It's a Question of Logic

This is a discussion on It's a Question of Logic within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; D.C. ban has 23x murder rate versus Arlington VA no-ban.. It's a simple question of logic...

Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: It's a Question of Logic

  1. #1
    Member Array BexSoCal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    32

    It's a Question of Logic

    D.C. ban has 23x murder rate versus Arlington VA no-ban..
    It's a simple question of logic

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    Member Array foreveryoung001's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    473
    another great article, but I'm sure it will have very little effect with the, "Don't confuse me with the facts" crowd.

    If they could only open up their brains to logic, then of course, they could see the same thing as this author.

    Thanks for the post.
    When the messenger arrives and says 'Don't shoot the messenger,' it's a good idea to be prepared to shoot the messenger, just in case.

  4. #3
    VIP Member
    Array Scott's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    The Old Dominion
    Posts
    5,050
    Well if we want to play a numbers game...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington,_D.C. Median income $40,127

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arlington,_Virginia Median Income $63,001

    DC Crime for December - http://www.crimeindc.org/ Notice how it tends to cluster to the right in the poorer areas of town. Really only about 5 crimes outside these areas. Sorry crime in Arlington isn't such that they offer a plotting service.

    Population density in Arlington is 2,828 per square mile in DC it is 9,316 per square mile. The make up of those populations is also inverted. In Arlington the population is over 60% white and just over 30% black. In DC the population is over 60% Black with just over 30% being white.

    Estimated populations are DC 580,000 versus Arlington at 200,000.

    I can play with numbers as well. Arlington's murder rate from 2004 to 2005 increased 400%. Arlington has the second highest police officer to resident ratio in Northern VA at 18 officers per 10,000 residents.

    The thing these two areas seem to have the most in common? They both voted predominently democrat in the last two presidential elections.

    The only reason there is a difference in crime between these two areas is that guns are banned in DC? Sorry, probably not. I'm as pro-gun as the next guy, but please lets at least try to make a decent argument for our cause. Thank goodness Mr. Roberts only need appeal to his base as it is a commentary versus a news article.
    Procrastinators are the leaders of tomorrow.

  5. #4
    Member Array denverd0n's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    388
    The problem is that people do not become anti-gun because of logic. It is an emotional reaction. Until we start using emotional arguments we will not reach them.

    I know that this goes contrary to what most pro-gun folks think, but it's a fact. The logical arguments may (probably will) work with those who are on the fence. For the solidly anti-gun types, though, you are going to have to appeal to their emotions or you are going to get nowhere.

  6. #5
    VIP Member
    Array goawayfarm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Fork Union, Virginia
    Posts
    2,690
    Really good article...straight to the point, easy to understand.

    Some really good parts:
    Historically, every government that has ever denied their citizens the right to keep and bear arms has turned quickly into a one-party rule dominion over that nation.

    Logically, there is no reason to put law abiding citizens through all the red tape to satisfy the anti-gun lobbys. A law abiding citizen is not going to use a gun to kill, rob, or threaten anyone that is not attempting to kill, rob or threaten them. A criminal however, has already crossed the mental bridge separating right from wrong in his intent. It is no stretch to say that the same criminal would seek to get his weapon illegally. So the only persons affected by a gun control law are those who would already obey the law to begin with, and therefore should not need to abide by a law intended to deter criminals!

    Think about that, a law intended to deter criminals. Is there anything more contradictory? i.e. "That'll teach em, if they won't obey the laws, we'll make more of them!"
    Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est.-Seneca

    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. If I have a gun, what do I have to be paranoid about?" -Clint Smith

    "An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Jeff Cooper

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array SammyIamToday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    2,087
    I'm with Scott here. There are too many facets to the cultural murder problem that Americans on the whole have to be something so simple as guns being the fix. Do I think guns can prevent crimes? Yes, of course. I think if a majority of people carried, that it would really do something. However, a majority of people do not carry.

    Gun ownership will forever be a liberty issue.
    ...He suggested that "every American citizen" should own a rifle and train with it on firing ranges "at every courthouse." -Chesty Puller

  8. #7
    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    NOVA...200 square miles surrounded by reality
    Posts
    3,166
    Your trying to explain this logic to a group of people that haven't grasped the meaning of the word "LOGIC" yet. It is total emotion that they base all there decisions on. Also, they have a tendency to rally behind someone who speaks out and says "I should be handed life on a platter because of where I grew up, and its somebody elses fault not mine, and by the way don't worry I will make it better if you just elect me."
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

  9. #8
    Moderator
    Array RETSUPT99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    44,499

    Good Points goawayfarm...

    Additionally...

    Everyone has heard of Kennesaw Georgia, the small town that heard of another small towns' answer to gun crime by banning all guns. Kennesaw however, saw it differently, they created a law in their town that made it mandatory for all citizens over 18 to carry or own a handgun. After the passage of this law, crime in Kennesaw dropped 89%. If anything changes by 89%, that's noticeable. Was this a coincidence?

    89% speaks clearly and loudly...

    Stay armed...stay safe!

    OMO

    ret
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

    ***********************************
    Certified Glock Armorer
    NRA Life Member[/B]

  10. #9
    VIP Member
    Array Scott's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    The Old Dominion
    Posts
    5,050
    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    Additionally...

    Everyone has heard of Kennesaw Georgia, the small town that heard of another small towns' answer to gun crime by banning all guns. Kennesaw however, saw it differently, they created a law in their town that made it mandatory for all citizens over 18 to carry or own a handgun. After the passage of this law, crime in Kennesaw dropped 89%. If anything changes by 89%, that's noticeable. Was this a coincidence?

    89% speaks clearly and loudly...

    Stay armed...stay safe!

    OMO

    ret
    Right and see my link where Arlington County, VA's murder rate increased 400% from 2004 to 2005. Percentages are used by people who want to make a change seem larger than it really is. The 400% increase in the Arlington murder rate meant it went from 1 murder to 5 murders. What was the reason for the murder rate jump in Arlington? More guns on the streets? The Kennesaw anecdotal crime decrease without any raw numbers and any other causative factors applies as equally in Arlington.

    Also as pointed out, being anti-rights is an emotional response. I've said it many times before. Many antis have little control of their emotions. I've had them flat out tell me if they had a gun in traffic they would be shooting people. The problem for us is that these out of control people believe that everyone is like them. They believe that no one can control their temper enough to be trusted with a gun. They believe we will lose it, as they would, and wind up going on shooting sprees. That is the problem.
    Procrastinators are the leaders of tomorrow.

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Help with Glock 26 Logic Please
    By SaddleSC in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: April 2nd, 2009, 11:20 PM
  2. Fuzzy Logic?
    By mcp1810 in forum Carry & Defensive Scenarios
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: February 8th, 2009, 11:51 AM
  3. U.S. Marines Logic
    By Miggy in forum Off Topic & Humor Discussion
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: July 10th, 2008, 11:39 PM
  4. logic of FMJ and JHP
    By Go Glock in forum Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: November 1st, 2006, 08:26 PM
  5. Reverse Logic!
    By Deke45 in forum The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: May 21st, 2005, 07:13 AM