Guns on campus OK'd by Arizona Senate

Guns on campus OK'd by Arizona Senate

This is a discussion on Guns on campus OK'd by Arizona Senate within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Guns on campus OK'd by Arizona Senate By Howard Fischer Capitol Media Services Published: Saturday, June 27, 2009 2:16 AM MST PHOENIX — Saying it ...

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Thread: Guns on campus OK'd by Arizona Senate

  1. #1
    Member Array joe26's Avatar
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    Guns on campus OK'd by Arizona Senate

    Guns on campus OK'd by Arizona Senate
    By Howard Fischer
    Capitol Media Services
    Published: Saturday, June 27, 2009 2:16 AM MST
    PHOENIX — Saying it will make people safer, state senators voted Friday to let people with concealed weapons permits carry them onto college and university campuses where they are now forbidden.

    The 15-6 vote on the provision in HB 2439 came after backers said they believe that having people who are licensed by the state to have weapons should cut down on the number of massacres that occur on campuses. And Sen. John Huppenthal, R-Chandler, said that has happened in Arizona.

    He did not refer by name to the 2002 incident at the University of Arizona where three instructors at the College of Nursing were slain by student Robert S. Flores Jr. who then turned the gun on himself.

    But Huppenthal said the evidence shows that it makes sense, from a safety standpoint, to let people carry guns.

    “The states that have concealed carry (laws) have statistically significant smaller mass shootings,’’ he said.

    Huppenthal said he would not support guns on public school campuses, saying Arizona has no history of massacres on those campuses.

    “The situation is different in our universities,’’ he said.

    “We’ve had a mass shooting in our universities,’’ Huppenthal continued. “We sort of have a track record of not being safe in our universities.’’

    And he said that, based on the research, allowing those who have concealed weapons permits to bring them onto campuses would mean “our universities would be safer.’’

    University of Arizona lobbyist Greg Fahey said his school opposes allowing anyone to have guns on campus. And Fahey said he’s not convinced that rule should be waived for those with permits to carry concealed weapons even though they have undergone background checks, training in state laws and been shown to be proficient in the use of the gun.

    “Our chief of police and the police of all three universities have consistently said that their experience is that having people with guns is just more of an invitation to have accidents, to have problems,’’ Fahey said. “And they don’t want anyone who’s not a sworn officer being armed on campus.’’

    But Huppenthal said he’s not convinced that students and faculty are safer with gun-free campuses.

    The senator said his requests for information from universities shows “they haven’t done any careful analysis’’ of the crimes. And what they have done, he said, only involves those crimes on campus.

    “But the truth is, there’s a large number of rapes of coeds as they leave campus and they go to their home,’’ Huppenthal said. He said these women are forced to leave any guns at home — and leave themselves vulnerable while walking to class — because current rules prohibit weapons on campus.
    Thoughts?


  2. #2
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    I think Arizona campuses just got a little safer!!
    CCW permit holder for Idaho, Utah, Pennsylvania, Maine and New Hampshire. I can carry in your country but not my own.

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    Ex Member Array GreenHorn's Avatar
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    Excellent News!

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    Senior Member Array TucAzRider's Avatar
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    Wish this applied to ALL schools.. It is GREAT for the Colleges, but what about the kid too??

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    Member Array joe26's Avatar
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    Chances of other states doing the same thing? I am hoping for VA next.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe26 View Post
    Chances of other states doing the same thing? I am hoping for VA next.
    Congratulations, Arizona! Something similar went to "summer study" in Tennessee...it may pass next year.
    If the public are bound to yield obedience to laws to which they cannot give their approbation, they are slaves to those who make such laws and enforce them.--Samuel Adams as Candidus, Boston Gazette 20 Jan. 1772

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    Senior Member Array TucAzRider's Avatar
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    Ok.. This is quoted from Dustin's gun blog,..

    It would still allow people to get a CCW permit if they choose to in order to gain certain additional benefits such as reciprocity granted by other States that don't yet have constitutional carry laws, or to carry in current restricted areas under specific conditions, such as to carry onto school grounds while dropping off or picking up a child.

    If this is correct and it did indeed pass then a person should be able to carry concealed (with permit) when pickiing up and dropping off on school grounds?

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    Distinguished Member Array mathewsman's Avatar
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    grat news msu just did it hopefully they all will get on the band wagon
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    Huppenthal said he would not support guns on public school campuses, saying Arizona has no history of massacres on those campuses.
    Right. Wait until after the corpses pile up. Good call.

    “Our chief of police and the police of all three universities have consistently said that their experience is that having people with guns is just more of an invitation to have accidents, to have problems,’’ Fahey said.
    1. Where exactly did they accumulate all this experience working with legally armed students?
    2. So disarming officers would reduce accidents and problems?




    Well, it's definitely a step in the right direction. College "kids" are the same age as the men and women we send abroad with rifles and rucksacks. And, no matter where a person goes, he or she should not be stripped of self-protection.
    "The flock sleep peaceably in their pasture at night because Sheepdogs stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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    Don't get excited just yet. The bill died this morning. Six republicans who said they would vote for it decided not to show up, so it failed by 1 stinkin' vote! The legislative year is up now in AZ, so we'll have to try again next time. I have already contacted my representative to inform him how displeased I am with his failure to show.

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    Senior Member Array TucAzRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Filbert View Post
    Don't get excited just yet. The bill died this morning. Six republicans who said they would vote for it decided not to show up, so it failed by 1 stinkin' vote! The legislative year is up now in AZ, so we'll have to try again next time. I have already contacted my representative to inform him how displeased I am with his failure to show.
    Where did you read this? I cannot find anything on it?

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    More info...The Republicans missing during the final vote were Nancy Barto (R7), Rich Crandall (R19), Adam Driggs (R11), Bill Konopnicki (R5), Lucy Mason (R1), and Doug Quelland (R10).

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    Member Array Filbert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TucAzRider View Post
    Where did you read this? I cannot find anything on it?
    I am a member of the Arizona Citizens' Defense League. Check 'em out. They send out these alerts.

    “Sine Die” is the Latin term the Arizona Legislature uses to signify the adjournment of the legislative session. The Senate adjourned this morning, July 1, 2009 at 7:30 AM. The House adjourned at 7:31 AM. It’s officially over folks. Unless a Special Session is called by the Governor, we have a 6 month reprieve on any further legislative meddling in our lives.

    Unfortunately HB 2439, the AzCDL-requested CCW training reform bill that was amended to include Petty Offense and Defensive Display language, failed in the House at 5:10 AM this morning. It passed in the Senate Third Read by a 18-5-7 vote around 2 AM but when it was voted on in the House Final Read, it failed by one vote, 30-10 with 20 (Yes, twenty!) members not voting. Five of those twenty who were not present for the vote were Republicans who had indicated to us that they would vote for the bill. If they had been present, HB 2439 would have easily passed. You can find how every Representative voted here: Format Document . The Republicans missing during the final vote were Nancy Barto (R7), Rich Crandall (R19), Adam Driggs (R11), Bill Konopnicki (R5), Lucy Mason (R1), and Doug Quelland (R10). If you are in their Districts, please keep this in mind next November.

    Despite the setback with HB 2439, there are four pro-rights bills that made it through the legislative gauntlet and are headed to the governor’s desk. They are SB 1113, SB 1168, SB 1243 and SB 1449.

    SB 1113, a “Restaurant Carry” bill laden with concessions to appease opponents, passed in the House Third Read yesterday (6/30/09) by a 40-19-1 vote. Early this morning, it passed the Senate Final Read by a 19-8-3 vote. In the final version of SB 1113:
    - “Open carry” is not allowed in places serving alcohol. The firearm must be concealed.
    - Only individuals with CCW permits may carry a concealed firearm where alcohol is served.
    - The individual legally carrying the firearm may not consume alcohol.
    - The penalty for violating the law is a class 3 misdemeanor.
    - Establishments may prohibit firearms by posting a sign in a specified location.
    - It is an “affirmative defense” if the person violating the law “was not informed of the notice,” the sign had “fallen down,” the person is not a resident of Arizona, or the posted sign has not been up for 30 days.
    - However, lack of knowledge (by Arizona residents only) that firearms are prohibited in establishments serving alcohol is no longer a valid defense.

    SB 1168 is the Senate bill containing the “strike everything” amendment substituting the language of HB 2474. It passed the Senate Final Read by a vote of 18-9 with 3 not voting. SB 1168 prevents any private or public employer, property owner, etc., from banning any person from keeping a firearm in a locked vehicle in a parking area on the property, with specific limited exceptions. HB 2474, the original “Parking Lot” bill, passed in the House and made it through Senate committees but was dropped when SB 1168 made it through the process first.

    SB 1243 passed the House Third Read by a vote of 42-12-6 on June 29. Since the language in SB 1243 remained unchanged, it was sent back to the Senate where it was formally sent to the Governor this morning. SB 1243 is the AzCDL-requested bill that codifies the defensive display of a firearm.

    Another very important bill that passed this session is SB 1449 which applies, retroactively, statutory changes relating to justification defenses in all cases in which the defendant did not plead guilty or no contest that were submitted to the fact finder as of April 24, 2006. In plain language this means that the restoration of the “innocent until proven guilty” language that passed out of the Legislature via SB 1145 in 2006 retroactively applies to cases pending at the time of passage. The most infamous of these was the trial of Harold Fish, who defended himself while hiking and was prosecuted under the 1997 “guilty until proven innocent” law. Even though SB 1145 became law in the middle of Mr. Fish’s trial, he was convicted under the older law. You can read more about Mr. Fish’s case here: Harold Fish Defense .

    This has been a very bizarre legislative session. With the focus almost entirely on the budget, very little time was spent on non-budget bills, and there was a mad rush to end the session and filter out as many bills as possible. Without the constant pressure YOU provided via your emails, letter and phone calls, AzCDL’s representatives (who went home this morning after staying all night lobbying and counting votes at the Capitol) would not have been able to keep pro-rights bill in the pipeline. Pat yourselves on the back – Job Well Done!

    Unfortunately, we’re not out of the woods yet. The Legislature may have adjourned but the Governor now has a stack of bills on her desk to sign, ignore or veto. Her priority is the budget. The Legislature deliberately waited until Sine Die to send the budget to the Governor. If she vetoes the budget, state bureaucracies grind to a halt. A “do over” budget will require the Governor to call a Special legislative session, with more delays. It boils down to gamesmanship and who blinks first. All the non-budget bills might become pawns in the power struggle.

    Meanwhile, the next step is to start asking the Governor to sign these bills. Her email address is azgov@az.gov. You can also fax a letter to her at 602-542-1381. Or you can mail it to her at the following address:

    The Honorable Jan Brewer
    Governor of Arizona
    1700 West Washington
    Phoenix, Arizona 85007

    You can call her office, toll free, at 1-800-253-0883 or 602-543-4331.

    You can also go to the Governor’s website, Arizona Governor Jan Brewer - Contact Form, where you will find a fill-in-the-blanks form to register your opinion. For "subject", scroll down and select "Legislation." For "topic", fill in the number of the bill you are making a comment on (e.g., SB 1243). In the message/comment area, leave a polite message asking her to sign the bill you are referring to. We recommend a separate message for each bill.

    Stay tuned! We will notify you on the fate of legislation via these Alerts and Twitter.

    These alerts are a project of the Arizona Citizens Defense League (AzCDL), an all volunteer, non-profit, non-partisan grassroots organization. Renew today!

    AzCDL – Protecting Your Freedom
    Join Us!

  14. #14
    Ex Member Array JOHNSMITH's Avatar
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    It's not all about the massacres. Admittedly, the likelihood of a massacre is low, but still needs to be defended against.

    At any rate, a major reason for this is because college campuses aren't immune from regular crime. In fact, they're pretty high up on robbery, assault, etc. And the areas surrounding a campus are always quite run down and full of unsavory types.

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    I am glad that AZ laws are getting even better. A person not consuming alcohol should be able to Conceal Carry inside that establishment.

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