The RIGHT.

The RIGHT.

This is a discussion on The RIGHT. within the The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; The Second Amendment guarantees our Right to Keep and Bear Arms. To me, this means that I have the Right, as long as I have ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array kansastom's Avatar
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    The RIGHT.

    The Second Amendment guarantees our Right to Keep and Bear Arms. To me, this means that I have the Right, as long as I have not forfeited that Right (been convicted of a felony, been judged mentally incompetent and/or unstable, etc.), to purchase, keep in my home, and keep on my person, Openly (open carry), "legal" firearms.

    I do NOT have the Right to Carry Concealed. That is a Privilege, and that Privilege is only given me when I have demonstrated that I Understand the legal and moral ramifications of carrying concealed and Using a deadly weapon, AND can show some level of Proficiency in Using a deadly weapon.

    That's MY opinion, for what it's worth.

    Let the flaming begin!
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    That's fine, in Kansas, but in FL, other than going to/from hunting/fishing, you can't open carry. But you can CC. Make sense? No, not to me. but that's the law, so I CC. I guess the state's interpretation of "bear arms" means one can carry in one form or another, but not in all forms.
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    Member Array kansastom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    That's fine, in Kansas, but in FL, other than going to/from hunting/fishing, you can't open carry. But you can CC. Make sense? No, not to me. but that's the law, so I CC. I guess the state's interpretation of "bear arms" means one can carry in one form or another, but not in all forms.
    And, OldVet, one of my points is that you Should have the Right, in Florida or any other state in the United States, to Openly Carry (Bear Arms), if you choose to exercise that Right. Additionally, you have the Right to defend yourself in your home, using Deadly Force (Bear Arms) if necessary, and that Right also Should exist in each and every State, each and every Community (and does, according to the 2nd). You have the Option (Privilege) to CC, in Florida (and other states), but they have taken away your Right, in my opinion.
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    VIP Member Array rottkeeper's Avatar
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    Show me where in the second amendment it states anything about method of carry or restrictions of carry and maybe I will agree. Until then I affirm we have the right to OC or CC.
    For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the son of man be. Mathew 24:27

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    Distinguished Member Array tangoseal's Avatar
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    The Second A means that you have the right to carry openly without the need for special permission or license.

    The second A doesn't exactly describe carry conealed without the above mentioned but that still should not pose a limitation on concealed carry. PERIOD!

    That is my opinion.

    Never should you have to get a license to carry openly but if you are a law breaker and are banned from the ability to carry a weapon due to felony then you need to obey the law and NOT carry anything open or concealed or face DIRE consequence.
    "I believe that the right of the citizen to keep and bear arms must not be infringed if liberty in America is to survive." - Ronald Reagan

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    Senior Member Array Rob P.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tangoseal View Post
    The Second A means that you have the right to carry openly without the need for special permission or license.

    The second A doesn't exactly describe carry conealed without the above mentioned but that still should not pose a limitation on concealed carry. PERIOD!

    That is my opinion.

    Never should you have to get a license to carry openly but if you are a law breaker and are banned from the ability to carry a weapon due to felony then you need to obey the law and NOT carry anything open or concealed or face DIRE consequence.
    Actually, a better way to say this (IMO) is to say that the 2A says that you have a right to own, possess, and carry arms. HOW those arms are "owned, possessed, carried" etc is subject to regulation so long as the regulation doesn't amount to a defacto ban.

    No right is "absolute." Even speech is subject to reasonable regulation (no hate speech for example).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob P. View Post
    No right is "absolute." Even speech is subject to reasonable regulation (no hate speech for example).
    Had to jump on this one - hate speech is NOT subject to any regulation by government entities in the US. It is in other countries - the first amendment keeps it legal and the courts have backed this up.

    Other than that I agree. All rights are subject to reasonable time place and manner restrictions necessary (and only so far as is strictly necessary) to serve a compelling state interest.

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    VIP Member Array rottkeeper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob P. View Post
    Actually, a better way to say this (IMO) is to say that the 2A says that you have a right to own, possess, and carry arms. HOW those arms are "owned, possessed, carried" etc is subject to regulation so long as the regulation doesn't amount to a defacto ban.

    No right is "absolute." Even speech is subject to reasonable regulation (no hate speech for example).
    WRONG, What does this mean to you?

    "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.


    Hard to believe an attorney would have this opinion.
    For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the son of man be. Mathew 24:27

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    Member Array Colt 45's Avatar
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    The Second Amendment says "shall not be infringed" not shall not be banned.

    Max

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob P. View Post
    Actually, a better way to say this (IMO) is to say that the 2A says that you have a right to own, possess, and carry arms. HOW those arms are "owned, possessed, carried" etc is subject to regulation so long as the regulation doesn't amount to a defacto ban.

    No right is "absolute." Even speech is subject to reasonable regulation (no hate speech for example).

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    I must know where you are reading that open carry is a right and concealed carry is a privilege. Or is this just an opinion of yours not based on the text of the 2nd?
    eschew obfuscation

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    VIP Member Array peckman28's Avatar
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    If the 2nd Amendment meant only open carry, it would have said you have a right to open carry. It says no such thing, it simply says bear arms. It must be nice living in a state where OC and CC is an option. Out here in Hawaii, OC and enjoy your brandishing charge. Apply for a CC permit and while you're at it, wait for hell to freeze over. It'll probably happen before you get your permit. Laws like this stem from nonsensical hair-splitting over what the 2A means. It means what it says. Period.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CopperKnight View Post
    I must know where you are reading that open carry is a right and concealed carry is a privilege. Or is this just an opinion of yours not based on the text of the 2nd?
    Nowhere does 2A indicate that OC or CC is either allowed or denied, in those specific terms. It simply says this Right (of the Individual, to Keep and Bear Arms) "shall not be infringed." To "Keep and Bear Arms", therefore, is a Right. How we are "allowed" to exercise this Right has been, is, and will always be debatable. To me, personally, "bearing" means to Own, keep in my Home (and, many States extend this to my car, as well), and "possess" (carry, in some form, which to me indicates OC).

    I admit that this is Strictly MY opinion, based on MY reading of 2A and other writings related to 2A. To me, it is logical.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rottkeeper View Post
    Show me where in the second amendment it states anything about method of carry or restrictions of carry and maybe I will agree. Until then I affirm we have the right to OC or CC.
    +1 I agree
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  14. #14
    Member Array kansastom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peckman28 View Post
    If the 2nd Amendment meant only open carry, it would have said you have a right to open carry. It says no such thing, it simply says bear arms. It must be nice living in a state where OC and CC is an option. Out here in Hawaii, OC and enjoy your brandishing charge. Apply for a CC permit and while you're at it, wait for hell to freeze over. It'll probably happen before you get your permit. Laws like this stem from nonsensical hair-splitting over what the 2A means. It means what it says. Period.
    2A absolutely DOES mean what it says. So, when it says that "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed", it means that we (Individuals, the People) can Purchase, Own, and Possess Arms, without infringment (of any kind?.....I think not, as others have said.....yelling "fire" in a crowded theater is NOT a free speech Right). That is our Right. How we are allowed to "possess" these arms is debatable, because the 2A says "bear arms", not OC or CC.
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  15. #15
    Member Array kansastom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rottkeeper View Post
    Show me where in the second amendment it states anything about method of carry or restrictions of carry and maybe I will agree. Until then I affirm we have the right to OC or CC.
    Show me where the 1A says "except yelling 'fire' in a crowded theater", in relation to our Free Speech Right. All of our Rights are Limited, to one degree or another. None are Absolute. Common sense.

    All that said, we all have our own opinions. And I respect yours, even though I disagree with it.
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