Roadrunner

That's the Army's specialty. It's a legal order as far as I can see, a ridiculous one but still a legal order. Take it up with your Congressman, JAG office, and maybe the SGM of the Army, maybe it'll help. Beyond that, get the hell out of the Army (that's what I did).

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- Kurt
“Freedom is the sure possession of those alone who have the courage to defend it.” ~Pericles of Athens
Primary Carry - Colt Commander .45 in a Brommeland Max-Con V

ka0azs

Yep, you're reading it right. However, as I stated before, in the military you don't really have a personal or private life, away from or on base.

Active duty personnell don't give up all of their rights as citizens when they join up, but many of them are severely restricted or "suspended" while they are in the service. Politically related speech for example.

One of the biggest transitions I had to make when I left active duty was realizing I could tell my employer (legally that is, smart is another matter) to go to hell on any issue not related to my work hours on his property.

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Randy
NRA Life Member

ExSoldier

I tried to post something earlier but the dang thing wouldn't transmit, so I'll try again.

JUST DAMN Things have changed since I was on active duty as an officer in the early 1980s! Back then I had a CCW and used to carry on post but off duty. However, when the Red Brigades (terrorists) killed General Dozier in (IIRC) '83, all general staff officers were directed to carry an issue 45 in condition 2 at all times on post and CCW other times. At that time I served on the G4 (Logistics) staff of a two star. Life was good as an officer then. I couldn't take the PC BS today.

You MUST follow the orders and directives of the superiors above you! Civilians don't understand but yes the army can regulate your actions 24/7. Hey they make you cut your hair, right? Is that fair? To a civvie well...no. But there is a legitimate reason to the short hair rule. This crap is globalism at it's worst. But, it's not worth a BCD (Bad Conduct Discharge) that will ruin your entire life! Get out and don't look back.

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Former Infantry Captain; 20 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

duckhunter

Getting a little defensive here, but not flaming anyone.

I just love how we are encouraging guys to get out of the Army (USN, USAF, USMC, USCG) because they don't agree with some of the regulations. Come on. If you really believed the recruiter when he told you it was going to be all milk and cookies in the military, you obviously didn't do a whole lot of research.

Contrary to popular belief, General Officers don't just sit around and think up ridiculous rules and regs - they are usually responding to a problem. Obviously there was a problem with this particular issue, but no-one has provided background on what it might be.

As I stated in a previous post, I don't agree with the reg. But bellyaching about having to follow the rules doesn't accomplish a whole lot. If the Army isn't for you, by all means get out. If you can't or won't follow the rules, I will help you get out.

Rant off.

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"Speed is fine, but accuracy is final." - Bill Jordan

Roadrunner

duckhunter, no offense taken. I had no problem serving my four years. I'll be damned if I do any more. Some people don't have a problem with all of the rules and regulations. I do. I gave them four years of my life and don't regret it, I encourage others to do the same. I likewise thinks it's idiotic to stay in if all of the BS is more than you can handle.

__________________
- Kurt
“Freedom is the sure possession of those alone who have the courage to defend it.” ~Pericles of Athens
Primary Carry - Colt Commander .45 in a Brommeland Max-Con V

duckhunter

I'm with you Roadrunner. I had a lot of guys in the same situation - tried my darndest to reup them, but they had done their job and wanted to move on to greener pastures. It is certainly a lifestyle decision as opposed to only a career decision.

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"Speed is fine, but accuracy is final." - Bill Jordan

czman2006

I'm a 20 year USN retiree, E-8, and while I agree there are some restrictions in any branch of the military, to tell a service member you can use a firearm to defend this country in Iraq (or elsewhere) but you can't defend yourself in the parking lot of the local WallyWorld is nonsense and should be challenged through the right channels. The military is definitely not for everyone but servicemembers still have the right to defend themselves and their loved ones, as do we all.

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"Let not your heart be troubled." John 14:1

USN Retired Vietnam/Desert Shield/Desert Storm

Airedale

Justin,
Let me give you some retired Sergeant Major advice.

Your sh*thouse lawyer buddy is an idiot. If the document you posted is legitimate, then do what it says.

If you must, visit your friendly JAG office and they will explain it's legality. I guarantee that it was staffed through the JAG and has been deemed appropriate.

The Commander isn't "bucking" for anything. At this point in his career, he has a pretty good idea whether he'll pin on a third star or not. Publishing a memorandum isn't going to get him promoted.

There is a reason for a restrictive action like this. Don't listen to the barracks experts. I can't begin to tell you how many troops I saw crash and burn following guidance from barracks lawyers.

If you violate this memorandum and get caught, tough luck.
Dave

frankmako

After 11 years as a Army Officer I can tell you one thing, follow the memo. Check with JAG for off base carry rules.

Bags

hmm.. this might not be a LEGAL order.... you don't have to follow illlegal orders.

There are 2 schools of thought.. define "around" and is there enough gray area for a lawyer to battle the case. I know this much, when fighting a general and the UCMJ, even if you win, you lose