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Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions Discussion regarding concealed carry licensing, issues, methods of concealment, etc.

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Old December 28th, 2008, 10:56 PM   #21
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Run by the now bankrupt and virulent anti-gun Schottenstein family of Columbus, Ohio.

Good riddance to Value City.
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Old December 29th, 2008, 02:40 AM   #22
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Tenn Mike,

I like your style and am glad you showed them we're not all pushovers.
Thanks Anchor44.....and may I say I really like your avatar. I assume you were a Master Chief in the US Navy? I myself was an FC1 once upon a time. Nice to meet you shipmate!
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Old December 29th, 2008, 10:56 AM   #23
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Elyria, Ohio.
Closed.
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Old December 29th, 2008, 11:01 AM   #24
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Good post. I was just asking the guy i carpool with, also a CC'er, if he has seen any of these signs anywhere in MI. I have yet to see one, but it sounds like VC would have been my 1st. The store in Westland is also going out of business...which apparently takes months b/c every time i drive by the store they have people out with the huge signs advertising it. Just go already!
Certainly not a place i would spend my money.
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Old December 29th, 2008, 12:23 PM   #25
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Good post. I was just asking the guy i carpool with, also a CC'er, if he has seen any of these signs anywhere in MI. I have yet to see one, but it sounds like VC would have been my 1st. The store in Westland is also going out of business...which apparently takes months b/c every time i drive by the store they have people out with the huge signs advertising it. Just go already!
Certainly not a place i would spend my money.
Here is a good site to see a list of places to avoid in michigan.

MCRGO - Do Not Patronize while Armed

Jared Jewelry is also on there.
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Old December 29th, 2008, 01:04 PM   #26
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I followed the link to the "Do Not Patronize While Armed". Whew!!! That's alot of places where you can't carry. I hope that there are places where you can shop without this nonsense. You'all oughta chip in and by ad space advising folks where not to shop and why. Bet those signs come down in a hurry!

Here in Florida I have never seen a "No Guns Allowed" sign here.
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Old December 29th, 2008, 01:43 PM   #27
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In MI it's trespassing to ignore a sign. Also, our no duty retreat law only applies if we are at a place where we have a legal right to be. If we are trespassing, then we are not protected by our "stand your ground" (No duty t retreat) law.
Cupcake, could you site a source on this? First I've heard of it. AFAIK, Michigan no gun signs carry absolutely no force of law.

If you are discovered carrying in a business so posted, they can ask you to leave. If you refuse, THEN you are guilty of trespassing. Of course, we shouldn't shop in those places anyway. And if we did, no reason for them ever to see our weapon.

Besides, the same goes even for an unposted business, they can ask you to leave at any time, and if they do so, and you refuse, you are still trespassing. But to my knowledge, ignoring their pitiful sign and entering while carrying does not automatically constitute a crime of any kind.

As to Value City, thought I'd heard they were going out of business (one post here mentions it too). Thought it was chain wide? Maybe just local? Either way, to them, I say.... good riddance!
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Old December 29th, 2008, 04:30 PM   #28
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Here is a good site to see a list of places to avoid in michigan.

MCRGO - Do Not Patronize while Armed

Jared Jewelry is also on there.
A good list to have. Thank you
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Old December 29th, 2008, 08:07 PM   #29
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I've never seen a posted place in Metro D.

I'm also curious about the trespassing thing too.
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Old December 29th, 2008, 10:53 PM   #30
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Cupcake, could you site a source on this? First I've heard of it. AFAIK, Michigan no gun signs carry absolutely no force of law.

If you are discovered carrying in a business so posted, they can ask you to leave. If you refuse, THEN you are guilty of trespassing. Of course, we shouldn't shop in those places anyway. And if we did, no reason for them ever to see our weapon.

Besides, the same goes even for an unposted business, they can ask you to leave at any time, and if they do so, and you refuse, you are still trespassing. But to my knowledge, ignoring their pitiful sign and entering while carrying does not automatically constitute a crime of any kind.
Don't know that it's written so much as an interpretation. Basically it was explained to me like this (and makes sense to me):

If a place has a sign that says "keep out" or "No trespassing" then you are trespassing once ignore the sign and walk in. You don't have to be verbally told to leave to be trespassing.

If we apply the fact that a "keep out" sign is enough for a trespassing conviction, then we must consider that a no gun sign is warning enough, and no verbal is needed. Perhaps it would only hold up if the sign specifically said that "those who bring firearms in here are trespassing" but I wouldn't want ot be a test case. The trespassing probably no big deal, but if something went down and some prosecutor with an agenda decides that you had a duty to retreat and you didn't, then it's a whole ballgame that I wouldn't want to play.

That said, If I had to use deadly force and there is some prosecutor who thinks I didn't try hard enough to run away, then I'd probably be dead if not for having a weapon. I don't want to tell anybody what they should do, just make everyone think before making decisions.
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