How many relate the first and second amendments?

This is a discussion on How many relate the first and second amendments? within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Just like to know how many of us second amendment advocates are just as adamant about the first amendment here....

View Poll Results: How many of us 2nd amendment advocates feel the same about the 1st?

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  • I'm only concerned with my 2nd amendment rights but enjoy speaking freely about that

    4 3.60%
  • The first amendment is the opener to us having this discussion in the first place

    9 8.11%
  • The 1st and 2nd amendments are equally important

    95 85.59%
  • I think the 1st amendment sometimes infringes on my 2nd amendment rights

    3 2.70%
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Thread: How many relate the first and second amendments?

  1. #1
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    How many relate the first and second amendments?

    Just like to know how many of us second amendment advocates are just as adamant about the first amendment here.

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  3. #2
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    So far it looks like 100% feel the same about both the 1st and 2nd.

  4. #3
    Distinguished Member Array SixBravo's Avatar
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    The Bill of Rights is not a buffet. We cannot 'pick and choose' which we think are okay. It's all or nothing.
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    "It is enough to note, as we have observed, that the American people have considered the handgun to be the quintessential self-defense weapon." - Justice Scalia, SCOTUS - DC v Heller - 26 JUN 2008

  5. #4
    Member Array DocRhino's Avatar
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    +1 on all of our rights being equally important....

    After we get 2A on everyone's board, let's start on the 9th and 10th
    When you think of the long and gloomy history of man, you will find more hideous crimes have been committed in the name of obedience than have ever been committed in the name of rebellion. - C. P. Snow

  6. #5
    Senior Member Array stanislaskasava's Avatar
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    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
    The Second seems broader than the First. It's blunt, broad and beautiful.

    Perhaps I'm missing something, but it looks like the First Amendment is aimed specifically at Congress. Does it apply to all other lawmakers as well?

    Anyone have a link that will explain it for me?

  7. #6
    Senior Member Array stanislaskasava's Avatar
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    Answered my own question:

    faqs

    Earlier in our history, however, the First Amendment did not apply to the states -- and thus not to public schools. When adopted in 1791, the First Amendment applied only to Congress and the federal government ("Congress shall make no law . . ."). This meant that when public schools were founded in the mid-19th century, students could not make First Amendment claims against the actions of school officials.

    The restrictions on student speech lasted into the 20th century. In 1908, for example, the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that school officials could suspend two students for writing a poem ridiculing their teachers that was published in a local newspaper.1 The Wisconsin court reasoned, "such power is essential to the preservation of order, decency, decorum, and good government in the public schools." And in 1915, the California Court of Appeals ruled that school officials could suspend a student for criticizing and "slamming" school officials in a student assembly speech.2

    In fact, despite the passage of the 14th Amendment in 1868, which provides that "no state shall . . . deprive any person of life, liberty or property without due process of law . . . ", it was not until 1925, by way of the Supreme Court case of Gitlow v. New York, that the Supreme Court held that the freedom of speech guaranteed by the First Amendment is one of the "liberties" incorporated by the Due Process Clause of the 14th Amendment.

    In subsequent cases, the Court has applied all of the freedoms of the First Amendment to the states -- and thus to public schools -- through the 14th Amendment. But not until 1943, in the flag-salute case of West Virginia v. Barnette,3 did the U.S. Supreme Court explicitly extend First Amendment protection to students attending public schools.

  8. #7
    Distinguished Member Array P7fanatic's Avatar
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by SixBravo View Post
    The Bill of Rights is not a buffet. We cannot 'pick and choose' which we think are okay. It's all or nothing.
    Oh my, that sounds so logical.
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  9. #8
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    I voted 'equal', but don't you think that 2A guarantees 1A...
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  10. #9
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    The fourth choice should have actually read: 'infringes'
    I think the 1st amendment sometimes (fringes) on my 2nd amendment rights.
    Thanks

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ram Rod View Post
    The fourth choice should have actually read: 'infringes'
    I think the 1st amendment sometimes (fringes) on my 2nd amendment rights.
    Thanks
    Fixed it.

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  12. #11
    Distinguished Member Array lacrosse50's Avatar
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    Can't really have one without the other.
    The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
    -Herbert Spencer

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  13. #12
    VIP Member Array Kerbouchard's Avatar
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    There is a signature floating around, maybe somebody will post it, but it says something to the effect of "The 2nd admendment allows us to guarantee the first. First the 2nd admendment will be taken away, and then the 1st". I voted option 2 "The first amendment is the opener to us having this discussion in the first place ", because it's true. They are equally important, in that the 2nd allows us to rise up against an invasion, or a oppressive gov't, but without the first, we wouldn't be able to voice or communicate the oppressiveness of a gov't in the first place. And without the freedom of press and communication, an invasion could well take place without half the country even knowing about it. They are both essential, which is why they were placed where they were in the Bill of Rights.
    There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil.

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  14. #13
    Senior Member Array wht06rado's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixBravo View Post
    The Bill of Rights is not a buffet. We cannot 'pick and choose' which we think are okay. It's all or nothing.
    I agree 100%. The Second Amendment protects the rest of our rights from being infringed by a tyranical government.
    “They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security” Benjamin Franklin
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  15. #14
    VIP Member Array edr9x23super's Avatar
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    Acutally, if you read into the history of our constitution, you will find that the there was some discourse between Madison and the other framers about the the 2 amendments; the original draft of our constitution had the the RKBA as the first amendment, followed by freedom of speech. it was basically a political agreement to draft the constitution as it is today.

    But I have always believed that the 2nd amendment has allowed the others to exist; anyone who disbelieves this, can read the bottom of my post and see what is written there to gain a clearer understanding......
    "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined". - Patrick Henry

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array friesepferd's Avatar
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    i hold some amendments closer than others, but in the long run they are all equally important, because once some of them go, they all go
    Wo die Notwehr aufhört, fängt der Mord an
    (Murder begins where self-defense ends)
    Georg Büchner

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