What Mass Killers Want—And How to Stop Them: WSJ

This is a discussion on What Mass Killers Want—And How to Stop Them: WSJ within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I put this newslink in the 2A Section inasmuch as mass murders create some of the greatest risks of our 2A rights How to Stop ...

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 31
Like Tree62Likes

Thread: What Mass Killers Want—And How to Stop Them: WSJ

  1. #1
    Moderator
    Array Rock and Glock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Colorado at 11,650'
    Posts
    12,378

    Question What Mass Killers Want—And How to Stop Them: WSJ

    I put this newslink in the 2A Section inasmuch as mass murders create some of the greatest risks of our 2A rights

    How to Stop Mass Shootings - WSJ.com

    This is an interesting analysis focused more on the individuals, motives, reasons and patterns behind mass murderers, rather than the weapons. This is, I believe, is the only comment about guns in the entire article:

    Massacres also would not be nearly so lethal without the widespread availability of guns and high-capacity magazines designed more for offense than for defense.
    One of the observations notes:

    A 2003 study led by Columbia University psychiatrist Madelyn Gould found "ample evidence" of a suicide contagion effect, fed by reports in the media. A 2011 study in the journal BMC Public Health found, unsurprisingly, that this effect is especially strong for novel forms of suicide that receive outsize attention in the press.
    Some researchers have even put the theory to the test. In 1984, a rash of suicides broke out on the subway system in Vienna. As the death toll climbed, a group of researchers at the Austrian Association for Suicide Prevention theorized that sensational reporting was inadvertently glorifying the suicides. Three years into the epidemic, the researchers persuaded local media to change their coverage by minimizing details and photos, avoiding romantic language and simplistic explanations of motives, moving the stories from the front page and keeping the word "suicide" out of the headlines. Subway suicides promptly dropped by 75%.
    At the end are several common sense ideas which have appeal, but don't sell airtime or magazines. Neither do the ideas pander to the charlatans that need another tragedy to push for more gun control.

    The author does not suggest "more guns" (as most of us would suggest, and as in fact the NRA suggested), but more constrained media.

    Personally, I would like to see more analysis, and considerable thought expended locally and nationally on this type of approach.

    Thoughts? More ideas? Is this worth sharing in local medias?





    (Please avoid discussing topics such as political charlatans we know and love, gun control bashing, and other taboo topics. I'd like this open for discussions and ideas!)
    Last edited by Rock and Glock; November 9th, 2013 at 05:39 PM.

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    Member Array ZOMBIEvs42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    477
    My only thing with "constraining" the media, is that it could encroach on freedom of speech. Slippery slope and all that.
    weekend pre-apocolypse nomadic warrior, leather duster and all.

  4. #3
    Senior Member Array Oldpsufan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    1,173
    Quote Originally Posted by ZOMBIEvs42 View Post
    My only thing with "constraining" the media, is that it could encroach on freedom of speech. Slippery slope and all that.
    Since when has anyone paid any attention to freedom of speech ? The media does not report news as we know it, they report "news" as their agenda sees it. I'm all for restricting the media to news only.
    oneshot, gatorbait51 and Anubis like this.

  5. #4
    Member Array ZOMBIEvs42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    477
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldpsufan View Post
    Since when has anyone paid any attention to freedom of speech ? The media does not report news as we know it, they report "news" as their agenda sees it. I'm all for restricting the media to news only.
    They can report on anything they want whether it's factual or not. Restricting the "media" to "news" only is infringement. Who defines news? I know I don't care what latest "celebrity" married who and cheated on who with but some folks consider that news.
    gatorbait51 likes this.
    weekend pre-apocolypse nomadic warrior, leather duster and all.

  6. #5
    VIP Member Array OutWestSystems's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Colorado Springs, CO
    Posts
    2,171
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldpsufan View Post
    Since when has anyone paid any attention to freedom of speech ? The media does not report news as we know it, they report "news" as their agenda sees it. I'm all for restricting the media to news only.
    And who decides what is "news"? Can't be free when the government gets to decide what is reported. North Korea would be proud.
    gatorbait51 and Sig 210 like this.

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Lansing Mi
    Posts
    7,075
    R & G I am not sure I have a good enough understanding of the human brain to figure out whether the news report is right or wrong in their assumptions. I get what they are saying, but will it really work? We have so many ways of getting news now a days that I really do not believe that these kind of events can be controlled. In theory is sounds good, but other countries do not have the freedoms we do.
    gatorbait51 likes this.
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

  8. #7
    VIP Member
    Array Hopyard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Disappeared
    Posts
    11,631
    Although we can not alter the behavior of "the press" legislatively, we can register public disgust in the hope that they will self-moderate and self-censor.

    I think the WSJ is to be commended for this article.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
    Andrew Jackson

  9. #8
    Administrator
    Array QKShooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Off Of The X
    Posts
    35,265
    For every sensationalized murder or killing spree Law Enforcement always expects at least one copycat or attempted copycat.
    gatorbait51 likes this.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

  10. #9
    Senior Member Array Happypuppy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Small Town USA
    Posts
    846
    Interesting reading. I had suspected that the amount of media coverage have much to do with it. As so many of them seem to be copycats.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    gatorbait51 likes this.

  11. #10
    Senior Member Array DaGunny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    543
    Report the news, but make it a crime to report the name or show a likeness of the perp.
    gatorbait51 likes this.
    KNOWLEDGE: A tomato is a fruit.
    WISDOM: Not putting a tomato in a fruit salad.
    .

  12. #11
    VIP Member
    Array oneshot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    +42.893612,-082.710236 , Mi.
    Posts
    8,009
    Quote Originally Posted by ZOMBIEvs42 View Post
    They can report on anything they want whether it's factual or not. Restricting the "media" to "news" only is infringement. Who defines news? I know I don't care what latest "celebrity" married who and cheated on who with but some folks consider that news.
    Quote Originally Posted by OutWestSystems View Post
    And who decides what is "news"? Can't be free when the government gets to decide what is reported. North Korea would be proud.

    You two need to understand who controls the "content" of what news THEY want to give;
    See below


    FRANKLIN D. ROOSEVELT, U.S. President, in a letter written November 21, 1933 to Colonel E. Mandell House, Roosevelt states: "The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the large centers has owned the government of the U.S. since the days of Andrew Jackson." (History points to the last truly honorable and incorruptible American president as Andrew Jackson "Old Hickory".)

    PETER HOAGLAND, Nebraska State Senator and Humanist, speaking on radio in 1983 with the great American Pastor and Patriot Everett Sileven said: "Fundamental, Bible believing people do not have the right to indoctrinate their children in their religious beliefs because we, the state, are preparing them for the year 2000, when America will be part of a one-world global society and their children will not fit in."

    DAVID ROCKEFELLER, Internationalist billionaire, Humanist, CFR kingpin, founder of the Trilateralist Commission, World Order Godfather (and in all probability the High School graduate voted "Most Likely to Be Hanged for Treason"), voiced his praise of the controlled U.S. media for keeping their oath not to divulge the Globalist plans to the public. Speaking to his fellow conspirators at a meeting, June 1991 in Baden Baden, Germany, of yet one more infamous World Order group, the Bilderbergers, Mr. Rockefeller said:

    "We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years."

    "It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subjected to the lights of publicity during those years. But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries."

    (It is not reported if the attendees kissed his ring - or anything else - after their leader bestowed his blessing on those in attendance). Actually, we could ask Governor Clinton or Dan Quayle, both of whom were there. Bush and Clinton are Bilderbergers, Internationalists, and their goals are exactly the same for America.

    Let us repeat ...CLINTON'S, BUSH'S, AND PEROT'S, PLANS FOR AMERICA ARE VIRTUALLY IDENTICAL. The Republicans and Democrats goals for America are virtually identical. They both are taking our nation into global government.


    JAMES PAUL WARBURG, Foreign Agent of the Rothschild Dynasty, major player in the Federal Reserve Act scam: on February 17, 1950, while speaking before the United States Senate, this pompous Internationalist boasted confidently, "We shall have World Government, whether or not we like it. The only question is whether World Government will be achieved by conquest or consent."

    ROBERT KENNEDY, former U.S. Attorney General of the U.S.: "All of us will ultimately be judged on the effort we have contributed to building a NEW WORLD ORDER." - 1967 (We can all agree with Robert on one thing: All traitors who participate in the N.W.O. WILL be judged one day!)


    GEORGE W. MALLONE, U.S. Senator (Nevada), speaking before Congress in 1957, alluded to the families that secretly own the "Federal" Reserve Bank and control the finances of the U.S. He stated:

    "I believe that if the people of this nation fully understood what Congress has done to them over the last 49 years, they would move on Washington; they would not wait for an election... It adds up to a preconceived plan to destroy the economic and social independence of the United States!"


    As in all investigations, it always comes down to, "How can we prove our case?" We personally feel it's hard to top the proof coming from the mouths of the very ones involved in this treacherous unAmerican program. Here's one terrific example. John Swinton, the former Chief of Staff for the New York Times, was one of America's best loved newspapermen. Called by his peers "The Dean of his Profession", John was asked in 1953 to give a toast before the New York Press Club, and in so doing made a monumentally important and revealing statement. He is quoted as follows:

    "There is no such thing, at this date of the world's history, in America as an independent press. You know it and I know it. There is not one of you who dares to write your honest opinions, and if you did, you know beforehand that it would never appear in print. I am paid weekly for keeping my honest opinions out of the paper I am connected with. Others of you are paid similar salaries for similar things, and any of you who would be so foolish as to write honest opinions would be out on the streets looking for another job. If I allowed my honest opinions to appear in one issue of my paper, before twenty-four hours my occupation would be gone. The business of the journalists is to destroy the truth; to lie outright; to pervert; to vilify; to fawn at the feet of mammon, and to sell his country and his race for his daily bread. You know it and I know it and what folly is this toasting an independent press? We are the tools and vassals of rich men behind the scenes. We are jumping jacks, they pull the strings and we dance. Our talents, our possibilities and our lives are all the property of other men. We are intellectual prostitutes."
    END
    from here; Operation Vampire Killer 2000 - The Lawful Path

    People, this stuff is out there for you to read and investigate
    gatorbait51 and Ghost1958 like this.
    If you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans.

    Washington didn't use his freedom of speech to defeat the British, He shot them!

    Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy." -- Ernest Benn

  13. #12
    VIP Member
    Array OldVet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    S. Florida, north of the Miami mess, south of the Mouse trap
    Posts
    16,142
    Everyone wants that 15 minutes of fame, even crazy people.
    gatorbait51 and Sig 210 like this.
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

  14. #13
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    26,559
    Quote Originally Posted by From the WSJ article
    What Mass Killers Want—And How to Stop Them
    Rampage shooters crave the spotlight, and we should do everything possible to deprive them of it.
    Yes, I agree that gratuitous spotlighting of 'ragers and their activities should be glossed over. Just the facts, ma'am. Just the facts.

    But I also agree that the most reliable way to stop them in the act is as was done with The Dalton Gang as they were gunned down exiting the bank in Coffeyville, KS, back when. THAT is how you stop the most violent felons ... you stop them permanently, expeditiously and with extreme prejudice, on-site on the instant they're caught doing whatever. And the only way to get there is for all upstanding people to have the ability to withstand such violence perpetrated against them. Get there, and we'll have a fighting chance. Fail to do that, and we'll continue muddling along while wringing our hands over what to do that could be considered effective.
    rocky, Hoganbeg, 10thmtn and 2 others like this.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  15. #14
    Member Array sliderbk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Great Lakes Region
    Posts
    140
    In relation to the media's role, I would like to see them be more responsible and less biased. I'm not holding my breath because it seems like most have little or no shame. Every incident seems to result in several reports that are later proved inaccurate and plain wrong. Also, all the focus does give some the spotlight they may crave thus encouraging copycats, but overall, we've been pretty lucky that most do not as most are not suicidal even if they deeply crave some attention.

    As for the why, this is the much more difficult job. Most shooters end up killing themselves so they're not around to ask why and get an explanation, once the legal trials are done. I think of it as a room filling with gas (the fuel), just waiting for a spark (the catalyst). For example, we know the Oak Creek Sikh Temple shooter was a white supremist and that was part of the fuel building. Was it all the fuel? He was involved in the movement for years and didn't act prior. Other are part of similar movements, but we don't have regular incidents of white supremist's attacking. What was the catalyst that moved him to action? Same for Newtown, we know the 20 year old had some socialization issues, potentially some for of autism, but he had little or no history of violently acting out. We know he was fascinated by the Belgian mass murderer and wanted a higher body count, but what were his fuels that built up, and what was the catalyst that made him start his planning, then act. It is real hard work, which is why most of the media, politicians, and advocates don't want to do it and focus on a piece of metal and plastic. We do have the Aurora and Tucson shooters and it would be great to know what was going on that fueled them to act out and what was the critical event that set them in motion.
    gatorbait51 likes this.
    Kahr CW380, Kahr P9, Walther P99AS


  16. #15
    VIP Member Array OutWestSystems's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Colorado Springs, CO
    Posts
    2,171
    I find it strange that people that so strongly support the 2nd Amendment, would have no problem with infringing on the 1st Amendment.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

what mass killers want and how to stop them

,

what mass killers want and how yo stop then

Click on a term to search for related topics.