Montana Joined by Alaska & Texas - Guns not under ATF

This is a discussion on Montana Joined by Alaska & Texas - Guns not under ATF within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Marbut-MSSA" <mssa@mtssa.org> To: <mssa@mtssa.org> Sent: Monday, April 20, 2009 10:59 AM Subject: Guns made in-state > FYI > > ...

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Thread: Montana Joined by Alaska & Texas - Guns not under ATF

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    Ex Member Array DOGOFWAR01's Avatar
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    Montana Joined by Alaska & Texas - Guns not under ATF

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Gary Marbut-MSSA" <mssa@mtssa.org>
    To: <mssa@mtssa.org>
    Sent: Monday, April 20, 2009 10:59 AM
    Subject: Guns made in-state


    > FYI
    >
    > Montana HB 246
    > http://data.opi.mt.gov/bills/2009/billhtml/HB0246.htm
    >
    > Alaska HB 186
    > Bill Text 26th Legislature
    >
    > Texas HB 1863
    > 81(R) HB 1863 - Introduced version - Bill Text
    >
    > Gary Marbut, president
    > Montana Shooting Sports Association
    > Montana Shooting Sports Association
    > author, Gun Laws of Montana
    > Gun Laws of Montana

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    Member Array chenemf's Avatar
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    Where are these firearms with a bore diameter greater than 1 1/2 inches?

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chenemf View Post
    Where are these firearms with a bore diameter greater than 1 1/2 inches?
    On Battleships
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

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    Senior Member Array Herknav's Avatar
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    Question for the lawyers--How would this apply to interstate movement of household goods? Being in the military, I move around A LOT. If I were to buy one of these weapons and move to another state, I would not be conducting commerce. I would merely be relocating my possessions.
    I would rather wake up in the middle of nowhere than in any city on Earth.--Steve McQueen

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herknav View Post
    Question for the lawyers--How would this apply to interstate movement of household goods? Being in the military, I move around A LOT. If I were to buy one of these weapons and move to another state, I would not be conducting commerce. I would merely be relocating my possessions.
    IANAL but I'm thinking the way it reads to me is as long as a firearm produced in the state stays within the state the feds can suk wind,but if the firearm leaves the state then it is subject to federal laws and interstate commerce,In other words you will have to follow the laws of the state you move to and more than likely have to register the gun on a form 4473
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

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    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOGOFWAR01 View Post
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Gary Marbut-MSSA" <mssa@mtssa.org>
    To: <mssa@mtssa.org>
    Sent: Monday, April 20, 2009 10:59 AM
    Subject: Guns made in-state


    > FYI
    >
    > Montana HB 246
    > http://data.opi.mt.gov/bills/2009/billhtml/HB0246.htm
    >
    > Alaska HB 186
    > Bill Text 26th Legislature
    >
    > Texas HB 1863
    > 81(R) HB 1863 - Introduced version - Bill Text
    >
    > Gary Marbut, president
    > Montana Shooting Sports Association
    > Montana Shooting Sports Association
    > author, Gun Laws of Montana
    > Gun Laws of Montana
    BEAUTIFUL! The more jump on the bandwagon now, the more will see it and have the courage to jump on as well...hopefully.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the **** out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

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    Member Array Sejune's Avatar
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    I miss my home state of Alaska! They have common sense gun laws! My parents live in Montana now and I often think of moving there, if not to be closer to them then to enjoy their gun freedoms!
    Sejune
    Glock 30 .45
    Springfield XD 9

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    Member Array Randy's Avatar
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    I like what they're doing and the message is clear.

    I wish they would have omitted the section on machine guns.

    Randy

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    VIP Member Array paramedic70002's Avatar
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    The Commerce Clause has been stretched to the point of breaking. They would argue that you bought gas and transported it across state lines while in possession of a firearm, and they would get away with it.
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

    Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
    Paramedics With Guns Scare People!

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    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herknav View Post
    Question for the lawyers--
    Someone has sacrificed a black cat with an flint knife on the bronze alter and summoned me...

    So, in response to your sacrifice, I will briefly answer your question...

    These laws are not worth the paper they are printed on.

    Ignore them.

    Other states don't care what AK, MT and TX say is legal. If your unregistered machine gun hits their soil, they will not be happy and will arrest you so fast your head will spin.

    That it was legal is TX will NOT be a defense.

    The Federal Court system is not restrained by these laws, so while the Dallas PD won't arrest you for violating Texas law, the ATF agents out of the Dallas office can and will kick in your door on a search warrant signed by a federal judge, arrest you, and take you before a federal judge who isn't going to look at the TX statute book, but the United States Code, look up the National Firearms Act and say "I don't see any provision in here for a state to opt out..." then give you a $250,000 bond, assign you a new court date and tell you "Get an attorney. You need one."

    California can decriminalize pot all it wants; federal agents can still arrest you for it at will.

    Same here.

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    Ex Member Array DOGOFWAR01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    Someone has sacrificed a black cat with an flint knife on the bronze alter and summoned me...

    So, in response to your sacrifice, I will briefly answer your question...

    These laws are not worth the paper they are printed on.

    Ignore them.

    Other states don't care what AK, MT and TX say is legal. If your unregistered machine gun hits their soil, they will not be happy and will arrest you so fast your head will spin.

    That it was legal is TX will NOT be a defense.

    The Federal Court system is not restrained by these laws, so while the Dallas PD won't arrest you for violating Texas law, the ATF agents out of the Dallas office can and will kick in your door on a search warrant signed by a federal judge, arrest you, and take you before a federal judge who isn't going to look at the TX statute book, but the United States Code, look up the National Firearms Act and say "I don't see any provision in here for a state to opt out..." then give you a $250,000 bond, assign you a new court date and tell you "Get an attorney. You need one."

    California can decriminalize pot all it wants; federal agents can still arrest you for it at will.

    Same here.
    I am sure that judges, lawyers, atf, etc are wondering about their job and their family security if all this comes to be widespread. Personally, I do not care about any of these people job security, go find another job and be productive.

    The bottom line issue here is State Rights versus a centralized government, same as was during the Civil War 1861-1865 - States Rights.

    Hopefully the other 47 States will follow the States of MT, AK, and TX, then the U.S Congress somewhere along the way will grow a pair then pass and delete laws as required to restore State Rights, regardless of who loses their jobs and however small the federal govt gets.

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    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOGOFWAR01 View Post
    I am sure that judges, lawyers, atf, etc are wondering about their job and their family security if all this comes to be widespread.

    Yeah...

    Right.

    Like the Texas Rangers are going to do a door-kick on the AFT office in Austin and the TX National Guard is going to raid a Federal Courthouse to save someone from prosecution under the NFA.

    They aren't worried about this. It's not even a blip on the radar.

    Why don't the Senators and Congressmen from those states sponsor legislation to repeal the NFA? That would be the correct thing to do under the constitution, wouldn't it?

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    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    Why don't the Senators and Congressmen from those states sponsor legislation to repeal the NFA? That would be the correct thing to do under the constitution, wouldn't it?
    Or introduce an amendment specifying the steps a state must take to secede. That might get their attention.
    Infowars- Proving David Hannum right on a daily basis

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    Ex Member Array DOGOFWAR01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    Yeah...

    Right.

    Like the Texas Rangers are going to do a door-kick on the AFT office in Austin and the TX National Guard is going to raid a Federal Courthouse to save someone from prosecution under the NFA.

    They aren't worried about this. It's not even a blip on the radar.

    Why don't the Senators and Congressmen from those states sponsor legislation to repeal the NFA? That would be the correct thing to do under the constitution, wouldn't it?
    +++++++++++++++

    As per my previous post above, since you did not read all the way down:

    "Hopefully the other 47 States will follow the States of MT, AK, and TX, then the U.S Congress somewhere along the way will grow a pair then pass and delete laws as required to restore State Rights, regardless of who loses their jobs and however small the federal govt gets."

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    Senior Member Array Herknav's Avatar
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    Thanks, guys. I know the reality. I was just thinking out loud. My premise is that "interstate commerce" has two parts: "interstate" and "commerce." It would seem that moving across a state line would be "interstate", but unless I attempt to sell it, where's the "commerce"?
    I would rather wake up in the middle of nowhere than in any city on Earth.--Steve McQueen

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