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Originally Posted by kpw
Your and my feelings about the tactical worth of open carry doesn't really matter here. Does this group seek attention? Sure. It's called raising awareness. It's not the only way they do it but it is an effective one. Do they expect the possibillity of negative attention? Sure they do.
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That is exactly my point. However, the awareness they raised in the instance was completely negative. Contrast that with the open holster protest on college campuses throughout the nation. Positive and effective awareness and good publicity that opened the debate.
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That's why they studied the laws and can cite them so well. Negative attention would be on the order of the police showing up. It's the officer's actions after their arrival that starts the problem.
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Police showed up because they were informed there was a potential problem. From what I read, the problems began when the patrons refused to identify themselves. Why do you think they did that?
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He just refused to comply with an unlawful demand. He stood his ground and it's his ground to stand no matter what you or I may think of it.
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It is not unlawful to ask for indentification. He stood his ground and received the consequences of acting out. Why did he not identify himself? Exactly what was he trying to accomplish? I submit he accomplished exactly what he wanted.
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No bank robbery suspect open carrying. Just a bunch of regular folks eating dinner. Refusing an unlawful command does not give them reasonable suspicion but it does make them angry. Because you can't imagine not showing your identity papers doesn't mean everyone is comfortable with that notion wether it seems innocuous to you or not.
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Identity papers? What papers. A driver's license? A gun permit? A passport? Do you have something to hide? It doesn't matter whether you are comfortable with it. In order to participate in our society you must conform to the established conduct. You cannot do as you please when you interact with others.
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I think they would have prefered the police to uphold the laws and let them eat in peace. Believe me, there is NOTHING that makes antis more supportive of our cause. If anything, seeing people go about their everyday lives while openly armed can help to persuade those that have been inundated with negative media about gun owners.
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This incident is extraordinarily negative to gun owners. It is good that this situation is confined to gun forums where many can pat themselves on the back as they stand up for their 'rights.' The alternative is to show a bunch of fanatics, not complying with LEO, and threatening legal action because they were inconvenienced. I prefer to show gun owners in a positive light as most of us do in our every day lives, informing others and providing arguments for our cause.
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Remember what the manager said about the problem not starting until the police showed up. The responding officers are the ones that caused the scene.
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The actions of everyone involved caused the problem, not just the LEO.