It's starting..... but we knew that already. (MERGED X 3) - Page 3

It's starting..... but we knew that already. (MERGED X 3)

This is a discussion on It's starting..... but we knew that already. (MERGED X 3) within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; This thread is for all of those on this board who said things like, "Oh, I don't think he will try for gun control, he ...

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Thread: It's starting..... but we knew that already. (MERGED X 3)

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array sgtD's Avatar
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    This thread is for all of those on this board who said things like, "Oh, I don't think he will try for gun control, he has more inportant things to worry about, like the economy and stopping the war."

    A wolf in sheeps clothing is still a wolf. (or in this case perhaps a sheep?) Anyway. WE TOLD YOU SO! Merry Christmas comrades.
    When you've got 'em by the balls, their hearts & minds will follow. Semper Fi.


  2. #32
    Distinguished Member Array Doc Holliday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sgtD View Post
    This thread is for all of those on this board who said things like, "Oh, I don't think he will try for gun control, he has more inportant things to worry about, like the economy and stopping the war."

    A wolf in sheeps clothing is still a wolf. (or in this case perhaps a sheep?) Anyway. WE TOLD YOU SO! Merry Christmas comrades.
    Amen! Preach it brother!

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowsbane View Post
    Also. It is slightly possible that if this were sucessfully spun to be an international issue congress wouldn't need to get involved. Long shot, but still possible I believe.
    A worst case scenario here but what if they perhaps took it to the UN? We all know about the UN's efforts to ban weapons. I would hope the states would step in to protect our rights.
    Why Ike, whatever do you mean? Maybe poker's just not your game Ike. I know! Let's have a spelling contest!

  3. #33
    VIP Member Array PatrioticRick's Avatar
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    Maybe if Mexico is having a gun problem, they should build a fence to keep the guns out.
    Μολὼν λαβέ

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  4. #34
    VIP Member Array matiki's Avatar
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    Get out of my head Janq.

    "Wise people learn when they can; fools learn when they must." - The Duke of Wellington

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by PatrioticRick View Post
    Maybe if Mexico is having a gun problem, they should build a fence to keep the guns out.
    Or our guns should keep the Mexicans out.


    Oops, did I say that out loud?

    "Just blame Sixto"

  6. #36
    Distinguished Member Array Doc Holliday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Or our guns should keep the Mexicans out.


    Oops, did I say that out loud?

    Sounds like a good plan.
    Why Ike, whatever do you mean? Maybe poker's just not your game Ike. I know! Let's have a spelling contest!

  7. #37
    Member Array glockman31's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Holliday View Post
    So if the drug cartels are deploying full autos and grenades could someone explain just what the hell that has to do with the millions of legally owned semi-autos in this country?

    Nope, didn't think so.

    As far as I am concerned, our southern border should be a DMZ with about 250 million landmines stretching from Texas to the Pacific. That would cut down a bunch of problems like..........drug/weapon smuggling, illegal immigration, potential Islamic-Fascist terrorists insertions, etc.

    Ok, you said exactly what I wanted to say. An assault weapons ban? hmm...semi-auto vs full auto. Law abiding Americans just want a nice rifle to shoot. So what it looks like a military rifle....ITS SEMI-AUTOMATIC!!! A ban would only hurt law abiding Americans. Plain and Simple.
    Eric


    There were NO Guns used to take over the flights on 9-11, IT STILL HAPPENED

    Wake up Americans - GUN CONTROL - Means WE LOOSE

  8. #38
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Thursday February 12, 2009
    Jeremy Tomasulo

    Washington, D.C.--Congressman Eliot Engel, Chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Subcommittee on the Western Hemisphere, wrote a letter signed by 53 Members of Congress urging President Obama to “return to enforcement of the law banning imports of assault weapons, which was previously enforced during the administrations of Presidents George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton.” The letter was also led by Congressman Michael Castle (R-DE) and Congresswoman Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY).

    “The alarming prevalence of imported assault weapons in the US has put our nation’s police officers at risk. Returning to the Bush 41/Clinton enforcement of the ban on imported assault weapons will protect our brave police forces and all people throughout New York and the United States,” said Rep. Engel.

    Engel added that returning to enforcement of the imported assault weapons ban is “a no-brainer that would require no legislative action.”

    In recent years, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) has quietly abandoned enforcement of the import ban (which was authorized by provisions in the 1968 Gun Control Act and enforced by Presidents George H. W. Bush and Bill Clinton). As a result, the civilian firearms market is flooded with imported, inexpensive military-style assault weapons, primarily from former Eastern bloc countries including Romania, Bulgaria and the former Yugoslavia. Importers are also able to skirt the restrictions by bringing in assault weapons parts and reassembling them with a small number of US-made parts. Assault weapon “parts kits” for assembly by individuals are also being imported. ATF has further weakened the prohibition by placing certain extremely problematic assault rifles on the "curios or relics" list, making certain firearms automatically eligible for importation.

    "Our failure to enforce restrictions on imported assault weapons is affecting our bilateral relationship with Mexico," said Rep. Engel. "We must do more to support our friends in Mexico whose drug war is fueled by firearms flowing south from the United States, many of which should never have entered the US in the first place.”

    5,661 people died in Mexico in 2008 alone as a result of drug-related violence. This is more than double the 2007 total of 2,773. Over 90% of firearms confiscated yearly in Mexico orginate in the United States. As Chairman of the House Western Hemisphere Subcommittee, Rep. Engel is a strong supporter of the Merida Initiative – a US-Mexico security partnership announced in late 2007. However, he also believes that the US must fulfill certain domestic obligations under the Merida Initiative, including an enhanced commitment to curb the illegal trafficking of firearms from the US into Mexico.

    The full text of the letter and signatories are below:

    Dear Mr. President:

    We write to urge you to return to enforcement of the ban on imported assault weapons, including those that are fully manufactured abroad as well as those imported as parts, which was previously enforced during the administrations of Presidents George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton. We believe that this issue has important implications for domestic public safety, homeland security, and our bilateral relationship with Mexico.

    In the last eight years, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) has almost completely abrogated the ban on imported assault rifles. This ban – first established nearly 20 years ago – was authorized by provisions in the 1968 Gun Control Act allowing ATF to prohibit the importation of firearms and ammunition that are not “particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes.” The import restriction is independent of the Assault Weapons Ban of 1994, and was not affected by its “sunset” in 2004.

    The ban on assault weapon imports was first enforced by the George H.W. Bush Administration in response to growing threats to law enforcement personnel from the increased use of assault weapons by drug traffickers and in mass shootings, like the Stockton schoolyard massacre in 1989. The import restrictions were later strengthened in 1998 by the Clinton Administration to address foreign manufacturers that were evading the ban by making minor cosmetic changes to their weapons. The definition was changed to include any assault rifle with the "ability to accept a detachable large capacity magazine originally designed and produced for a military assault weapon.”

    Unfortunately, in recent years, ATF has quietly abandoned enforcement of the import ban. As a result, the civilian firearms market is flooded with imported, inexpensive military-style assault weapons from primarily former Eastern bloc countries including Romania, Bulgaria and the former Yugoslavia. Importers are also able to skirt the restrictions by bringing in assault weapons parts and reassembling them with a small number of US-made parts. Assault weapon “parts kits” for assembly by individuals are also being imported. ATF has further weakened the prohibition by placing certain extremely problematic assault rifles on the "curios or relics" list, making certain firearms automatically eligible for importation.

    The noxious results of reversing long-established policy extend beyond our borders and are directly affecting our foreign policy. Assault weapons are being smuggled in bulk from U.S. border states to Mexico where they are used by narco-traffickers to fuel a drug war that is killing Mexican law enforcement and other officials at alarming rates.

    The violence in Mexico has reached crisis proportions. In December, Mexican Attorney General Eduardo Medina Mora reported that the total number of organized crime-related homicides in 2008 had reached 5,700, more than double the previous record of approximately 2,700 set in 2007. The 2008 total includes 944 people killed in November alone, the deadliest month in Mexico’s history, in terms of drug violence. In addition, the Attorney General confirmed that nearly 15 percent of the victims of the violence were members of law enforcement or the military. He also projected that the country’s drug violence has not yet peaked, and is expected to continue during the first few months of 2009. When the Merida Initiative was announced in October 2007, the George W. Bush Administration made a commitment to “intensify efforts” to combat the trafficking of guns from the U.S. into Mexico. A return to the enforcement of the ban on the import of all assault weapons would help us to live up to this commitment.

    Not only is the violence in Mexico already spilling over the border into the U.S., but the prevalence of imported assault weapons in the hands of criminals has made “officer survival” a critical issue for many urban law enforcement agencies. The Miami Police Department has reported a steep rise in the number of murders and other crimes committed with assault weapons; a Romanian WASR-10 (AK-type) assault weapon was used to kill two Fairfax, Virginia police officers in 2006; a Romanian WASR-10 assault weapon was used in a mass shooting that left eight dead at a mall in rural Omaha, Nebraska in 2007. The Associated Press conducted an analysis showing that the number of AK variants traced to crime by ATF has increased from 1,140 in 1993 to 8,547 in 2007.

    These are just the sort of incidents and statistics that prompted the George H.W. Bush Administration to take action to halt assault weapons imports in 1989, and we believe demonstrate the importance of returning to enforcing the import ban once again.

    We ask that you direct ATF to act in accordance with the 1968 Gun Control Act and return to enforcing the ban on the import of all assault weapons, both those that are fully manufactured abroad as well as those imported as parts. By restoring these important restrictions, we will be able to help reduce violence here in the United States, while also sending an important signal to our friends in Mexico. Thank you for your attention to this urgent matter.

    Sincerely,

    Eliot L. Engel (D-NY)
    Michael N. Castle (R-DE)
    Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY)
    Gregory Meeks (D-NY)
    Christopher Smith (R-NJ)
    Alcee Hastings (D-FL)
    Jerrold Nadler (D-NY)
    Nita Lowey (D-NY)
    Joseph Crowley (D-NY)
    Bob Filner (D-CA)
    Barbara Lee (D-CA)
    Dennis Kucinich (D-OH)
    Ellen Tauscher (D-CA)
    Louise Slaughter (D-NY)
    Bill Pascrell (D-NJ)
    Marcy Kaptur (D-OH)
    David Price (D-NC)
    Eleanor Holmes Norton (D-DC)
    Edward Markey (D-NA)
    Chaka Fattah (D-PA)
    Jim Moran (D-VA)
    Robert Wexler (D-FL)
    Earl Blumenauer (D-OR)
    Brad Sherman (D-CA)
    Jan Schakowsky (D-IL)
    Gary Ackerman (D-NY)
    Henry Waxman (D-CA)
    Jose Serrano (D-NY)
    John Conyers (D-MI)
    Nydia Velazquez (D-NY)
    Rosa DeLauro (D-CT)
    Loretta Sanchez (D-CA)
    John Olver (D-MA)
    Betty McCollum (D-MN)
    Rush Holt (D-NJ)
    Linda Sanchez (D-CA)
    Albio Sires (D-NJ)
    Betty Sutton (D-OH)
    Donna Christensen (D-VI)
    Raul Grijalva (D-AZ)
    Sam Farr (D-CA)
    Jim McGovern (D-MA)
    Lois Capps (D-CA)
    Allyson Schwartz (D-PA)
    Patrick Kennedy (D-RI)
    Michael McMahon (D-NY)
    Donna Edwards (D-MD)
    Tim Bishop (D-NY)
    Pete Stark (D-CA)
    Doris Matsui (D-CA)
    Zoe Lofgren (D-CA)
    Paul Tonko (D-NY)
    Mazie Hirono (D-HI)

    Congressman Eliot Engel

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  9. #39
    Senior Member Array mech1369dlw's Avatar
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    You can't have no idea how little I care about anything that the U.N. has to say. And if I could care less about what the U.N. says, then I care even less about what the Mexican government says about how guns from our country is messing up their craphole of a country. By the way, BAFTE should stand for Buy Alcohol Tobacco Firearms and Explosives. Yeah, I care about the U.N. and Mexico, yeah right.!
    A person is justified in the use of deadly force, if such person reasonably believes deadly force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to such person or a third person.

  10. #40
    Distinguished Member Array Siafu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberline View Post
    Distraction (economy) + Agenda (gun confiscation) + Excuse (Mexico) = Opportunity
    I like your formula. They seem to like formulaic solutions in Washington lately. Like this one...

    Math: Here's The Math Formula That Ruined Our Economy

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bronco Bob View Post
    You know the man hasn't been in office ninety days, .
    In all reality he has only been IN office something like 37 days.
    Luke 22:36 Jesus says that if his disciples do not have a sword, they should sell their cloak and buy a sword.

  12. #42
    Senior Member Array Duisburg's Avatar
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    I am sworn to protect the Constitution of the U.S.A. from all threats both foreign and domestic.

  13. #43
    VIP Member Array Thanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamierah View Post
    ...the administration is going to try for the assault weapons ban...
    I'm sort of happy. I would like to see a vote on this issue to get the pulse on how anti-gun the mix is right now in Washington DC. I'm hopeful he does not have the votes. I'm more concerned this is his looser issue, they know it, but the gain on another issue.

    This issue will take off. Nothing like telling people on the boarder of a nation wide drug war they can arm themselves.

    Or how about states cutting LE and not able to arrive in time. Nothing like telling people hold, we will be there in 30 minutes.

    The nation is a lot more pro-gun then you guys think.
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  14. #44
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    We knew it was coming....

    But we had hoped it wouldn't. Now all we can do is write to Senators and Congressmen who refuse to listen to us anyway. Does anyone else here feel like victim?

    Once again we have to fight for unalienable rights.

  15. #45
    Member Array Holger's Avatar
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    Riehl World View: Uh Oh, Connect These Links

    Yup...the liberal talking points are in full circulation. The NYT is also getting in on the act (shocka!):

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/26/us/26borders.html

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