Hypothetical, really

Euclidean · January 24th, 2006, 01:49 PM

P95's thread on the idea CCW mandate got me thinking. Say I do become king and my recently slightly altered gun laws (with more logical provisions for legal immigrants and persons under restraining orders

) were put into effect...

I don't think it would change much in all honesty. Now for the serfs stuck in PRK MD or Mass or other places, it'd be a big immediate change, but over the course of time I don't think it would matter so much.

The reason I say that is that only a certain segment of the population bothers to arm itself. A minority of the people to be sure. Even in states where CCW laws are more reasonable, it's a minority of people that carry.

And that's fine and good, that's a decision everyone should make for themselves and there's good and bad points either way, but I honestly believe that most people would still not bother if all the stupid laws suddenly went away... maybe 1 in 20 at best would carry. Even with the perception that "Guns = illegal" gone away, I think the CCW "rate" would be almost as low as it is now in states where permits are more reasonable to obtain.

I don't think this is bad or good, and while I agree that letting everyone carry or not carry freely would net a positive effect, I think it's human nature that most people still wouldn't bother.

What say you?

HappyGunner · January 24th, 2006, 01:58 PM

I agree most would not carry. Meaning the people not out robbing and killing. We all know the thugs don't give the firearm laws a hoot they all carry guns and quickly will use them.

If people feel safe walking the streets and inside their homes with thin doors and driving arund on the dangerous streets of their Cities. I say good luck.

You need all the luck you can get.

P95Carry · January 24th, 2006, 03:05 PM

I think Euc the bottom line may be - the sheep/sheepdog ratio!!!

Seems whatever the restrictions or lack of them - there will always be a majority of sheep, existing in blissful ignorance of an risk - and usually (thankfully) getting away with it.

This ''sheep trend'' is one that I reckon has over the last 20-30 years increased hugely - a function of societal and gov' changes. For some folks the ''The Gov will protect me'' is the mantra - for others it is maybe just pure lazy complacency - the easy option, shut the eyes and pretend ''stuff'' doesn't happen. Extend that too to include - ''it'll never happen to me'' syndrome.

madmike · January 24th, 2006, 03:09 PM

As I've said before, the only group of people who have anything to fear from fully restoring our right to keep and bear arms, is the criminal element.

It is a sad fact that far too many otherwise intelligent people are absolutely blind to this truth.

mm

QKShooter · January 24th, 2006, 03:20 PM

Natural Disasters ~ Terror Threats ~ & Serial Killers On The Loose DO tend to turn ordinary non~gun people into Carry People.
Maybe not super well trained but, firearm sales & permit apps get a strong jolt during those types of situations.
Handgun sales jump way up...some buyers just keep the gun at home but, unusual or atypical circumstances prompt many others to decide to carry.
Just my 2 cents worth.

Euclidean · January 24th, 2006, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madmike

As I've said before, the only group of people who have anything to fear from fully restoring our right to keep and bear arms, is the criminal element.

It is a sad fact that far too many otherwise intelligent people are absolutely blind to this truth.

mm

I can agree with that. The worst part is though, that people won't bring themselves to understand that the existence of "normal" people with guns cuts down violent crimes of opportunity.

Texas crime has gone down steadily since the passage of the CHL act, and it's because although maybe 3% of the state carries, on the street, they don't know who is who. Perception is reality. If you perceive Joe Blow may shoot you, you act accordingly.

havegunjoe · January 24th, 2006, 03:30 PM

I think the entire country should change to a Vermont style carry system. That being said I think the number of people carrying would increase by a lot. As you said just the states that presently do not allow any form of carry would increase the overall picture by a significant number. How much I don't know. I know many people that have said, if it wasn’t so expensive, or so much bother, or so different from state to state they would carry. A right shouldn't be buried under a lot of red tape and overall crap to make every special interest group happy. That is the trouble when government gets involved, It becomes expensive and cumbersome.

January 24th, 2006, 01:49 PM	#1
Euclidean VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Texas Posts: 3,213	Hypothetical, really P95's thread on the idea CCW mandate got me thinking. Say I do become king and my recently slightly altered gun laws (with more logical provisions for legal immigrants and persons under restraining orders ) were put into effect... I don't think it would change much in all honesty. Now for the serfs stuck in PRK MD or Mass or other places, it'd be a big immediate change, but over the course of time I don't think it would matter so much. The reason I say that is that only a certain segment of the population bothers to arm itself. A minority of the people to be sure. Even in states where CCW laws are more reasonable, it's a minority of people that carry. And that's fine and good, that's a decision everyone should make for themselves and there's good and bad points either way, but I honestly believe that most people would still not bother if all the stupid laws suddenly went away... maybe 1 in 20 at best would carry. Even with the perception that "Guns = illegal" gone away, I think the CCW "rate" would be almost as low as it is now in states where permits are more reasonable to obtain. I don't think this is bad or good, and while I agree that letting everyone carry or not carry freely would net a positive effect, I think it's human nature that most people still wouldn't bother. What say you? __________________ I am The Armed Educator.

January 24th, 2006, 03:05 PM	#3
P95Carry Assistant Administrator Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: South West PA Posts: 25,403	I think Euc the bottom line may be - the sheep/sheepdog ratio!!! Seems whatever the restrictions or lack of them - there will always be a majority of sheep, existing in blissful ignorance of an risk - and usually (thankfully) getting away with it. This ''sheep trend'' is one that I reckon has over the last 20-30 years increased hugely - a function of societal and gov' changes. For some folks the ''The Gov will protect me'' is the mantra - for others it is maybe just pure lazy complacency - the easy option, shut the eyes and pretend ''stuff'' doesn't happen. Extend that too to include - ''it'll never happen to me'' syndrome. __________________ Chris - P95 NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member. "To own a gun and assume that you are armed is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!." If a BG dies as the result of pointing a gun at me, then he has merely succumbed to an occupational hazard of being a thug

January 24th, 2006, 03:09 PM	#4
madmike Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Spring Hill, FL Posts: 752	As I've said before, the only group of people who have anything to fear from fully restoring our right to keep and bear arms, is the criminal element. It is a sad fact that far too many otherwise intelligent people are absolutely blind to this truth. mm __________________ Political Correctness has now "evolved" into Political Cowardice.

January 24th, 2006, 03:30 PM	#7
havegunjoe Distinguished Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 1,846	I think the entire country should change to a Vermont style carry system. That being said I think the number of people carrying would increase by a lot. As you said just the states that presently do not allow any form of carry would increase the overall picture by a significant number. How much I don't know. I know many people that have said, if it wasn’t so expensive, or so much bother, or so different from state to state they would carry. A right shouldn't be buried under a lot of red tape and overall crap to make every special interest group happy. That is the trouble when government gets involved, It becomes expensive and cumbersome. __________________ DEMOCRACY IS TWO WOLVES AND A LAMB VOTING ON WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH. LIBERTY IS A WELL ARMED LAMB CONTESTING THE VOTE. Certified Instructor for Minnesota Carry Permit NRA Pistol and Personal Protection Insrtuctor Utah Permit Certified Instructor

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January 24th, 2006, 01:58 PM	#2
HappyGunner Membership Revoked Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 151	I agree most would not carry. Meaning the people not out robbing and killing. We all know the thugs don't give the firearm laws a hoot they all carry guns and quickly will use them. If people feel safe walking the streets and inside their homes with thin doors and driving arund on the dangerous streets of their Cities. I say good luck. You need all the luck you can get.

January 24th, 2006, 03:20 PM	#5
QKShooter Assistant Administrator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Off Of The X Posts: 20,473	Natural Disasters ~ Terror Threats ~ & Serial Killers On The Loose DO tend to turn ordinary non~gun people into Carry People. Maybe not super well trained but, firearm sales & permit apps get a strong jolt during those types of situations. Handgun sales jump way up...some buyers just keep the gun at home but, unusual or atypical circumstances prompt many others to decide to carry. Just my 2 cents worth.