Attention Florida! SB-2356 To Protect Possession of Firearms in Vehicles

This is a discussion on Attention Florida! SB-2356 To Protect Possession of Firearms in Vehicles within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; A Letter to Marion Hammer. Dear Ms. Hammer: I am an attorney in Orlando, Florida. I understand that you are supporting the proposed Personal Private ...

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Thread: Attention Florida! SB-2356 To Protect Possession of Firearms in Vehicles

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    Attention Florida! SB-2356 To Protect Possession of Firearms in Vehicles

    A Letter to Marion Hammer.

    Dear Ms. Hammer:

    I am an attorney in Orlando, Florida. I understand that you are supporting the proposed Personal Private Property Protection Act introduced to the Florida Legislature this year. I wanted to bring a matter to your attention that relates to this Bill.

    I represent Doug and Linda Gray, a husband and wife who were both employed by the Walt Disney World Company. They worked similar shifts, and traveled to work together. The Grays had to begin their commute before sunrise, and had to travel through some less than safe areas. In fact, they had been accosted on their commute to work in the past. They contacted law enforcement about this and were advised that they should purchase a firearm for their own protection during their commute. Based on this advice, Mr. Gray purchased a revolver to protect he and his wife. When the Grays arrived at work, the revolver was locked in their vehicle.

    The Grays were both hired by Disney on November 13, 1996. They met at Disney during the final entry interview process, and were later married. Just 17 days before their 10th anniversary of employment at Disney, they were both terminated. While Mrs. Gray was being asked about an absence from work, she responded that her husband was unable to attend, and she didn't feel safe traveling into work without him. Upon further questioning, Mrs. Gray revealed that Mr. Gray had the firearm in their vehicle for their protection. Disney had the vehicle searched, and the firearm was found, locked in the vehicle where the Grays indicated it was. Both Mr. and Mrs. Gray were terminated. Additionally, Disney had the Orange County Sheriffs issue a trespass warning against Mr. and Mrs. Gray, so that neither could step foot on any Disney property again.

    I attempted to intervene on behalf of Mr. and Mrs. Gray. However, Disney would not allow me to participate in their review of this incident. Disney claimed that they had a zero tolerance policy with respect to firearms on their property. They would not listen when they were told that the revolver belonged to Mr. Gray, and that Mrs. Gray had never even handled the same. They would not listen when they were told about the Grays' commute and how it was dangerous for them to travel to work at the times they were scheduled.

    Moreover, Disney showed no leniency toward the Grays whatsoever. The punishment for Mrs. Gray was the same as for Mr. Gray, because she knew that he kept a firearm in the vehicle and the vehicle was titled in both of their names. Disney did not take the Grays' years of service into account when they were terminated. Disney did not take into account the fact that the Grays voluntarily reduced their hours in the post-September 11, 2001 tourist slump, so that Disney would not have to lay off as many employees. Disney would not even withdraw the trespasses against the Gray so that they could bring their grandchildren to the parks when they visited on vacation. Mr. Gray was originally granted unemployment compensation, but Disney fought that as well and now Mr. Gray is obligated to pay back the unemployment benefits he was paid.

    Doug and Linda Gray are good people. They had recently bought a house and were working hard to pay for the same. They worked for Disney for almost 10 years, and they no plans to change their careers. Unfortunately, it is not a perfect world. The Grays had been threatened by criminals on their commute to work during the pre-dawn hours. Mr. Gray purchased a firearm for the sole purpose of protecting himself and his wife so that they could continue to show up for work at Disney. However, when Disney discovered that there was a firearm in its parking lot, Disney fired these hard working, long time employees without hesitation, without remorse, and without any recourse. When Disney was given the opportunity to show leniency, it failed to do so.

    In short, Mr. Gray lost his job because he wanted to protect himself and his wife when they were traveling to and from work. Mrs. Gray lost her job simply because her husband wanted to keep her safe during their commute. Their lives have been thrown into upheaval because they were willing to take responsibility for their own safety. Certainly Disney did nothing to keep them safe during their commute; to the contrary, in complete disregard for the safety and welfare of its employees, Disney prohibits employees, such as the Grays, from protecting themselves while traveling to and from work.

    The Grays understand that there was no law preventing Disney from terminating them as it did. However, they have asked me to share their story with you and with the Florida Legislature, so perhaps other good citizens of Florida are protected from similar actions in the future.

    If I can provide any additional information on this topic that would be useful to you or the Florida Legislature, please do not hesitate to contact me. Until then, I remain,

    Very truly yours,

    Ernest J. Myers, Esq.
    Orlando, FL 32801
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

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    The Bill now at the Florida Legislature:

    ALERT !! ACT NOW - SB-2356 Protect Possession/Guns/Cars/Parking Lots

    DATE: March 22, 2007
    TO: USF & NRA Members and Friends
    FROM: Marion P. Hammer
    NRA Past President
    Executive Director Unified Sportsmen of Florida

    SUBJECT: SB-2356 To Protect Possession of Firearms in Vehicles in Parking Lots

    SB-2356 protects employees and customers from having their private vehicles searched and protects against punitive action by anti-gun business owners who would deny you your right to have a gun in your car for protection and other lawful purposes like hunting and target shooting when you park in a business parking lot.

    SB-2356 stops ARROGANT CORPORATIONS who think they can control the personal private property you have in your private vehicle in parking lots.

    The Senate Criminal Justice Committee will hold a hearing on
    SB-2356 by Sen. Peaden on Tuesday, March 27, 2007.

    Please immediately send email to members of the Senate Criminal Justice Committee and URGE THEM TO SUPPORT SB-2356 by Sen. Peaden

    Below is a list of the email addresses of those you need to contact

    IN THE SUBJECT LINE OF YOUR EMAIL PUT:

    PLEASE SUPPORT SB-2356/Protect Firearms/private vehicles

    (To send one email to all committee members at the same time, block or highlight the entire list and then copy and paste the block into the address section of the email.)

    Senate Criminal Justice Committee

    argenziano.nancy.web*at*flsenate.gov
    aronberg.dave.web*at*flsenate.gov
    bennett.mike.web*at*flsenate.gov
    crist.victor.web*at*flsenate.gov
    dawson.mandy.web*at*flsenate.gov
    king.james.web*at*flsenate.gov
    lynn.evelyn.web*at*flsenate.gov
    wilson.frederica.web*at*flsenate.gov
    wise.stephen.web*at*flsenate.gov

    If you prefer to make phone calls, call these numbers:

    Sen. Nancy Argenziano (R) Chair (850) 487-5017
    Sen. Dave Aronberg (D) VC (850) 487-5356
    Sen. Mike Bennett (R) (850) 487-5078
    Sen. Victor Crist (R) (850) 487-5068
    Sen. Mandy Dawson (D) (850) 487-5112
    Sen. Jim King (R) (850) 487-5030
    Sen. Evelyn Lynn (R) (850) 487-5033
    Sen. Frederica Wilson (D) (850) 487-5166
    Sen. Steve Wise (R) (850) 487-5027

    BACKGROUND:

    The bill will stop business entities from searching private vehicles and violating the constitutional rights of customers and employees.

    Your Second Amendment rights are at the very heart of this issue. In addition to prohibiting searches of private vehicles in parking lots. The bills also prevent businesses from asking customers or employees to disclose what personal private property is stored in a private vehicle and prevents action against customers and employees who refuse to divulge that private information. Further, it prohibits action against a customer or employee based on information provided by a third party.

    Some Florida businesses are trying to ban guns in cars in parking lot used by customers and employees. They are discriminating against people who exercise their constitutional rights – they are violating the constitutional rights of gun owners and Florida law.

    Corporate giants have been trampling constitutional rights. Some are even attempting to coerce and intimidate gunowners into giving up constitutional rights as a condition of employment.

    Your Rights are in Danger

    Carrying firearms in a vehicle for hunting, target shooting or protection of yourself and your family obviously means you can leave that firearm locked in the vehicle in a parking lot when you go grocery shopping, to the doctor's office, to the movie, to visit a sick friend in the hospital, to rent a movie, to the shoe store or anywhere else normal people travel to conduct business.

    Florida law, the U.S. Constitution, and the Florida Constitution clearly and unequivocally give law abiding citizens to have firearms in their vehicles for lawful purposes.

    How can anyone justify telling a woman who is being stalked that she can't have a firearm for protection? In many cases police tell these women to get a gun for protection because police can't be there to protect her -- and calling 911 is nothing more than government sponsored dial-a-prayer.

    A business owner or manager has no more right to say you can't have a firearm in your private vehicle than they have a right to say you can't have a pair of sun glasses, an umbrella, a Bible or a baby seat.

    Such an anti-gun political exercise is not good business sense. They want your money but don't respect your rights.

    Businesses are not allowed to discriminate against employees and customers because of race, religion, political party, color of eyes, hair or weight. And they certainly can't discriminate because of the exercise of lawful self-defense. And, make no mistake, these gun ban policies are blatant discrimination against people who chose to exercise a constitutional right and take responsibility for their own safety.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

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    i AGREE 100% AT THE PORTS THEY DONT LET YOU OF COURSE THE ARE UNDER FEDERAL LAWS BUT STILL FOR SOMEONE THAT COMMUTES FOR AND AT NIGHT.....
    "You can say 'stop' or 'alto' or use any other word you think will work but I've found that a large bore muzzle pointed at someone's head is pretty much the universal language."

    NRA Member
    GeorgiaCarry.org

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    Time To E-mail Again...

    I'll be busy this weekend...

    Stay armed...stay safe!

    ret
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

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    NRA Life Member[/B]

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    Senior Member Array MilitaryPower's Avatar
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    Who's first?
    Gun control can be blamed in part for allowing 9/11 to happen.
    "Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum" (Latin)- "If you want peace, prepare for war".

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    Member Array Bryan's Avatar
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    This is going to be a hot topic as many here believe in corporate rights and contracts over natural self defence issues. Thats why I will stay away from discussing this one.
    -Diplomacy: The art of saying nice dogie until you can find a rock.
    -The truth is a three edged sword.
    -Your brain is your primary weapon everything else is just a tool.
    -When the only tool you have is a hammer then everything starts to look like a nail.

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    I used www.myflorida.com to locate my senator, Jeff Atwater. (Republican) I don't know what his record on gun rights is at present.

    I sent the following email to him. He is not one of the names on the list posted in this thread, though. What is that list, people who are on the committee that is going to send this to a vote or not? How do I find out which of those people is (possibly) directly someone whose district I vote in?

    Anyway, here's my email, and if you like it, please feel free to use it and modify it to suit your style.

    I write today urging you to support SB 2356 "Individual Personal Private Property Protection Act of 2007" to protect the rights of average citizens from employers' rules that encroach on the citizens' right to protect themselves.

    In Florida, the law allowing citizens to be licensed to carry concealed firearms is an outstanding success. Hundreds of thousands of people have been licensed under this law, and they are able to protect themselves and their loved ones from criminals.

    But currently, employers are able to pass onerous rules that ban firearms from the workplace -- a wrongheaded policy that really has no ability to make anyone safer from workplace violence. (Rather, it ensures a "criminal-protection zone" exists where none of the good people will legally have the means to defend against violent attack.)

    Beyond that, some employers actually ban workers from possessing legal firearms in their vehicles while parked at work. Thus the employees are not only prohibited from having means of protection (a legal firearm) while in the office, they are also prohibited from having that protection on the commute to and from work!

    This is unacceptable. That is why I implore you to support SB 2356 "Individual Personal Private Property Protection Act of 2007" which addresses this deplorable situation.

    Blue skies.

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    Senior Member Array MilitaryPower's Avatar
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    How is this?

    Dear fellow Floridians,

    I am writing to you because I am concerned about the encroachment of my rights as an American citizen. For far too long, employers have had the ability to search employee's personal vehicles and property for items that they may consider prohibited. Items such as firearms, which under Florida law may be kept in vehicles, are often prohibited on company property. Company policies which allow the search of personal property and termination of employees because they choose to use their given right to bear arms in order to protect themselves, need to find a much needed end. Not only are the companies keeping employees from having a firearm in their vehicle, but on the way to and from work as well. It is clear that these companies do not care for the safety and well-being of their employees, and they do not care that they are trampling some of the rights that have made this country so great.

    Those of use who value our lives greatly and have feared prosecution for being prepared to act in defense of them have looked forward to a legislative action like SB-2356 and HB-1417 for a long time. With these bills passed, employees who invoke the Second Amendment for self-protection need not be discriminated against. Please support these bills strongly as it greatly affects many, many Floridians including myself and one day my life might just depend on it.

    Sincerely,

    Should I put my full name?
    Gun control can be blamed in part for allowing 9/11 to happen.
    "Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum" (Latin)- "If you want peace, prepare for war".

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    Full name, address and phone number. That is the standard or pretty much gets ignored. Also send it via email, fax and letter if you can.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

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    Hold Them True To Their Own Words / Laws

    Here's the letter I'm sending. Feel free to copy-use if desired:

    Dear

    I am writing to you requesting and urging your support for passage of SB 2356 "Individual Personal Private Property Protection Act of 2007". My reasons for doing so are as follows:

    • I am a full-time Florida resident citizen and homeowner, and anticipate being so for the rest of my life. The same is true for my coresident wife.

    • I am presently 52 years of age. I have been legally licensed to carry concealed handguns for lawful self-defense purposes in the states of New York, New Jersey and Florida since age 21, for the past 31 consecutive years. I have never been accused of, much less convicted of, any crime. My lawful keeping and bearing of firearms for personal self-defense purposes has never resulted in wrongful harm or injury to any human being.

    • My 51-year-old wife is also legally licensed in the state of Florida to carry concealed handguns for lawful self-defense purposes. In similar fashion, she has never been accused or convicted of any crime whatsoever. Her keeping and bearing of firearms for lawful self-defense purposes has never resulted in wrongful harm or injury to any human being.

    • There are thousands upon thousands of similar law-abiding residents of Florida licensed to carry self-defensive firearms under F.S. Chapter 790 who similarly exercise their Federal and State constitutional rights to self-defense in a wholly lawful manner, without adverse detrimental impact to other peaceable, lawful residents of this State. In fact, this is a well-known and well-proven, significant deterrent to violent felony crime commissions in this state, and thus benefits our State’s society and lawful citizenry as a whole.

    • I have been a victim of violent crime in the past. I have also seen first-hand the horrible physical and psychological trauma of violent crime inflicted upon a loved one, who was abducted and raped, horrifically brutalized for hours on end, in manners and fashions and to an extent and degree that is simply unthinkable and incomprehensible to any moral-minded human being.

    • I believe the only “Victim’s Right” that truly exists is the right to enjoy life, liberty and pursuit of happiness peaceably, unmolested, without becoming a Victim of a violent Criminal Predator in the first place . . . at any time, at any location, or for any reason. As such, should the need or occasion arise, in lawful defense of my or my loved one’s personal life, safety, health, welfare and well-being, the ability and means to immediately, decisively, adequately, and effectively defend that which is my lawful right to defend is imperative... thus, when personal safety and Life itself is at stake, failure is simply not an option at all.

    • The preceding facts above are a large part of the inducement I had in choosing to live in this wonderful “Sunshine State”, because historically, for my concerns, a major part of its valued “sunshine” has been this State’s consistent historical, moral, forward-thinking Legislative enactments concerning the right to lawful-self defense by law-abiding citizens, and the Legislative Statutes which enable the citizenry to effectively exercise their right of lawful self-defense if, where and when needed, 24-7-365. To wit:

    • In pertinent part, our Florida Constitution states, (Article 1, Declaration Of Rights): Section 8: “Right to bear arms. (a) The right of the people to keep and bear arms in defense of themselves and of the lawful authority of the state shall not be infringed, except that the manner of bearing arms may be regulated by law”.

    • In the legislative preamble to F.S. 776.013, the Florida Legislature stated, in pertinent part: “WHEREAS, the Legislature finds that it is proper for law-abiding people to protect themselves, their families, and others from intruders and attackers without fear of prosecution or civil action for acting in defense of themselves and others, and WHEREAS, the castle doctrine is a common-law doctrine of ancient origins which declares that a person’s home is his or her castle, and WHEREAS, Section 8 of Article I of the State Constitution guarantees the right of the people to bear arms in defense of themselves, and WHEREAS, the persons residing in or visiting this state have a right to expect to remain unmolested within their homes or vehicles, and WHEREAS, no person or victim of crime should be required to surrender his or her personal safety to a criminal, nor should a person or victim be required to needlessly retreat in the face of intrusion or attack, NOW, THEREFORE, Be It Enacted by the Legislature of the State of Florida: Section 1. Section 776.013, Florida Statutes, is created to read:” . . . (Emphasis added).

    • Clearly, it has been this State’s historical and habitual legislative intent and procedure to allow lawful resident citizens, even lawful non-resident citizens, visitors, tourists, etc. to carry firearms within their vehicles in a manner as proscribed by law whether CWF-licensed under F.S. Chapter 790 or not.

    • Clearly, the practice of some property owners and business owners prohibiting employees, visitors, business invitees etc. from possessing lawfully owned and lawfully carried firearms within their own vehicles in common-use, public parking lots owned, maintained and controlled by the property or business owner contravenes not only the aforementioned Legislative intent, but also contravenes and violates said citizen’s constitutional rights under both Federal and State constitutional law.

    • I do recognize a property owner or business owner’s right to regulate practices within their enclosed building and place of business to a degree and extent as deemed fit by the Legislature as long as it does not abrogate or abridge citizen’s Rights. However, by denying such citizens the right and ability to keep and store lawfully-owned firearms even within a properly-locked and secured vehicle within common-use public or private parking lots is clearly abridging the citizen’s right to lawful self-defense while traveling to or from the subject location. As such, said property or business owners are in fact creating “de facto” legislation affecting their employees and visitors which clearly contravenes both Legislative Intent of the Florida Constitution, F.S. Chapter 790 and F.S. 776.013. The threat to such affected persons is very real, not only from violent Criminal Predators, but also from the enforcement actions of Employers concerning termination of gainful employment, loss of retirement and pension benefits, etc.

    • I therefore respectfully urge and request you to support passage of SB 2356, and solicit your responsive thoughts and advices concerning your intended support or opposition thereto.

    Sincerely yours,
    Last edited by RTC1911; March 25th, 2007 at 03:39 PM.

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