The beginning of the End??? Is it?

The beginning of the End??? Is it?

This is a discussion on The beginning of the End??? Is it? within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; With all the latest shootings and mass killings by firearms, are we as a society looking at the end of the Second Amendment as we ...

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Thread: The beginning of the End??? Is it?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array Jmac00's Avatar
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    The beginning of the End??? Is it?

    With all the latest shootings and mass killings by firearms, are we as a society looking at the end of the Second Amendment as we know it today???

    At the very least are we headed for SEVERE RESTRICTIONS and taxes on equipment and components?
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    We may see efforts where the politicians can use the latest 'shootings' in their push, but I don't see any drastic change during the next 3.5 years.
    Too many other fish to fry, and attacking 2A rights at this juncture in O's first term might be more than he's willing to take on...he knows that...

    OMOYMV
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    Hmmm. They can' very well use the argument that strict control works, the particular horror having happened in NY. All control did was make certain there was no resistance. Maybe, there is some tightening up on mental health stuff that needs doing, but that is almost impossible to accomplish in a fair way.

    It is not clear to me exactly what he was allowed to have and do per NY law. I've seen everything from "licensed to carry concealed weapons," to "permitted to own a gun in NY."

    There's always one that "gets away" no matter how diligent and stringent the controls.

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    Senior Member Array Jmac00's Avatar
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    here is what I was thinking?

    The main thing that is holding the present administration from doing anything is the economy.

    IF the Democrats can NOT turn the economy around by November of next year (election time) I think they will be removed from power.

    if they CAN turn the economy around, then they can solidify there power base and by the first quarter of 2011 I think we are going to get some major restrictions.

    JMHO
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    VIP Member Array Pikachu711's Avatar
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    I've always found that statistic a little interesting. It seems that crimes involving gun seem to increase AFTER a gun law has been passed. Look at DC for example. After they banned all guns & ammunition the crime rate surged. Goes to show that gun laws have a reverse effect on crime.
    "Gun control is being able to hit your target."
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    VIP Member Array JAT40's Avatar
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    Saw a pro 2A state rep. in church today. Went out of my way to thank him for his support for us gun owners. Encouraged him to keep fighting. Our guys need to hear from us, rough road ahead.
    While people are saying "Peace and safety," destruction will come on them suddenly, ... and they will not escape. 1Th 5:3

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    Member Array fatcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Hmmm. They can' very well use the argument that strict control works, the particular horror having happened in NY. All control did was make certain there was no resistance. Maybe, there is some tightening up on mental health stuff that needs doing, but that is almost impossible to accomplish in a fair way.

    It is not clear to me exactly what he was allowed to have and do per NY law. I've seen everything from "licensed to carry concealed weapons," to "permitted to own a gun in NY."

    There's always one that "gets away" no matter how diligent and stringent the controls.
    In NY there are two levels of pistol permits.

    There is an ownership permit, which means you can buy it and keep it ONLY at the specified address that is registered with the state. You can NOT take that pistol off that property period. Technically you cannot even take it anywhere to get it fixed if it is broken, and you cannot take it to a range.

    Then there is the "carry" permit which allows you to carry concealed anywhere that it is legal. This carry permit itself can come in "levels" restricting where you can take the pistol. You might get a "hunting/sportsman" restriction which means you can take it to the range and into the woods to hunt. You cannot just carry for the heck of it.

    And within both of those stipulations there are obviously gray areas that cannot be policed.

    As far as I know, the Binghamton killer did not have any permits. But if he did it could not have been a carry permit because NY does not give them out to non-Americans unless you have some really good reasons. But apparently an ownership permit could have been issued, yet I don't know for sure that it was. I've tried to find out and no one seems to know for sure.

    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    We may see efforts where the politicians can use the latest 'shootings' in their push, but I don't see any drastic change during the next 3.5 years.
    Too many other fish to fry, and attacking 2A rights at this juncture in O's first term might be more than he's willing to take on...he knows that...

    OMOYMV
    I agree. Nothing will get passed right away, but what we will see soon is the political posturing. Heck we are seeing it already. Just listen to Paterson's comments after the shooting in Binghamton. He is posturing already and he is big time anti-gun.

    Soon enough we will start to hear the anti crowd make loose comments. Then some numb-nuts will organize a rally. One thing will lead to another and it will become topic one on cable news.

    We just have to make sure we don't sit on our hands. We need to contact our local reps, Democrat, Republican or Independent. We need to make sure we point out in an intelligent way that the laws are not working, have not worked, and will not work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fatcat View Post
    In NY there are two levels of pistol permits.

    There is an ownership permit, which means you can buy it and keep it ONLY at the specified address that is registered with the state. You can NOT take that pistol off that property period. Technically you cannot even take it anywhere to get it fixed if it is broken, and you cannot take it to a range.

    Then there is the "carry" permit which allows you to carry concealed anywhere that it is legal. This carry permit itself can come in "levels" restricting where you can take the pistol. You might get a "hunting/sportsman" restriction which means you can take it to the range and into the woods to hunt. You cannot just carry for the heck of it.

    And within both of those stipulations there are obviously gray areas that cannot be policed.

    As far as I know, the Binghamton killer did not have any permits. But if he did it could not have been a carry permit because NY does not give them out to non-Americans unless you have some really good reasons. But apparently an ownership permit could have been issued, yet I don't know for sure that it was. I've tried to find out and no one seems to know for sure.
    According to the report I read he was a naturalized citizen, so thye legally could not deny a permit on that basis. Another article had the police stating the guns were registered to him.

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    I think we are heading for civil war. I see all these shootings as a sign of our populations unrest. It's a sad time for America!
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

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    Restricted Member Array SelfDefense's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    I think we are heading for civil war. I see all these shootings as a sign of our populations unrest. It's a sad time for America!
    The nutjobs versus the rest of us?

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    The nutjobs versus the rest of us?
    That could be a hard fight...since there seem to more of the nutjobs than the sane ones nowadays...

    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Pikachu711 View Post
    It seems that crimes involving gun seem to increase AFTER a gun law has been passed. Look at DC for example. After they banned all guns & ammunition the crime rate surged.
    Disarm victims ahead of time, and you end up doing half the work for the criminals. The criminals know this and are thankful. The People generally don't know this, and are thus snowed into believing that more of a stupid thing will help.
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    Distinguished Member Array Colin's Avatar
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    I doubt they will go with a public AWB. But they will try to bleed the industry to death with a thousand cuts and bruises. Currently they are making it a nightmare and expensive to ship gun related products out of the country.

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    Congress can pass all the gun control legislation they want.

    Remember, however, that there can be no changes to the US Constitution or the 2nd Amendment without ratification of 3/4 majority from all 50 states.

    We are more likely to face an onslaught of anti-gun legislation trying to circumvent the 2nd Amendment rather than an outright change to the Constitution itself.

    Which is why it is ever so important pay attention to who we vote for in elections! As congress passes anti-gun laws, they will inevitably be challenged in court as to their Constitutionality. If we continue to flood the courts with far left liberal judges who get a lifetime appointment and love to legislate from the bench by electing far left Senators, Congressmen and Presidents we will undoubtedly have those anti-gun laws be upheld in the courts.

    We have only ourselves to blame for not paying attention to who we put in office.
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    Member Array Horsetrader's Avatar
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    Beginning of the end? Or end of the beginning ? History of most nations progresses from liberty (freedom) to complete governmental control (tyranny). Everybody has to deside where we are on that line after 230 years. End of the 2A ? Not without a change to the Constitution (but then the amount of UNconstitutional yet seemingly "legal" moves of State and Federal government LATELY seems to signal that many in the government are operating outside the Constitution already). The question really begs the reader to define his own view of the future of the United States.

    The End of the 2nd Amendment began in 1930's. When the government started regulating which firearms the public could buy direct through the mail from the manufacturer. This was the first INFRINGMENT on the rights of the citizen to exercise his 2A rights without government interferrance.

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