Reasonable Gun Control

This is a discussion on Reasonable Gun Control within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by PaulJ The problem I am having, and the reason I started this thread, is that I for example will not join the ...

Page 2 of 8 FirstFirst 123456 ... LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 115

Thread: Reasonable Gun Control

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Kommie-fornia-stan
    Posts
    7,036
    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    The problem I am having, and the reason I started this thread, is that I for example will not join the NRA. I think what we need is an open an honest discussion of gun rights and responsibilities.
    Guns do not have rights. People do. Secondly, i think this forum provides for the open and honest discussion of gun laws. The problem is, the other side refuses to acknowledge facts and uses emotion and questionable statistics to make their point.

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    If you look at any right provided by the constitution, it is controlled by laws.
    The U.S. Constitution does not provide rights. It guarentees rights and (is supposed to) limit government.

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    The 2nd. amendment should not be any different. As you have a right to carry, so I have a right to walk into Walmart without being afraid that a new rightful but untrained gun owner is practicing quick draws while enjoying his Nachos.
    Brandishing a firearm as you have described is already against the law. So what's your deal?

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    If you think its a good idea for everybody to carry, wouldn't it be a good idea for everybody to understand gun safety?
    I do not believe it is a good idea for everybody to carry. I believe everyone should have the choice to carry or not. Like any other tool (like a table saw), one should read the instructions. Someone who refuses to learn and follow the law and proper gun safety should suffer the consequences. There is nothing preventing me from buying an impact drill--should Home Depot provide me training, or should I read the instructions?

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    the US does have laws regulating birth control / abortion.
    But do you have to go through mandatory training to make babies?

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    I agree on the politician. As far as the police officer (or someone else mentioned military) goes: Are you willing to go thorugh the same training and qualify once a year?
    I think the training should be available to the public, but not required.
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

    martyr is a fancy name for crappy fighter
    You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #17
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Kommie-fornia-stan
    Posts
    7,036
    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    fellons are for example denied the right to vote.
    And?

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    There are some limits already established for driving. Why not take the same limit? Keeps things simple and the limits used for driving are well established.
    OK.

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    or being of a certain age to vote?
    See U.S. Constitution, 26th Amendment.

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    Rights are regularly regulated in order to avoid conflicts with the rights of others.
    The problem is, the vocal minority determines what the majority should do. Your "right" to not have guns in schools (and other gun-free zones) infringes on my right to keep and bear arms in school. So here you have "reasonable" gun control, yet, shootings still happen in schools (and other gun-free zones). What about life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness? (see Declaration of Independence)

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    Do you vote for a politician, even if the particular person does not allow you to attend their rally armed?
    Personal choice who I vote for. The question is, why should I trust the politician with my vote if he doesn't trust me to exercise ALL of my rights, but only the ones he/she agrees with?
    Last edited by SIGguy229; June 3rd, 2008 at 06:35 PM.
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

    martyr is a fancy name for crappy fighter
    You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know

  4. #18
    Senior Member Array PaulJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    616
    Guns do not have rights. People do.
    semantic isn't an argument. I call it gun control. You may call it concealed carry control.

    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    Brandishing a firearm as you have described is already against the law. So what's your deal?

    This was in response to the need for training.

    I live in Florida, and do see Florida as a "model". But the emotional arguments made against gun control in this forum are used against gun owner ship. For example, the refusal to accept mandatory training will feed the fear mongering. Florida for example is quite open in accepting training provided by other states, armed forces and so on.
    I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. (Thomas Jefferson)

  5. #19
    Senior Member Array PaulJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    616
    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    The problem is, the vocal minority determines what the majority should do.
    In a "pro gun" state like Florida, only a few percent (I think it was 3%) bother to have a concealed carry permit. The number actually carrying is probably a lot smaller.
    I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. (Thomas Jefferson)

  6. #20
    Senior Member Array Free American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    749
    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post

    If you look at any right provided by the constitution,
    The constitution does not provide rights, I have them with or without that document...it simply GUARANTEES that right.

    I wish more people would understand this fact.
    They who give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin


    Previously known as "cjm5874"

  7. #21
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Kommie-fornia-stan
    Posts
    7,036
    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    semantic isn't an argument. I call it gun control. You may call it concealed carry control.
    The intent is to control criminal behavior, yet, the only person who is impacted is the legal gun owner/purchaser. It is about control.

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulJ View Post
    I live in Florida, and do see Florida as a "model". But the emotional arguments made against gun control in this forum are used against gun owner ship. For example, the refusal to accept mandatory training will feed the fear mongering. Florida for example is quite open in accepting training provided by other states, armed forces and so on.
    You stand where you sit.

    Try Vermont or Alaska--how many mass shootings have there been there? no permit, no training required.

    Also, look at VA. The VA Tech incident could have been prevented had the school administration used all of the law available to them, versus using the Cliff notes. Also the University's policies (not state law) prohibited students, staff, and faculty from carrying a firearm, thereby making it a criminal empowerment zone (aka GFZ).
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

    martyr is a fancy name for crappy fighter
    You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know

  8. #22
    VIP Member Array Tubby45's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Making ammo.
    Posts
    3,047
    Quote Originally Posted by Free American View Post
    The constitution does not provide rights, I have them with or without that document...it simply GUARANTEES that right.

    I wish more people would understand this fact.
    The Constitution does not guarantee rights. It states which rights the government cannot violate. Rights are granted by the simple status of being a living human being. Rights are never guaranteed.
    07/02 FFL/SOT since 2006

  9. #23
    Senior Member Array hudsonvalley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    lower hudson valley ny
    Posts
    849
    Gun Control means using both hands........okay, enough bumper sticker humor........RIGHTS are given by God...I have no problem with Government asking that those who wish to purchase are law abiding citizens of age. If you can join the army and haven't been to jail, own a gun. As far as knowledge of the firearm.....personal responsibility is something society has been lacking lately. I will guarantee that if you are at a range or club and point your gun at someone, people will definitely explain things to you. Either verbally or by doing the same.
    Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives.
    ---Ronald Reagan

  10. #24
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    VA
    Posts
    4,210
    Sigguy has already responded much better than I could, but I would also ask this about your convicted felon statement:

    What about them? If they're so dangerous as to fear allowing them to keep and potentially bear arms ...why then pray tell are they out on the street free to roam? Fix the root issues. Don't keep adding more insanity to the asylum.

    It doesn't take much in this day and age to become a convicted felon...and have nothing to do with being dangerous or murderous or anything else of the sort...Folks like Martha Stewart being case in point. She sold her stocks based on insider info in order to avoid a loss. Not exactly a danger to society. Yet she is a "convicted felon" that now is denied her right to defend her own life.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the **** out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

  11. #25
    Moderator
    Array RETSUPT99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    44,418
    No gun laws...

    Only 'criminal control'...

    Everyone get to own a gun...do something stupid with it...you pay the price...a heavy price...

    Gun laws only effect honest people...making more of them (gun laws) has no effect on the criminal...

    Do I think gun owners should take pistol SD courses? Yes!
    But why should gun owners be FORCED to train?...you don't force criminals to train...the individual makes the choice, not another law stating so...

    I do not fear law-abiding gun owners, whether they train or not...

    I do fear criminals...whether THEY train or not...

    Stay armed...take a pistol SD course...stay safe!
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

    ***********************************
    Certified Glock Armorer
    NRA Life Member[/B]

  12. #26
    Member Array Arisin Wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    450
    "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the PEOPLE to keep and bear Arms, may be reasonably infringed upon."

    Not.
    Be not far from me, for trouble is near; For there is none to help. psalm22:11

  13. #27
    Senior Member Array TheGreatGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    1,086
    Quote Originally Posted by Arisin Wind View Post
    "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the PEOPLE to keep and bear Arms...
    Arisin Wind,
    Forgive me for clipping your statement in your post, but I only wanted to address the actual wording, not your tounge-in-cheek addition ...

    So, what does "well regulated" mean?
    Gonzo
    "Skin that smokewagon!".

  14. #28
    BAC
    BAC is offline
    VIP Member Array BAC's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    2,292
    Laws that do not prevent me, as a U.S. citizen, from keeping and bearing arms as per my constitutionally-recognized right, are reasonable. Examples of which would include:

    • Congress outlining minimum training requirements, provided they aren't prohibitive and are publicly funded.
      • States with more intensive training requirements (there will be some) would still be reasonable, provided they covered the difference and their requirements were not prohibitive.
    • Congress including annual requalifications (see "well-regulated" comment above), provided they aren't prohibitive and are publicly funded if state-sponsored and not privately-sponsored.
      • States with more intensive requalifications (there will be some) would still be reasonable, provided they covered the difference and the requalifications were not prohitibive.


    I'm sure there are other examples that I can't bring to mind right now, but you get the idea. If it's not prohibitive of one's right to keep and bear arms, it's not unconstitutional. Much of what exists is prohibitive, either directly or indirectly, some of it even accidentally (meant not to be but turned out to be).


    -B
    Last edited by BAC; June 4th, 2008 at 12:43 AM. Reason: Langauage and deletion of state-specific contents

  15. #29
    Senior Member Array DPro.40's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    611
    Reasonable gun control is 9 out of 10 on the X ring at 25 yards. What's called reasonable usually involves a back door to stealing just a bit more of our rights. Enforce the current laws on the books.
    Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same.
    Ronald Reagan

  16. #30
    BAC
    BAC is offline
    VIP Member Array BAC's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    2,292
    Quote Originally Posted by DPro.40 View Post
    Enforce the current laws on the books.
    I disagree. Most of the current laws on the books are unconstitutional. Why would we want to enforce these?


    -B

Page 2 of 8 FirstFirst 123456 ... LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Looking for a S&W 637 whats a reasonable price?
    By rainyday in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: September 27th, 2009, 12:39 PM
  2. Police chief says something reasonable about bad cop
    By paramedic70002 in forum Off Topic & Humor Discussion
    Replies: 61
    Last Post: April 1st, 2009, 09:23 PM
  3. Reasonable Restrictions
    By 2edgesword in forum The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: July 20th, 2008, 04:02 PM
  4. Reasonable Gun Control Solution
    By Pitmaster in forum The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: August 29th, 2007, 12:42 PM

Search tags for this page

gun control commercial

Click on a term to search for related topics.