February 12th, 2008 04:40 PM
Wow, this post got busy!
Background: I've hunted quail, dove, duck, pheasants and deer.
I do not really have a stake in this matter, I'm not a ranger, nor do I belong to any wildlife protection organization.
I agree with self-protection, and the right to own firearms.
Somehow in the posts, there seems to be a lack of emphasis on what a National Park is. TR started it as a preserve, seeing the shrinking wilderness and knowing that wildlife habitat is not infinite.
One post brought up an interesting suggestion that people are tasty morsels. I tend to believe that people taste more in line with the way they act...
My experiences in Yosemite, hiking the trails for over 5 years, was that I saw one bear, he had so many tags and monitoring equipment, he looked like a low power FM station - Not to say there was not a pucker factor, but he was not hungry and I was not armed.
I am sure I will not change a single mind, all I ask is that we keep in mind, we are in their territory.
Last edited by GBS; February 12th, 2008 at 06:14 PM.
February 12th, 2008 05:59 PM
While President Bush is still Commander in Chief I suggest that he remove a bunch of these anti-second ammendment people from the Park Ranger service.
Life member NRA since 1983
I carry a Kimber Ultra Carry II in a Crossbreed SuperTuck. My wife carries a Walther PPS .40 w/Crossbreed holster.
February 12th, 2008 06:15 PM
What you say is very strange, and gives me reason to wonder how much you have been in the wilderness areas and national parks. I have been back packing in federal wilderness areas for over 35 years where the carrying of firearms are permitted. I have never seen anyone hunting unlawfully or out of season, or for that matter abusing fire arms carrying privileges. Maybe it is a hazard in your particular area, but not in the rocky mountains.
Originally Posted by GBS
Some national parks are larger than the designated wilderness areas. Based upon your reasoning (hunting), please tell me why the federal laws for areas regulated by the Department of Agriculture and the areas regulated by the Department of Interior should be different.
February 12th, 2008 06:48 PM
Please consider for one moment that this whole issue has nothing to do with any animal whatsoever.
Originally Posted by GBS
Every year people are raped, beaten and murdered in the most shocking ways imaginable in national parks.
The whole idea is that we have the right to protect ourselves from HUMAN violence. Even in national parks.
February 12th, 2008 07:12 PM
It's real easy to say you don't want other people to be able to carry a gun when you get to carry one...
I wish I was the only person in the world who got to carry one too. But who says I have a right to do that?
Its not about "Their Parks" or "Their Job" its about our right to defend ourselves in OUR PARKS.
February 12th, 2008 07:23 PM
Right now, what a national park is...
Somehow in the posts, there seems to be a lack of emphasis on what a National Park is
...is a target rich environment that gives any crack dealer,meth lab technician or thug has the upper hand against anyone that they encounter because they know that people aren't armed.
Do you think for a minute that Teddy Roosevelt would have advocated going into the wilderness unarmed? I don't. He was more of a man than that. It was common sense for people back then. Unfortunately today that is not true.
I am 100 percent against gun free zones.
Gun free zones are nothing more than feel good areas that get people killed.
Gun free zones simply do not work.
Unless you go on a killing spree. They work quite well for that.
I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.
AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
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February 12th, 2008 09:35 PM
This has been a recent subject in the Second Amendment section here ! Look it up under S-2483, it may come up for consideration this week. Your Senators need to know your position. As leader of the Senate, also contact the Vice-President. We need to get this through as soon as possible ! Thanks for your help. All the links are provided in that section for your reps.
February 12th, 2008 10:32 PM
GBS----If I understand your position correctly, you are ok with CCW out-side of parks, you trust the permit holder to use good judgement in not shooting a human, but in the park you think their judgement will be impaired and they may shoot an animal, which you think would be worse????? Why would you extend more protection to an animal than a human???
Outside of court-houses, I can see no reason for restriction of CCW.
An ounce of lead is worth 200lbs of cop.
February 12th, 2008 10:35 PM
Originally Posted by GBS
I guess my take on all this is influenced by some of the research that someone on the forum (Rock & Glock, maybe?) did about the number of crimes in National Parks (and especially against rangers) and the lack of law enforcement available when stuff happens due to rangers having huge areas to cover.
For me, the issue is my safety, not hunting. If I am going to hunt, I want a rifle. In fact, if I have to protect my life I want a rifle. But, at least a handgun gives me some protection from 2-legged predators.
I want to be armed everywhere I go, not because I EXPECT trouble, but because I am PREPARED for it should it come my way.
He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliott
The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it.
February 12th, 2008 11:01 PM
You may be correct. He is an instructor at a university in central California, which coincidentally is the area where Berkley is located. His belief that a CCW goes into "hunt mode" while in a National Park is tantamount to saying that a combat veteran is in a "kill mode" while walking down the street as a civilian and seeing human targets.
Last edited by QKShooter; February 12th, 2008 at 11:54 PM.
Reason: edit to remove quoted text
February 13th, 2008 12:03 AM
We do not attack other forum members here with name calling.
Feel free to disagree with the message but, do not slander the messenger.
If you call another forum member names or attack another member on a personal level you know those comments are just going to be deleted anyway so why make work for the moderators?
Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ
February 13th, 2008 02:26 AM
If I gave the impression that I am 'standing in the way' of people carrying in the parks, I apologize.
My comments were not intended to stir anyone up.
I have given my personal opinion on the subject, as a matter for discussion.
I'm not a political person, I have no influence on the outcome.
I have read all replys and found most have merit.
One post was absolutely right, I had accidentally blurred the line between hunters and poachers, but if I attempt to clarify I am sure I will upset others.
Thank you for sharing your viewpoints.
BTW: Bizerkley is about 4 hours away, I teach at a private university.
And yes, I do have parents...
February 13th, 2008 10:43 AM
I can't wait to start poaching black bears with my G23. Cmon NPS changes.
...He suggested that "every American citizen" should own a rifle and train with it on firing ranges "at every courthouse." -Chesty Puller
February 13th, 2008 11:08 AM
Forget the black bears... going to get me one of them there wolves in Yellowstone that I hear so much about with my G26. Yee haw!!!!
Originally Posted by SammyIamToday
-"I may get killed with my own gun, but he's gonna have to beat me to death with it, 'cause it's going to be empty." -Clint Smith
February 13th, 2008 11:54 AM
This makes sense because if I am going to break the law and poach of course I am not going to do it where no firearms allowed signs are posted.
The people in charge of this country have all lost their minds.
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