The beginning of the End??? Is it?

This is a discussion on The beginning of the End??? Is it? within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by fatcat Then there is the "carry" permit which allows you to carry concealed anywhere that it is legal. This carry permit itself ...

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Thread: The beginning of the End??? Is it?

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array rottkeeper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatcat View Post

    Then there is the "carry" permit which allows you to carry concealed anywhere that it is legal. This carry permit itself can come in "levels" restricting where you can take the pistol. You might get a "hunting/sportsman" restriction which means you can take it to the range and into the woods to hunt. You cannot just carry for the heck of it.
    Not true, I'll say maybe where you are but I have had a non-restricted permit for years. All carry permits start out with restrictions of some sorts but your permit can be amended at the discretion of the issuing authority. It's a bunch of B/S but it's the way it is. Unfortunately the issuing authority in each county has a difference of opinion on the right to carry but they can do as they see fit with restrictions. In my county if you have demonstrated that you have been a responsible permit holder the issuing judge will remove the restrictions.
    For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the son of man be. Mathew 24:27

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  3. #17
    Member Array Zippy's Avatar
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    From what I understand there were 2 pistols found on the scene and both were on his permit. I just recently got my permit and under restrictions it says "NONE". It is up to the individual county as to how they issue permits in NY. Some require a class, others not, some start with restrictions and then will remove them. Others will not issue an unrestricted permit at all unless you have some friends in high places or fight tooth and nail for it.

  4. #18
    Senior Member Array redbird's Avatar
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    I could be mistaken but I believe that if any of the first 10 amendments (Bill Of Rights) are every repealed the Constitution is null and void. The very ratification of the Constitution was only achieved after these guarantees were added.

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    Senior Member Array Jmac00's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rottkeeper View Post
    Not true, I'll say maybe where you are but I have had a non-restricted permit for years. All carry permits start out with restrictions of some sorts but your permit can be amended at the discretion of the issuing authority. It's a bunch of B/S but it's the way it is. Unfortunately the issuing authority in each county has a difference of opinion on the right to carry but they can do as they see fit with restrictions. In my county if you have demonstrated that you have been a responsible permit holder the issuing judge will remove the restrictions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippy View Post
    From what I understand there were 2 pistols found on the scene and both were on his permit. I just recently got my permit and under restrictions it says "NONE". It is up to the individual county as to how they issue permits in NY. Some require a class, others not, some start with restrictions and then will remove them. Others will not issue an unrestricted permit at all unless you have some friends in high places or fight tooth and nail for it.
    I think it's safe to say, NYS is one messed up place. I have had my permit since '94......with NO restrictions other than not being able to carry in Queens (NYC, which no one can) public schools, government offices...and anywhere else restricted by NYS law.

    I have read the Permit laws of NYS, and I can not find any permit information that says "for Hunting only" you either have a Concealed carry permit or you don't...period

    SO, NOW THAT WE ARE COMPLETELY OFF TOPIC

    can we get back to my OP Thank you
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  6. #20
    Ex Member Array thylordjj's Avatar
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    But according to this guy, glen beck and the N.R.A are to blame for the shootings. Beck and NRA's LaPierre warn of insidious Obama plot to grab our guns | Crooks and Liars

  7. #21
    Senior Member Array Jmac00's Avatar
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    Glen Beck is 'sorta' correct? we will be able to keep our guns, but they will be rendered useless by taxing everything associated with firearms.

    This kind of thinking will hurt USPSA/IPSC and competition shooters (or anyone that just likes to shoot a lot) by simply making it to expensive for the average person to purchase ammo or components to make bullets
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  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Horsetrader View Post
    Beginning of the end? Or end of the beginning ? History of most nations progresses from liberty (freedom) to complete governmental control (tyranny). Everybody has to deside where we are on that line after 230 years. End of the 2A ? Not without a change to the Constitution (but then the amount of UNconstitutional yet seemingly "legal" moves of State and Federal government LATELY seems to signal that many in the government are operating outside the Constitution already). The question really begs the reader to define his own view of the future of the United States.

    The End of the 2nd Amendment began in 1930's. When the government started regulating which firearms the public could buy direct through the mail from the manufacturer. This was the first INFRINGMENT on the rights of the citizen to exercise his 2A rights without government interferrance.
    BINGO!!!!!



    You know, its really strange that we could all either mail order or purchase in-person machine guns, military weapons, etc all we wanted to prior to 1934......and I know of no school shootings, workplace massacres, etc that were happening before then. There were more guns around, more guns in the hands of teenagers, etc back then than now.
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  9. #23
    Member Array Sailorcbr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thylordjj View Post
    But according to this guy, glen beck and the N.R.A are to blame for the shootings. Beck and NRA's LaPierre warn of insidious Obama plot to grab our guns | Crooks and Liars
    If those that were victims started going after the real problem, then maybe the so called journalists would stop trying become the next Jerry Spring or Geraldo and get back to reporting the unbiased facts.....

    Regarding the shootings in PA.....

    there was a lengthy segment on Fox News two weeks ago in which Glenn Beck and the NRA's Wayne LaPierre insisted that Americans' 2nd Amendment rights are "under attack" from the Obama administration. What's more, as Neiwert noted this morning, the conservative Pittsburgh Tribune-Review ran a story just three days ago about "speculation that President Obama might pull the trigger on tighter regulations for gun ownership." The article quoted a gun-store salesman raising the specter of a "confiscation of firearms" from the government.

    I may be an NRA life member, but I can assure you I do not condone the way they act politically. The outright lies they printed during the election were simply disgusting.
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    Senior Member Array CR2008's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    I think we are heading for civil war. I see all these shootings as a sign of our populations unrest. It's a sad time for America!
    I think you would see social unrest on the level of the LA riots, but that's if things get worst or with little improvement down the road... it wont even take much to set it off AND when such a thing happens, the politicians will move to much greater restrictions in the guess of "protecting" people.
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    Distinguished Member Array TerriLi's Avatar
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    Pa Bell voting, the right that 2A gives all Americans.

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by SelfDefense View Post
    The nutjobs versus the rest of us?
    Sadly I think it will be a nasty affair with more than just two "sides". I think that people who would normally hate each other will ban together to fight against the Government. If a victory is achieved then these enemies will break apart and fight with each other for local or regional dominance. Lots of nasty bitter local conflicts and no longer a free country for us to live in. Local war lords maybe?


    I'm not sure of how it will play out but it will be nasty!
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  13. #27
    VIP Member Array AllAmerican's Avatar
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    Actually, Im starting to wonder if there will be any gun control in the near future. As everything falls apart and law enforcement is over run we'll ALL be using our guns to fend for ourselves.

    Honestly, Im not worried so much about losing my guns. To do so, is to die.

    Make peace with it and go on.
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  14. #28
    Senior Member Array Pure Kustom's Avatar
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    I fear that the Dems will try and use these shootings against the 2A. But any sensible person can see that these people were a little off or bad people to begin with.

    I fear for the 2A because when were you able to ever talk sense to a politician

  15. #29
    Member Array ReticentXD40's Avatar
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    I'm at the point of thinking attempts will be made, but will all be futile. Just look at the records of law abiding citizens buying guns. And nobody takes into account that the shootings all seem to happen in either gun free zones, or places where gun laws are rather strict (ie. New York or Chicago).

    I'm sort of with All American on that if everything falls apart, we will be protecting ourselves with our weapons. In a way I'm almost awaiting a "reformat and reinstall" of sorts in our system that would set everything back to the constitution.

    Reading that page with beck and LaPierre is kind of sickening though. From reading the comments, it just proves most people these days can't have a decent discussion or debate without just dropping all sense of civility and hurling **** at each other like monkeys.

  16. #30
    Senior Member Array 2edgesword's Avatar
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    The gunman had a NYS license. I don't know if administrative restrictions such as sportsman (target/hunting) applied but that is not the point. The license didn't give him permission to go into the civil center and shoot people. And whatever restrictions he may have had on his license didn't prevent him from doing it.

    This may not be true in the county where his license was issued but in Suffolk you need to provide three personal references. I'd be interested in knowing who provided the references if he needed them when he applied for his pistol license.

    The flaw in the thinking of many gun control advocates is believing that another law would have prevented this shooting. The gunman broke the law numerous times in committing this act. What makes them think passing new laws would have prevented him from violating those laws to commit this crime.

    In addition this event displays another fallacy, that the police can protect you. All of the victims were killed/injuried BEFORE the police arrived. These victims (13 killed plus others injured) were rendered defenseless against one armed attacker probably by some of the laws that have been passed under the guise that they (laws) were suppose to defend them.

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