Gun Law Q&A With Off Duty LEO - Page 3

puncho · October 23rd, 2009, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmdrdredd

I said every law, not simply "gun in the car". This is what you're asking, an officer to know every law. It's not possible. They are not lawyers.

What's the first concern of every patrol officer in a traffic stop? They should know every gun law that applies to a vehicle stop!

xXxplosive · October 23rd, 2009, 11:29 PM

I agree............LEO's are responsible for their actions as well as we are for ours. If they arrest you mistakenly, they should be made personally liable in my opinion / civil suit. I'm sorry doesn't cut it for me or mine.

Fatherof10 · October 23rd, 2009, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmdrdredd

I said every law, not simply "gun in the car". This is what you're asking, an officer to know every law. It's not possible. They are not lawyers.

Possible or not . . .
1. When they do not know it is legitimate to expect them to be aware of their weakness and research, ask for assistance, etc. (Legitimate expectation even though it may not be realistic.)
2. When one finds out that there is a deficit of knowledge (as in the conversation related in the op) it is appropriate to notify a supervisor so that training can be provided to correct the problem. I believe that no LEO or PD wants to make a bad arrest.

Excellence is something that is worth striving for.

JohnKelly · October 23rd, 2009, 11:42 PM

I don't expect LEO's to be well-versed in every law. I absolutely do expect them to be well-versed in the law(s) they are enforcing at that moment.

SpringerXD · October 23rd, 2009, 11:59 PM

Not to get off topic, but butterfly knives are perfectly legal in Tennessee as long as the blade is under 4.0 inches and it's not in a restricted area. BUT... I stopped carrying a balisong because so many LEO's are unclear on this and I don't need to get arrested.

This sounds like the OP's situation.

TX-JB · October 24th, 2009, 12:22 AM

I don't know how things work in Florida, but there aren't too many arrests made here where the DA on duty, isn't checked with to accept the charges, before the arrest.

cl00bie · October 24th, 2009, 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chad2000

Remember, with all the laws on the books it's unrealistic to expect LEO to know all of them.

I think we should start eliminating laws, and stop when all of the LEOs can remember all of them.

Mountaineer · October 24th, 2009, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MP45Man

Law Enforcement Officer: Logic dictates you can't enforce something you don't know. Maybe passionate is a strong term, but they should know what they are enforcing.

++ I couldn't agree more.

There was a case in Sparta MI where the officer said "I didn't know what law he was breaking, but I thought he was doing something wrong".

What's wrong with that picture!

Spec · October 24th, 2009, 01:37 AM

yes send an email to the chief with a copy of the gun laws, thats what i did (no i was not in jail)

BikerRN · October 24th, 2009, 03:12 AM

TX-JB has it right.

There is no way a LEO can be expected to know every law he or she may enforce. To think otherwise is just plain silly. Let them charge you and spend the night in jail, if after asking for a supervisor they don't produce one, or the supervisor agrees with the arresting LEO's.

The place to argue an arrest is not on the side of the road. That is why we have courtrooms. You may win in court, but I guarantee you will lose on the side of the road.

Nobody can be expected to know every law on the books. If an arrest is made "in good faith" I do not see why the LEO should be personally liable. Start doing that and you will not get a LEO to make any arrest. It's easier to look the other way when that starts happening, and rightly so as far as I'm concerned. I'm not going to stick my paycheck and retirement out there for you to take a bite out of if I believe I have just cause for what I'm doing. If I know I don't have just cause, and do it anyway, then you deserve my paycheck, retirement and more to boot.

Biker

October 23rd, 2009, 11:42 PM	#24
JohnKelly Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: USA Posts: 484	I don't expect LEO's to be well-versed in every law. I absolutely do expect them to be well-versed in the law(s) they are enforcing at that moment. __________________ "A prudent person foresees danger and takes precautions. The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences." - Proverbs 22:3

October 23rd, 2009, 11:59 PM	#25
SpringerXD Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Southeast Posts: 634	Not to get off topic, but butterfly knives are perfectly legal in Tennessee as long as the blade is under 4.0 inches and it's not in a restricted area. BUT... I stopped carrying a balisong because so many LEO's are unclear on this and I don't need to get arrested. This sounds like the OP's situation. __________________ "I practice the ancient art of Klik Pao." -miklcolt45

October 24th, 2009, 12:22 AM	#26
TX-JB VIP Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Sugar Land, TX Posts: 3,187	I don't know how things work in Florida, but there aren't too many arrests made here where the DA on duty, isn't checked with to accept the charges, before the arrest. __________________ *"We're in Texas....Things are different here."* *NRA Life Member*

October 24th, 2009, 01:37 AM	#29
Spec Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Metro Detroit Area Posts: 79	yes send an email to the chief with a copy of the gun laws, thats what i did (no i was not in jail) __________________ "A well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained in arms, is the best most natural defense of a free country." ~James Madison Land of the Free BECAUSE of the Brave. 911 Oper:Hello what is the problem? Homeowner: Send an Ambulance someone broke into my house..BANG!!

October 24th, 2009, 03:12 AM	#30
BikerRN VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: State of Discombobulation Posts: 3,778	TX-JB has it right. There is no way a LEO can be expected to know every law he or she may enforce. To think otherwise is just plain silly. Let them charge you and spend the night in jail, if after asking for a supervisor they don't produce one, or the supervisor agrees with the arresting LEO's. The place to argue an arrest is not on the side of the road. That is why we have courtrooms. You may win in court, but I guarantee you will lose on the side of the road. Nobody can be expected to know every law on the books. If an arrest is made "in good faith" I do not see why the LEO should be personally liable. Start doing that and you will not get a LEO to make any arrest. It's easier to look the other way when that starts happening, and rightly so as far as I'm concerned. I'm not going to stick my paycheck and retirement out there for you to take a bite out of if I believe I have just cause for what I'm doing. If I know I don't have just cause, and do it anyway, then you deserve my paycheck, retirement and more to boot. Biker __________________ If I knew I was going to get in to a gunfight I most ceratinly wouln't bring a handgun or two, and I don't know any smart person that does.

October 23rd, 2009, 11:29 PM	#22
xXxplosive Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: USA Posts: 122	I agree............LEO's are responsible for their actions as well as we are for ours. If they arrest you mistakenly, they should be made personally liable in my opinion / civil suit. I'm sorry doesn't cut it for me or mine.

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