Fed up with reciprocity patchwork? Support this bill!

Fed up with reciprocity patchwork? Support this bill!

This is a discussion on Fed up with reciprocity patchwork? Support this bill! within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; HR 197 National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act of 2009 - Amends the federal criminal code to establish a national standard for the carrying of concealed firearms ...

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Thread: Fed up with reciprocity patchwork? Support this bill!

  1. #1
    Member Array sirdarksoul's Avatar
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    Fed up with reciprocity patchwork? Support this bill!

    HR 197

    National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act of 2009 - Amends the federal criminal code to establish a national standard for the carrying of concealed firearms (other than a machinegun or destructive device) by non-residents. Authorizes a person who has a valid permit to carry a concealed firearm in one state and who is not prohibited from carrying a firearm under federal law to carry a concealed firearm in another state in accordance with the restrictions of that state or as specified under this Act.

    Similar bills with nearly identical language are HR 1620, S 371 and S 845.
    Last edited by sirdarksoul; June 8th, 2009 at 04:51 AM. Reason: Added other similar bills


  2. #2
    Member Array lenf45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirdarksoul View Post
    HR 197

    National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act of 2009 - Amends the federal criminal code to establish a national standard for the carrying of concealed firearms (other than a machinegun or destructive device) by non-residents. Authorizes a person who has a valid permit to carry a concealed firearm in one state and who is not prohibited from carrying a firearm under federal law to carry a concealed firearm in another state in accordance with the restrictions of that state or as specified under this Act.

    Similar bills with nearly identical language are HR 1620, S 371 and S 845.
    I live in CT and have a CC permit.

    It is frustrating that i cannot bring my firearm when i visit my daughter and her husband who live in VT because i have to travel through MA!
    Once i get there my son-in law lets me carry one of his Glocks (perfectly legal in VT).

    Some people have told me to just separate the gun and ammo and keep it in the trunk, locked in a case. From what i have read about the MA laws on this, that is illegal also.

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    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    Actually Lenf45 there is a federal law ( I don't recall the name off the top of my head) that does allow you safe passage through not so gun friendly areas. Basically unloaded, cased, ammo seperate, and not accessible to the driver or passengers. Also you would pretty much have to cruise through MA without stopping other than for fuel.
    Infowars- Proving David Hannum right on a daily basis

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    Senior Member Array Divebum47's Avatar
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    From what I understand, since issuing Concealed Carry Permits is a State's Rights issue, there's not much hope for a blanket law unless it's ratified by 2/3rds of the states. I might be wrong on this, but there has been legislation on this issue a number of times in the past and I don't think it's ever gotten out of Committee.
    "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups"

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    Senior Member Array boscobeans's Avatar
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    FEDERAL LAW ON TRANSPORTATION OF FIREARMS

    A provision of federal law serves as a defense to state or local laws which would prohibit the passage of persons with firearms in interstate travel.

    Notwithstanding any state or local law, a person shall be entitled to transport a firearm from any place where he may lawfully possess it to any other place where he may lawfully possess such firearm if the firearm is unloaded and in the trunk. In vehicles without a trunk, the unloaded firearm shall be in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console. Necessary stops, like gasoline and rest, seem permissible.

    Just drive through the 100 miles or so of Kennedychusetts without a stop and you will be fine.

    bosco

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    US CODE: Title 18926A. Interstate transportation of firearms

    Here is the Federal Law. Read it print it and bring it with You in case You are stopped. Leave a copy in Your case/car at all time.

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18...6---A000-.html

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    Senior Member Array rmilchman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirdarksoul View Post
    HR 197

    National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act of 2009 - Amends the federal criminal code to establish a national standard for the carrying of concealed firearms (other than a machinegun or destructive device) by non-residents. Authorizes a person who has a valid permit to carry a concealed firearm in one state and who is not prohibited from carrying a firearm under federal law to carry a concealed firearm in another state in accordance with the restrictions of that state or as specified under this Act.

    Similar bills with nearly identical language are HR 1620, S 371 and S 845.
    If I understand this correctly, a PA resident would be able to carry (carry not transport through) in NJ. A NJ resident could not carry in NJ since NJ never (OK hardly ever) issues permits.

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    I would like to see the look on Jonnie Laws face in NJ if You shown Him a permit that covered You all over.

    A free ride to jail.

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    Ex Member Array JOHNSMITH's Avatar
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    It was referred to committee back in Feb. I don't think this is going anywhere.

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    Senior Member Array boscobeans's Avatar
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    You must still follow the BOLD and UNDERLINED rules for transporting through States like NJ.

    Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driverís compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.

    I would also make sure I was not making any stops in NJ.

    bosco

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    My car acted up a few weeks back, coming up the NJ Turnpike. I was just passing thru with two pistols cased in the back per Federal Law. I pulled over about 6 times to work out the problem. I did not want to call a wrecker or get stuck in NJ on a Friday evening/night. No cops stopped to help Me T/G and I made it out and home to CT.

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boscobeans View Post
    FEDERAL LAW ON TRANSPORTATION OF FIREARMS...
    Just drive through the 100 miles or so of Kennedychusetts without a stop and you will be fine.
    Correct, even in MA. ^^

    Key is to have the _firearm_ locked and stored in the trunk/rear storage compartment of your vehicle or if driving a pickup or motorcycle to have it stowed in a way that is not readily accessible to the vehicle operator.
    The firearm does not have to be cased, though I strongly advise this to students as a general point, but it does have to be secured in some manner in that it is locked and not readily accessible for use to vehicle operator.

    This though _only_ applies to the 'firearm' itself.

    In MA state law _also_ covers magazines and ammunition.
    It is unlawful to posses a high capacity magazine without a proper state issued FID, to which a non-resident may not secure and thus is forced to apply for the higher grade LTC.
    By state law the magazine is deemed to be same as a 'firearm' even as it might be empty/unloaded and/or not in any physical proximity to a firearm. Same similar as how the laws in New York state exist as current.
    So come to MA with a firearm magazine of any sort and not have an FID or LTC, and boom you are doomed...if for any of multiple life event reasons are caught in doing so.
    USC 926A does not specifically apply to magazines nor does it define 'firearm', as being what specific components singular nor as an assembly.
    Oh, and in MA by definition as stated within our laws if a magazine has 'ammunition' contained within a '"feeding device" then that firearm as associated to it is deemed by state law to be "loaded"
    I kid you not.

    Yet another catch specific to travel through MA is toward ammunition _and_ ammunition components. An item many people unfamiliar with MA gun laws do not know to be aware of.
    Here in MA ammunition is also highly regulated by the state and _requires_ at a minimum an FID (residents) and LTC (non-residents) to either purchase _OR_ possess.
    And by state law definition 'ammunition' is not just an assembled cartridge but it includes any and all _components_ of a cartridge whether these components be assembled, partially assembled, in singular component level state of being and/or whether the components be new or in as used/as fired condition such as and including but not limited to used brass.
    Once again I kid you not. Serious business and MA is not number three on the Brady list (tied with CT) for no reason nor by accident.

    For more on this subject and to confirm all I have stated above refer to the Mass General Laws:

    * FID/LTC requirement as related to possession be one carrying, transporting, or making use of a firearm
    Chapter 140: Section 131. Licenses to carry firearms; Class A and B; conditions and restrictions
    M.G.L - Chapter 140, Section 131
    Note:
    "FID" = 'Firearm Identification' card (A form of state issued citizen specific firearm possession permit)
    "LTC" = 'License To Carry' card (A higher level than FID state issued citizen specific firearm possession permit, that contrary to the misnomer name does not specifically imply nor allow all persons who have such a permit to in fact carry a firearm be it on their person or elsewhere outside of the interior of their home. More on that is covered in C140:S131.)

    * Magazines aka 'Feeding Device'
    Chapter 269: Section 10. Carrying dangerous weapons; possession of machine gun or sawed-off shotguns; possession of large capacity weapon or large capacity feeding device; punishment
    M.G.L. - Chapter 269, Section 10

    * Ammunition, What is?
    Chapter 140: Section 121. Firearms sales; definitions; antique firearms; application of law; exceptions
    M.G.L. - Chapter 140, Section 121

    Lenf45 you are wise to be apprehensive about traveling through MA with a firearm as an unlicensed non-resident.
    The Federal protections do not fully envelope your or most peoples real world situations as related to travel through and amongst this former state of the founding fathers.
    If I were you knowing what I know I too would do the exact same thing you have been doing which is to not at all bring a firearm, magazine, or ammunition in to the state of MA.

    Oh and if you bring a knife to carry on your person do know that Boston and several other smaller cities such as Worcester do have city bylaws that layer on top of state law as related to possession of knives which is allowed by state law and have withstood court challenge. So if you travel through such locations do know that there is a blade length limit there and that in this state overall no knife may be double edged which is not against many other states laws and regulations of same.

    Welcome to MA, USA...2009. :|

    - Janq

    P.S. - I forgot to mention, MA also regulates possession and purchase of all aerosol defensive products regardless of content. That too requires at a minimum an FID for a resident to possess or an LTC for non-residents. And electric discharge weapons such as taser, stun guns, and cattle prods are expressly not allowed and restricted to LEO use only.
    Last edited by Janq; June 8th, 2009 at 03:13 PM.
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

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    Jang.

    A lot of good info.

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    Jang Excellent post, Thank You!!

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    Senior Member Array redbird's Avatar
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    Libs aren't going to do anything that is sensible.

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