Continuing Proof Gun Bans Don't Work

Continuing Proof Gun Bans Don't Work

This is a discussion on Continuing Proof Gun Bans Don't Work within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; This is no surprise to us but everyone should learn from this example:

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Thread: Continuing Proof Gun Bans Don't Work

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array ronwill's Avatar
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    Jun 2006

    Continuing Proof Gun Bans Don't Work

    This is no surprise to us but everyone should learn from this example:

  2. #2
    VIP Member Array edr9x23super's Avatar
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    Jun 2006
    I emailed this article to all of my liberal brethren.....I eagerly await the shocked responses......
    "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined". - Patrick Henry

  3. #3
    Distinguished Member Array P7fanatic's Avatar
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    Jun 2007
    Texan in NWFlorida


    Almost 5 years old. The left and the media sure doesn't want people to see this do they?
    The way I read this is it'd be quicker and easier for the English government just to make it law that all must go to the nearest hospital (social medicine) for their mandatory lobotomy. Then society will be easier for government, the courts and the police to manage. Of course we all know that it'd only be the law abiding citizens that went in for the surgery.

    Thanks for posting.

    GOOD GUN CONTROL Is Being Able To Hit Your Target!

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  5. #4
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Nov 2005
    Yep, it's dated and the time frame was only five years out.
    If someone sent that to me (and I were ignorant of the truth about England crime) I'd respond; 'Yeah so what? The article was written when the laws had been only 5 yrs. old and nothing happens over night. The time frame is too short.'
    As well I'd add; 'The article is dated being five years old (!)'.

    I do happen to know about Englands current crime situation ten yrs. out and yes it is actually worst than it was 5 yrs. ago, but an anti/doubting Thomas is not going to know this.
    There was a huge thread about England and it's crime wave current and past along with multiple posts from folks, including myself, featuring articles and hard facts as well as easy to read statistics with credible sources provided therein that was running for over 2 months just a couple months ago.
    Run a search on the keywords 'England and NationMaster' against my name and this thread should come up. It is full of very interesting and timely reading with many news links that you can forward to your anti friends against this subject.

    It will be much more difficult for them to refute as much when the references are modern (circa 2007) and sourced from folk like BBC.UK (news reports) and The World Health Organizations own bureau of crime and criminality reporting to the UN (stone cold unbiased not from the NRA or Brady Bunch facts).

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  6. #5
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Nov 2005

    Weapons sell for just £50 as suspects and victims grow ever younger

    Note: The following is a current article reflecting the troubles that the UK are having toward crime as a result of the '97 firearms law revision.


    As reported by the Times Online (UK):

    From The Times
    August 24, 2007
    Weapons sell for just £50 as suspects and victims grow ever younger

    Richard Ford, Home Correspondent and Philip Webster, Political Editor

    Senior police officers have been warning for several months that a growing number of teenagers in big cities are becoming involved in gun crime.

    The age of victims and suspects has fallen over the past three years as the availability of firearms in some cities has risen. Liverpool and Manchester are the cities where illegal guns are most readily available, with criminals claiming that some weapons are being smuggled from Ireland. Sawn-off shotguns are now being sold for as little as £50, and handguns for £150.

    Despite a ban on handguns introduced in 1997 after 16 children and their teacher were shot dead in the Dunblane massacre the previous year, their use in crimes has almost doubled to reach 4,671 in 2005-06. Official figures show that although Britain has some of the toughest anti-gun laws in the world, firearm use in crime has risen steadily. This year eight young people have been killed in gun attacks: six in London and one each in Manchester and Liverpool.

    “Illegal firearms have become increasingly accessible to younger offenders who appear more likely to use these firearms recklessly,” a report on gun crime commissioned by the Home Office cautioned last year.

    The research supports warnings from police chiefs in Merseyside and London about the spread of gun use in gangs and among teenagers.

    Bernard Hogan-Howe, the Chief Constable of Merseyside, said this year that although gun crime in the area had fallen there had been an increase in the number of teenagers involved in firearms crimes.

    Figures from the Metropolitan Police show that the average age of gun crime victims in London fell from 24 to 19 between 2004-06 and that there was a similar trend among suspects charged in connection with shootings.

    Mr Hogan-Howe said that youths were being protected by a wall of silence, and he demanded a new law to compel the public to give information about gun crime. He said that action must be taken to break down the power base of families involved in gun crime. “Families who do nothing to stop their children’s involvement in gun crime put society at risk and could find themselves identifying their child in the morgue,” he said.

    The Home Office research highlighted how guns were an integral part of a gang culture in which guns were used to deal with disputes. “In the context of firearm ownership, even quite trivial disputes may result in shootings as the presence of guns elevates threat levels and the so-called ‘shoot or be shot’ scenario precipitates pre-emptive violence,” the study said.

    Policies to help to deal with the problem were considered at a scheduled No 10 summit yesterday, chaired by Gordon Brown and attended by Jacqui Smith, the Home Secretary, Beverley Hughes, the Children’s Minister, Lord Hunt, the Justice Minister, as well as police chiefs and local government leaders.

    It was the first of a series of meetings to tackle the issue. Mandatory minimum jail sentences for carrying knives and requiring people to give information if they are aware that people have illegal weapons are among the ideas under discussion. Mrs Smith has asked the Serious Organised Crime Agency to look atways to curb the importation of illegal weapons.

    After the 90-minute meeting, the Prime Minister said: “Make no mistake about this — the people responsible will be tracked down, they will be arrested and they will be punished.” He said that the Home Office would be earmarking ten areas for an intensive campaign against gun and knife crime. The areas will be announced next week.

    Mr Brown added that families would be offered greater support. “The vast majority of young people are decent and law-abiding. They too want to feel safe and secure on our streets. Where there’s a need for early intervention, we will work very intensively with those families so that young people are deterred from going into gangs and guns and knife crime,” he said.

    Mrs Smith has outlined a range of measures, including the increased use of Acceptable Behaviour Contracts and a crackdown on the sale of alcohol to under-age children. The Government has issued guidance to police and local authorities on how to use the contracts — written pledges to improve behaviour — effectively.

    David Cameron said that social breakdown would be the central theme of the Conservative election manifesto. Sir Menzies Campbell, leader of the Liberal Democrats, called for a “change of atmosphere” in communities with gang violence, but said that there was “no simple solution”.

    A year in Merseyside


    gun crime incidents in 2005-06




    attempted murders

    Source: Merseyside Police Authority

    The article can be found at;

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array BigEFan's Avatar
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    Aug 2007
    Central California
    Nice Find Janq. Very useful info.
    Lex et Libertas — Semper Vigilo, Fortis, Paratus, et Fidelis!

    "Not only do the people who put their lives on the line to protect the rest of us deserve better, we all deserve better than to have our own security undermined by those who undermine law enforcement." -Thomas Sowell

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