
    Emoting has largely replaced rational thinking in our culture... and those who are governed by emotion are easily manipulated.
    Sadly, Im rather pessimistic about the outcome of this particular facet of the culture war.
    The United States Constitution 1791. All Rights Reserved.

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    Ex Member Array ScottM's Avatar
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    I won't be watching.

    PBS already gets way too much of my tax dollars.

    I won't give them my time as well.
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    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    Excellent post oakchas! The only part I take issue with is.
    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post

    They have ideas... we just say no no no... LaPierre at least offered an idea of armed guards and perhaps volunteer teachers... But no one is figuring out how to implement it on a national scale...
    My question here is why must it be done on a national scale? This is one of the many education related issues I think should be left to the local school boards to decide for themselves.
    Infowars- Proving David Hannum right on a daily basis

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    Senior Member Array stanislaskasava's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    Excellent post oakchas! The only part I take issue with is.

    My question here is why must it be done on a national scale? This is one of the many education related issues I think should be left to the local school boards to decide for themselves.
    It currently is left to local school boards and what we've ended up with is almost universal GFZs in schools. Of course, this is unconstitutional for public schools (government infringement) and that's why this has to be changed on a national scale. Until the Supreme Court is utilized... The first step is to dismantle GFZs.

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    VIP Member Array Crowman's Avatar
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    "After Newtown...Guns in America"

    Pretty much anti gun is how I seen it........................

    The link to this thread is not "After Newtown...Guns in America"......
    Last edited by Crowman; February 22nd, 2013 at 03:54 AM.
    "One of the greatest delusions in the world is the hope that the evils in this world are to be cured by legislation."
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    Second Amendment -- Established December 15, 1791 and slowly eroded ever since What happened to "..... shall not be infringed."

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    Member Array tele_pathic's Avatar
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    It shows up for me. I'll be watching this tomorrow and will reserve my thoughts until then. I will say I am more moderate on this issue: Yes, we have the right to defend ourselves, our families, and our properties. With reasonable weapons. From intruders. But we don't need Saiga auto 12ga. shottys. We don't need assault rifles. Now, where it gets sticky is this: What constitutes an assault rifle? That's hard to answer of course. I think of it this way: The gov't., both state and federal and local, enforce laws pertaining to drinking and driving. Why? Because left to their own devices, people (in general) cannot control their self-destructive natures. Why should this gun laws be any different? We must register when we intend to drive (driver's license) and we must register our vehicles. If we sell a vehicle, we have to transfer ownership. Why should gun laws be any different? I live in Utah. I could buy a gun from a neighbor, friend, or complete stranger without using an FFL, so completely off the grid/radar/books. The only legal "requirement" is that the seller checks my driver's license to double-check that I'm a resident of Utah. Even a bill of sale is not required but it is suggested. IMNSHO, that's crazy and a law that should be changed. One of my cousins is totally nuts, completely dysfunctional, yet he owns and AK-47, a Saiga 12ga. auto shotty, and several handguns. He lives in Texas, and he prolly carries everyday, illegally. He shouldn't own any guns because he is totally without reason. But never CONVICTED of a crime, so I could make the argument that he can own a handgun, a hunting rifle, and a hunting-style shotty. Period. End of story. He is too unstable and whacked out to own assault weapons.

    Finally, I'll say this: I do NOT believe we need too much legislation, but we do need enforcement of current laws. In fact, the only legislation I would suggest would be that ALL firearms must be mediated by an FFL.

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    Senior Member Array Happypuppy's Avatar
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    After Newtown: Very interesting series on PBS

    Quote Originally Posted by tele_pathic View Post
    It shows up for me. I'll be watching this tomorrow and will reserve my thoughts until then. I will say I am more moderate on this issue: Yes, we have the right to defend ourselves, our families, and our properties. With reasonable weapons. From intruders. But we don't need Saiga auto 12ga. shottys. We don't need assault rifles. Now, where it gets sticky is this: What constitutes an assault rifle? That's hard to answer of course. I think of it this way: The gov't., both state and federal and local, enforce laws pertaining to drinking and driving. Why? Because left to their own devices, people (in general) cannot control their self-destructive natures. Why should this gun laws be any different? We must register when we intend to drive (driver's license) and we must register our vehicles. If we sell a vehicle, we have to transfer ownership. Why should gun laws be any different? I live in Utah. I could buy a gun from a neighbor, friend, or complete stranger without using an FFL, so completely off the grid/radar/books. The only legal "requirement" is that the seller checks my driver's license to double-check that I'm a resident of Utah. Even a bill of sale is not required but it is suggested. IMNSHO, that's crazy and a law that should be changed. One of my cousins is totally nuts, completely dysfunctional, yet he owns and AK-47, a Saiga 12ga. auto shotty, and several handguns. He lives in Texas, and he prolly carries everyday, illegally. He shouldn't own any guns because he is totally without reason. But never CONVICTED of a crime, so I could make the argument that he can own a handgun, a hunting rifle, and a hunting-style shotty. Period. End of story. He is too unstable and whacked out to own assault weapons.

    Finally, I'll say this: I do NOT believe we need too much legislation, but we do need enforcement of current laws. In fact, the only legislation I would suggest would be that ALL firearms must be mediated by an FFL.
    I won't flame you, just suggest you think a bit more...

    I would feel better if you said you don't need a Saiga or AR. Not everyone feels the same way.

    If the police use AR' s ( not to mention M16s) to protect against bad guys why should I not be able to have the same?

    Keep in mind the power resides with the people, at least it should but sometimes I wonder these days. The Government does not give me rights , I have the right to defend myself. I see the world pretty simply some people are predators and the rest are prey, and the Bad guys look for the weakest prey.

    An AR seemed to work pretty well for these two in a home invasion

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mv1HQymlYdg

    Michigan Tax Preparation Service AR-15 used

    http://video.foxnews.com/v/217451082...tcmp=obnetwork
    Last edited by Happypuppy; February 22nd, 2013 at 05:34 PM.

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    Member Array tele_pathic's Avatar
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    Yes, and AR's seemed particularly effective in Aurora and Newtown as well.

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