Mr Obama to sign the International Gun Control Treaty on June 3rd... - Page 2

Mr Obama to sign the International Gun Control Treaty on June 3rd...

This is a discussion on Mr Obama to sign the International Gun Control Treaty on June 3rd... within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; someone has promised Obie-Won the position of King of the New World Order. Guns in the hands of the serfs are not good for the ...

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Thread: Mr Obama to sign the International Gun Control Treaty on June 3rd...

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array zonker1986's Avatar
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    someone has promised Obie-Won the position of King of the New World Order. Guns in the hands of the serfs are not good for the King.
    If this by some snow balls chance in Hades, passes.....you will see the South rise again.....and it won't be pretty.
    Kimbers are the guns you show your friends....Glocks are the ones you show your enemies.


  2. #17
    Member Array PO54yo's Avatar
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    The arrogance of this administration frightens me. Luckily, tho Obama appears untouchable, they have morally bankrupted themselves and failed miserably at everything they have tried to do.

    This administration is full of nincompoops but its still dangerous.
    "America is held together by one piece of paper"

  3. #18
    Member Array randian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OutWestSystems View Post
    There is ZERO chance of it being ratified, they don't have the 67 votes needed.
    You aren't playing the long game. Once signed, the treaty stays signed. That means that a future Senate that does have the necessary votes can ratify it without the concurrence of the then sitting President.

    You can be certain that Senate approval is the last thing on Obama's mind. He's going to implement the treaty anyway, just like he's implemented amnesty for illegal aliens without the approval of Congress.
    cn262 likes this.

  4. #19
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by randian View Post
    You aren't playing the long game. Once signed, the treaty stays signed. That means that a future Senate that does have the necessary votes can ratify it without the concurrence of the then sitting President.

    You can be certain that Senate approval is the last thing on Obama's mind. He's going to implement the treaty anyway, just like he's implemented amnesty for illegal aliens without the approval of Congress.
    And that President if he does not like the treaty can have us withdraw...........
    Hopyard and hogdaddy like this.
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  5. #20
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    The very fact that Obama will sign this treaty is what infuriates me. Are his followers SO stupid that they can't see what he's doing to our country?????
    gtfoxy and phreddy like this.
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  6. #21
    VIP Member Array Patti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanlouise View Post
    The very fact that Obama will sign this treaty is what infuriates me. Are his followers SO stupid that they can't see what he's doing to our country?????
    Yes - and they don't care because they only care about his ethnicity. But, I think it goes deeper than just skin color. There are a lot of Americans who hate America - Obama being one of them.

    While Character was being instilled in most Americans by boy scouts, girl scouts, YMCA, YWCA, 4H, athletics, etc.), by religious leaders in the churches/synagogues they attended, by service academies where they were instilled with the Honor System/Honor Code and love of country, by boot camp where military indoctrination emphasized the service branch heritage and love of country, and by military leadership training programs for officer and noncoms, Barack Obama’s character was developed, as he relates in his book “Dreams,” every day after school in Hawaii, by his mentor, Frank Marshall Davis, the Secretary of the Communist Party USA. He previously went to school in Indonesia where American values weren’t taught, went on to Columbia under the name of Barry Soetoro, where his character was further developed by his two roommates who took him to Pakistan in the 1980′s to be indoctrinated in a philosophy that was not typically American.

    And don't forget that he sat in a pew for 20 years under the tutelage of Jeremiah Wright: "God-dxxxmd America".

    Obama's actions speak louder than words.
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  7. #22
    Senior Member Array CanuckQue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanlouise View Post
    The very fact that Obama will sign this treaty is what infuriates me. Are his followers SO stupid that they can't see what he's doing to our country?????
    What's the specific issue? You're mad, right? And other people are blind, if they're not mad. So, what's the specific problem? Can you articulate it?
    Hopyard and technomonster like this.
    Our current plan for Universal Iron Lung coverage, just sayin'.
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  8. #23
    Senior Member Array cn262's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanlouise View Post
    The very fact that Obama will sign this treaty is what infuriates me. Are his followers SO stupid that they can't see what he's doing to our country?????
    Personally, I believe there are two classes of followers. Those close to the President see exactly what he is doing and see potential for a permanent, elite ruling class where they do whatever they want anytime, all the time. That can't happen with 2A.

    The other class (i.e., those who don't necessarily want to rule) are divided into two subclasses:

    The first are the "intellectual (liberal) elite" that believe they are right because, well, because they are right. They view the need for firearms as primitive, believe that the Government is there to protect them and their way of life, and view everyone opposed to their views as "weak of mind" and a threat. They like being able to pay to bend the rules while still believing that they are in full compliance with the rules. "If the other guys aren't smart enough to figure this out it is their fault." This subgroup is just looking out for themselves and don't really care about the bigger picture.

    The second subclass are the sheep who want to be protected and given things for free. They like the idea of a Nanny State because they are scared little children. Many don't want to be responsible or accountable, so it is much easier to blame other things (guns) and other people (gun owners, Republicans, the rich, and whatever else fits at the time). This subgroup of people is uninformed and tends to believe authority. They want to be told what to do, desperately want to believe in their leaders, and therefore have blind faith in those people. I believe this is why simple messaging, even when wrong and/or illogical, is so effective. Again, these people only care about themselves and what they can get (or not lose) by supporting those that are promising them so much.


    So, not all are stupid - they just don't care because they feel it will either benefit them or won't affect them. And yes, some are stupid and fail to understand why our Forefathers felt so strongly about our individual rights as a way to maintain a more honest government. To me, this seems like a very devious and systematic plan to remove barriers to those personal goals.
    Last edited by cn262; June 3rd, 2013 at 08:14 AM. Reason: added missing word

  9. #24
    Member Array the6shooter's Avatar
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    I do believe that if he sighs it, he/they can't sell or give weapons to the middle east and mexico

  10. #25
    Senior Member Array cn262's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patti View Post
    <snip>

    While Character was being instilled in most Americans by boy scouts, girl scouts, YMCA, YWCA, 4H, athletics, etc.), by religious leaders in the churches/synagogues they attended, by service academies where they were instilled with the Honor System/Honor Code and love of country, by boot camp where military indoctrination emphasized the service branch heritage and love of country, and by military leadership training programs for officer and noncoms.

    <snip>
    Patti,

    I believe that this is a big part of our overall problem as a nation. There has been a systematic attack on anything religious for 30 years or so - starting with challenging the practice of having students say the Pledge of Allegiance at public schools. When you have faith in something beyond yourself, and "getting there" includes things like personal character (integrity and honor) and helping people (service), then related things like having a sense of patriotism and duty is a natural progression. By attacking the foundation you erode everything else.

    Again, this is just my opinion. The recent survey below is interesting, and makes it appear that more and more people might be moving towards a similar position of thought.

    Poll: America losing its religion ? CNN Belief Blog - CNN.com Blogs
    Patti and elmacgyver0 like this.

  11. #26
    Member Array ThePatriot1776's Avatar
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    Said treaty violates at least four of the Universal Declaration of Rights as held by the United Nations.

    Article 3.

    Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person.

    Article 17.

    (1) Everyone has the right to own property alone as well as in association with others.
    (2) No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his property.

    Article 22.

    Everyone, as a member of society, has the right to social security and is entitled to realization, through national effort and international co-operation and in accordance with the organization and resources of each State, of the economic, social and cultural rights indispensable for his dignity and the free development of his personality.

    Article 29.

    (1) Everyone has duties to the community in which alone the free and full development of his personality is possible.
    (2) In the exercise of his rights and freedoms, everyone shall be subject only to such limitations as are determined by law solely for the purpose of securing due recognition and respect for the rights and freedoms of others and of meeting the just requirements of morality, public order and the general welfare in a democratic society.
    (3) These rights and freedoms may in no case be exercised contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.

    Oopss sorry about that Mr. Obama you can't disarm the people through the UN either.
    the6shooter likes this.

  12. #27
    VIP Member Array Kilowatt3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OutWestSystems View Post
    There is ZERO chance of it being ratified... There is no way around getting a treaty ratified. It is symbolic and nothing more.
    There's not supposed to be any "way around" the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, or 10th amendments, or others, either, but they are routinely trashed.
    Regards,
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  13. #28
    Member Array randian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    And that President if he does not like the treaty can have us withdraw...........
    Yes, he can, but withdrawing zombie treaties seems to happen remarkably rarely.

  14. #29
    Ex Member Array Manderinobyebye's Avatar
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    I absolutely trust no one with this government,especially the communist Obummer

  15. #30
    VIP Member Array Patti's Avatar
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    130 Members Of Congress Challenge Obama & Kerry Over UN Arms Trade Treaty

    2 June 2013

    The United Nations Arms Trade Treaty (ATT) is scheduled to be signed by Barack Obama on June 4, this Monday. He has already said he will sign it. However, the United States Senate passed a resolution that they will not ratify the document. Now a letter has been sent to Barack Obama and Secretary of State John Kerry by 130 members of the House of Representatives opposing the ATT.

    On May 30 the 130 congressmen wrote to remind both Obama and Kerry that they are supposed to be “defenders of the sovereignty of the United States and as such the representatives wrote to “express…grave concern about the dangers posed by the United Nations’ Arms Trade Treaty.”

    According to the letter, “Our country’s sovereignty, and the protections it affords our individual freedoms, including those recognized by the Second Amendment, must not be infringed.”
    The letter then went on to cite three reasons not to sign the treaty:

    1.The treaty as adopted by the General Assembly is deeply flawed.
    2.The treaty suffers from vagueness.
    3.The procedure by which the treaty was adopted violates a red line set out by Obama’s own administration
    .

    The congressmen expounded on the flaws of the treaty. They wrote, “It includes only a weak preambular reference to the lawful ownership and use of, and trade in, firearms, and recognizes none of these activities, or personal self-defense, as inherent rights. It frequently employs the term “end users,” which can refer to individual firearms owners, and, in its sixth Principle, it creates a national “responsibility” to “prevent … diversion” of firearms, a requirement that could be used to justify the imposition of further controls within the United States.”

    “This risk is enhanced by Article 5.1, which requires nations party to the treaty to implement it in accordance with this principle,” the letter reads. “We know that, in the final March negotiating conference, your administration opposed a number of these treaty elements: we do not believe that your administration should now support them by signing the treaty.”

    The letter also points out that “in Article 20.3, allows amendments by a three-quarters majority vote. We note that Article 20.4 makes it clear that amendments are binding only on those nations that accept them, but we do not regard this as an adequate safeguard.”

    The vagueness of the treaty was also pointed out. “It defines none of the terms essential to interpreting or implementing it, or defines them only by reference to terms that are themselves undefined. This means that, by becoming party to the treaty, the United States would be accepting commitments that are inherently unclear.”

    By being unclear, it would thus open the US to repeated charges of breach of faith, and no doubt it would also place pressure on the US to adopt new interpretations or amendments to the treaty.
    Obama will sign the treaty, knowing that the Senate passed a resolution that they will not ratify the document - which tells me that he will find a way to circumvent Congress - which he already promised that he will do.

    Obama said he doesn't need Congress.

    The occupant at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. needs to be impeached, convicted, and imprisoned. If he's not - then our country owes a huge apology to President Nixon.
    Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy. — Winston Churchill

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