Georgia restaurant carry law doesn't make sense ...

This is a discussion on Georgia restaurant carry law doesn't make sense ... within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; ... I know, I know, lots of firearms law don't !!! So I am back in North Georgia for a week. My Florida CCW is ...

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Thread: Georgia restaurant carry law doesn't make sense ...

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array jfl's Avatar
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    Georgia restaurant carry law doesn't make sense ...

    ... I know, I know, lots of firearms law don't !!!

    So I am back in North Georgia for a week.
    My Florida CCW is good here.
    Since July 2008 I can carry in restaurants under the 50% rule (like in Florida).

    However, I cannot drink while carrying.

    So, after the appetizers, I give my gun to my wife, she is allowed to have 2 guns, I am not carrying anymore, so I drink a beer.
    Later, she gives me my gun back and hers, and legally drink her Gin and Tonic.

    Or, I could drink a 6-pack before leaving the hotel and be legal (and slightly impaired) at the restaurant drinking iced tea.

    Before you fire the flame-throwers, let me say that I am totally against CUI (carrying under the influence)

    Maybe I should have posted this thread in the "Humor" section

    Let me also say that I feel comfortable having one, repeat ONE, beer with a good dinner.
    The first rule of a gunfight: "Don't be there !"
    The second rule: "Bring enough gun"

    jfl
    (NRA Life Member/Instructor - GOA - IDPA - GSSF - ex-IHMSA)

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array automatic slim's Avatar
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    I'm just wondering how the waiter reacts when he sees you two passing guns back and forth.
    "First gallant South Carolina nobly made the stand."
    Edge of Darkness

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    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
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    So what exactly was the point of this post?

    If I understand it, it was to tell us how you broke the spirit of a law to stay within the letter of a law while passing guns back and forth in a public place because you couldn't or wouldn't eat without alcohol.

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    Distinguished Member Array jfl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    So what exactly was the point of this post?

    If I understand it, it was to tell us how you broke the spirit of a law to stay within the letter of a law while passing guns back and forth in a public place because you couldn't or wouldn't eat without alcohol.
    No, not really.
    The first rule of a gunfight: "Don't be there !"
    The second rule: "Bring enough gun"

    jfl
    (NRA Life Member/Instructor - GOA - IDPA - GSSF - ex-IHMSA)

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    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
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    Ok.

    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    So what exactly was the point of this post?

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    Ok.
    The law is stupid but I believe the spirit of the law is to keep people that choose to carry guns in SD, alcohol free while doing so,you have shown how that law can be skirted so they may decide they will fix it and just ban guns in any place that serves alcohol
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
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    Member Array Holger's Avatar
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    How about the VA restaurant carry laws? I can't carry concealed in places that serve alcohol. However, I can open carry in such places and even drink a beer. Now, if I was retired LEO or a Commonwealth's Attorney, I can carry concealed in restaurants that serve alcohol AND drink. Note: For the CA's, no CHP is required and no training is required to carry concealed. Make sense?

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    Member Array crankinNM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jfl View Post
    ...
    However, I cannot drink while carrying.


    Before you fire the flame-throwers, let me say that I am totally against CUI (carrying under the influence)

    Maybe I should have posted this thread in the "Humor" section

    Let me also say that I feel comfortable having one, repeat ONE, beer with a good dinner.
    It seems that "rules where made to be broken" applies here.

    We are a nation of rule breakers.........we pretty much have to be.

    When you break the rules....keep it to yourself.

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    Member Array Bprepared's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jfl View Post
    ... I know, I know, lots of firearms law don't !!!

    So I am back in North Georgia for a week.
    My Florida CCW is good here.
    Since July 2008 I can carry in restaurants under the 50% rule (like in Florida).
    I didn't think there was a 50% rule here in Florida

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    Distinguished Member Array Anubis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    So what exactly was the point of this post?
    I see the point in the title of the thread. If the Georgia law does in fact state simply that drinking alcohol while carrying is prohibited, jfl clearly demonstrates its fallacy. The law should have been written to provide a logically rigorous prohibition. For example, "carry of concealed weapons is prohibited by any person whose blood alcohol content is above amount X while the person is outside his or her owned, rented, or leased private property".

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    Member Array tflhndn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anubis View Post
    I see the point in the title of the thread. If the Georgia law does in fact state simply that drinking alcohol while carrying is prohibited, jfl clearly demonstrates its fallacy. The law should have been written to provide a logically rigorous prohibition. For example, "carry of concealed weapons is prohibited by any person whose blood alcohol content is above amount X while the person is outside his or her owned, rented, or leased private property".
    +1. That's what NC does - you cannot carry concealed with ANY alcohol in you system. (but you can OC)

    While I am not in favor of getting drunk while carrying, I dislike prohibitions on carrying concealed with ANY alcohol in one's system

    The drinking and driving argument doesn't wash with me, nor does the "guns and booze don't mix" since we are not talking about drinking and shooting, we're talking about drinking and carrying it.

    Drinking affects one's judgment, true, but the act of carrying a frirearm does not require any concious thought or actions to prevent the gun from going boom (unlike driving a car or actually shooting).

    The only time it becomes an issue, is when someone feels the need to use their firearm, and obvioulsy it creates a HUGE risk in terms of both civil itigation and exposure to criminal charges (i.e., the claim that alcohol consumption altered your judgment of the situation that prompted the use of deadly force).

    But carrying is carrying, and shooting is shooting. Let us not confuse the two.

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    There is no such thing as a 50% rule in Florida.

    Edited to help explain for those that may not be aware of the FL law. The law does not get into percentages but addresses the portion of the business that is primarily devoted to serving alcohol. If you go into a restaurant you can't even walk through the bar (even if to simply go to the restroom from your dinner table). You can go to the restaurant and order drinks with your meal or even just order drinks without a meal.

    I am not a lawyer, but this is what I get from reading the law and also Gutmacher.
    Last edited by StevePVB; September 28th, 2009 at 07:45 PM.

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    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukalmighty View Post
    The law is stupid but I believe the spirit of the law is to keep people that choose to carry guns in SD, alcohol free while doing so,you have shown how that law can be skirted so they may decide they will fix it and just ban guns in any place that serves alcohol
    I seriously apologize if I misinterpret your post, but it's one long sentence so I'm not sure what you are saying. I'm going by the last part where you say, "...you have shown how that law can be skirted so they may decide they will fix it and jsut ban guns in any place that serves alcohol."

    I didn't show anything. That would be the original poster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anubis View Post
    I see the point in the title of the thread. If the Georgia law does in fact state simply that drinking alcohol while carrying is prohibited, jfl clearly demonstrates its fallacy. The law should have been written to provide a logically rigorous prohibition. For example, "carry of concealed weapons is prohibited by any person whose blood alcohol content is above amount X while the person is outside his or her owned, rented, or leased private property".
    Then it was a point that didn't need to be made. In this forum, who was going to disagree with him? Of course it's a stupid law. That wasn't the point at all. What I was trying to get him to admit, was that he posted that story to basically brag about how he broke the law. This risks making gun owners look like dangerous and unable to follow the law.

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    Distinguished Member Array jfl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    I seriously apologize if I misinterpret your post, but it's one long sentence so I'm not sure what you are saying. I'm going by the last part where you say, "...you have shown how that law can be skirted so they may decide they will fix it and jsut ban guns in any place that serves alcohol."

    I didn't show anything. That would be the original poster.



    Then it was a point that didn't need to be made. In this forum, who was going to disagree with him? Of course it's a stupid law. That wasn't the point at all. What I was trying to get him to admit, was that he posted that story to basically brag about how he broke the law. This risks making gun owners look like dangerous and unable to follow the law.
    I am not stupid enough to actually shuffle a pair of guns from one person to another in a restaurant.
    If I had wanted to drink, I would just have ordered a glass of wine, concealed is concealed !

    It was a hypothetical scenario to show how a law can be badly written and leave gaping loop-holes because it focus on an object (gun + booze) instead of a behavior (being impaired).
    Same situation happened to me in California in the 80's. After a pic-nic on the beach, I volunteered to take the trash back in a 80 Corvette; got stopped for allegedly refusing the right of way to a cop in private car. He found the trash bag and there was an empty can of beer, not even mine; he went to give me a hard time about "open container", could take me to jail, etc. I told him I hadn't drunk any alcohol and I was ready to take a test. He said I should have put the trash bag in the trunk. I told him I had the car for a year and hadn't found the trunk yet (being a smart-ass). An hour later we were free to go.

    Same as above, the law focus on an object (car + open container) instead of a behavior (being impaired).
    The first rule of a gunfight: "Don't be there !"
    The second rule: "Bring enough gun"

    jfl
    (NRA Life Member/Instructor - GOA - IDPA - GSSF - ex-IHMSA)

  16. #15
    Member Array Bprepared's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StevePVB View Post
    There is no such thing as a 50% rule in Florida.

    Edited to help explain for those that may not be aware of the FL law. The law does not get into percentages but addresses the portion of the business that is primarily devoted to serving alcohol. If you go into a restaurant you can't even walk through the bar (even if to simply go to the restroom from your dinner table). You can go to the restaurant and order drinks with your meal or even just order drinks without a meal.

    I am not a lawyer, but this is what I get from reading the law and also Gutmacher.

    Thats what I thought also

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