Gun Control: What is the Agenda

This is a discussion on Gun Control: What is the Agenda within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Gun Control: What Is the Agenda? by Paul Craig Roberts Some years or decades ago I researched and reported on the Sullivan Act, one of ...

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Thread: Gun Control: What is the Agenda

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    Senior Member Array agentmel's Avatar
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    Gun Control: What is the Agenda

    Gun Control: What Is the Agenda?

    by Paul Craig Roberts


    Some years or decades ago I researched and reported on the Sullivan Act, one of America’s first gun control laws.

    New York state senator Timothy Sullivan, a corrupt Tammany Hall politician, represented New York’s Red Hook district. Commercial travelers passing through the district would be relieved of their valuables by armed robbers. In order to protect themselves and their property, travelers armed themselves. This raised the risk of, and reduced the profit from, robbery. Sullivan’s outlaw constituents demanded that Sullivan introduce a law that would prohibit concealed carry of pistols, blackjacks, and daggers, thus reducing the risk to robbers from armed victims.

    The criminals, of course, were already breaking the law and had no intention of being deterred by the Sullivan Act from their business activity of armed robbery. Thus, the effect of the Sullivan Act was precisely what the criminals intended. It made their life of crime easier.

    As the first successful gun control advocates were criminals, I have often wondered what agenda lies behind the well-organized and propagandistic gun control organizations and their donors and sponsors in the US today. The propaganda issued by these organizations consists of transparent lies.

    Consider the propagandistic term, "gun violence," popularized by gun control advocates. This is a form of reification by which inanimate objects are imbued with the ability to act and to commit violence. Guns, of course, cannot be violent in themselves. Violence comes from people who use guns and a variety of other weapons, including fists, to commit violence.

    Nevertheless, we hear incessantly the Orwellian Newspeak term,...

    Read the rest here...
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    Member Array Tombstone55's Avatar
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    It's all about POWER.

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    Distinguished Member Array tangoseal's Avatar
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    I know all about that now look at where the laws have gone.

    Complete and total lust for control of the people. It really is the Devil's work if you ask me.
    "I believe that the right of the citizen to keep and bear arms must not be infringed if liberty in America is to survive." - Ronald Reagan

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    Sullivan laws and similar. I really think the folks who push these don't have hidden agendas. They just don't see the other side, the usefulness of a gun for self-defense, the usefulness of a gun for sporting purposes, or the usefulness of gun ownership as a hobby.

    Fear is often an irrational emotion, and the anti- gun ownership/gun rights folks are driven by an irrational emotion--the fear that guns cause gun violence.

    Now, sadly, too many bad things happen when BGs get their hands on guns, but BGs will get them no matter what--or use knives, or clubs, or nails, or whatever they can get their hands on. That's the part the other side just is not able to comprehend.

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    That's the part the other side just is not able to comprehend.
    If they are too stupid to comprehend what most of us see as a simple truth...then they really shouldn't be making laws.

    Unless of course they don't care, and they really do have an agenda.

    There are two kinds of people that embrace gun control. Those that are ignorant and those that want total control. Neither of them are worth a good bullet.
    The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those that speak it...- George Orwell

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    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    There are two kinds of people that embrace gun control. Those that are ignorant and those that want total control. Neither of them are worth a good bullet.
    Sure they are, and I bet many here would be willing to donate the bullet.
    Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
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    Gun Control: What is the Agenda
    Quote Originally Posted by tangoseal View Post
    Complete and total lust for control of the people. It really is the Devil's work if you ask me.
    Yup. That about covers it.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Sullivan laws and similar. I really think the folks who push these don't have hidden agendas. They just don't see the other side, the usefulness of a gun for self-defense, the usefulness of a gun for sporting purposes, or the usefulness of gun ownership as a hobby.

    Fear is often an irrational emotion, and the anti- gun ownership/gun rights folks are driven by an irrational emotion--the fear that guns cause gun violence.

    Now, sadly, too many bad things happen when BGs get their hands on guns, but BGs will get them no matter what--or use knives, or clubs, or nails, or whatever they can get their hands on. That's the part the other side just is not able to comprehend.
    Hop,

    I agree in part.

    I think most people have an irrational fear of guns.
    I think the leadership of these groups have a hidden agenda--I think it most often is control. They just use those who are acting out of their fear to swell their ranks and give them some legitimacy. "See how many people are opposed to guns?" they say, and thereby hide the real reason THEY are there...the control.

    JMO.
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    Senior Member Array JohnKelly's Avatar
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    If a citizen defends him or her self against a criminal using lethal force, then there will be no prison space taken up nor guards required. That equals less money for prisons and staff. How much power to prison lobbys have, quite a bit I would imagine.

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    VIP Member Array LongRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Sullivan laws and similar. I really think the folks who push these don't have hidden agendas.
    The OP just presented us with historical facts outlining how the first gun control law in the US was created by criminals’ with a hidden agenda. That is a fact not an opinion. It happened as stated. Research it for yourself.

    Any study of gun control or weapon control laws throughout history will show an agenda by those that initiate and impose them. That agenda is invariably an effort to control the populace by making them defenseless. To think that those initiating and promoting gun control in this country are the only gun control advocates in history to ever do so without a plan create a defenseless unarmed population is absurd. Our founding father knew that, which is why the second amendment exists. To assure that the leaders of this country would never ever have unarmed defenseless subjects. The second amendment is not about sports shooting, hunting or even self defense it is about making sure we the people can defend ourselves against tyrants.

    Of course that is not to say all those that support gun control have a hidden agenda. Not all the sheep who support gun control plan on becoming subjects of a totalitarian government. They are simply sheep who follow along believing the propaganda perpetuated by those who do want us all defenseless. That is what makes them sheep. Sheep who are unwilling or unable to see the possibility of a hidden agenda behind the touchy feely, feel good, myths created by the wanna-be RULERS of the United States.

    Once we begin to see the possibility of the hidden agenda do we begin to realize how truly deadly the anti self defense fanatics are. How important it is that we stop them and defend our civil rights
    Abort the Obamanation not the Constitution

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    Member Array langenc's Avatar
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    Two steps forward-on back. Just keep the legislation coming. It wont pass-this time-but sooner or later.

    Those wanting to UNdo legislation need to do the same--ala National Parks carry.

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    "What's the agenda?"

    It hasn't changed in 100 years. It's still corrupt politicians more worried about greed and little about the citizen...it's ALL about $$$.
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    Hidden agendas?

    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    "What's the agenda?"

    It hasn't changed in 100 years. It's still corrupt politicians more worried about greed and little about the citizen...it's ALL about $$$.
    The problem with these hypothesized hidden agendas and comments about corrupt polititicians and things being all about money IS that the argument can easily be turned around.

    The other side makes the very same argument. It is the gun industry that promotes gun ownership and opposes "common sense laws."

    See, both sides will use the same "hidden agenda" argument.

    Forget "hiden agendas." It doesn't do any good to worry about them. It doesn't solve any problem even if a rare one is ferreted out and is made public.

    Accusing the other side of bad faith (instead of no brains) is a waste of breath, typing finger energy, and all the rest.

    Also, some (if not the vast majority) really and truly are acting in what they think is good faith. For example, while I certainly don't agree with the lady congresswoman from NY whose husband was shot on a Long Island train, I can't accuse someone in her shoes of acting in bad faith or being motivated by money.

    You know, good people can and do have honest disagreements and differences of opinion or judgment.

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    Restricted Member Array SelfDefense's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Also, some (if not the vast majority) really and truly are acting in what they think is good faith. For example, while I certainly don't agree with the lady congresswoman from NY whose husband was shot on a Long Island train, I can't accuse someone in her shoes of acting in bad faith or being motivated by money.
    This is exactly right. Virtually all of the anti-gun people truly believe that society is better off without guns. They are right. However, there is no way to achieve that goal and moving in that direction harms innocent people and is destructive to society. That is something the antis do not understand.

    I don't think a single anti-gun person believes gun control is an effort to control the people as the many frightened folks here believe. If we did not live in a representative republic, the government could at any time swat away the brave libertarians as annoying flies, with or without guns. As it turns out, we have given excess power to the government and allow them to control us using taxes and regulations.

    You know, good people can and do have honest disagreements and differences of opinion or judgment.
    True, but some good people are simply wrong.

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    Now I know I hit my head,I'm mostly agreeing with SelfDefense.
    For the majority of Antigunners they just want to get rid of them, however illogically impossible that is to do. Some because they think it would make a safer world, others think guns are just evil. Still SelfDefense is forgetting about the powermad and hungry. They exist in every society, and must be watched for. Mostly though I think good people get stupid ideas, and never realize how stupid it is, although there are exceptions to that rule.
    I know not what this "overkill" means.

    Honing the knives, Cleaning the longguns, Stocking up ammo.

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