Airborne Sniper

A guy with an AK type rifle, a good revolver, a good sheath knife and a hatchet can handle just about anything that pops up to threaten him. AK rifle is the way to go.

GBS

Wasn't the carbine standard issue in WWII?
True enough, newer rifles are more powerful,
but why do knowledgeable experts say it is
lacking for being a defensive weapon?
(Yep, I own one)...

DrSal

to gun bunny
That is one BEAUTIFUL weapon..

cphilip

1) it was
2) its a fine defensive and offensive weapon. Out to about 250 yards was its design criteria. Still packs quite a wallop out to 200+ yards. And pretty accurate too.

Its main advantage within that distance is its light weight. Much lighter than a AK. However I own both and like shooting both. And would not get rid of either. But the Carbine handles better and is more fun to shoot. And its certainly more than adequate defensive weapon. And darn reliable too.

In conclusion... get both!

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Miggy

I found this table: Rifle Ballistics Summary. At 200 yards the energy of a 7.62 x 39 is 882 ft lb and the .30 carbine is 373 ft lb

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cphilip

While I don't recommend either of them out to 200 yards for most things I have seen several charts showing the 7.62 X 39 at only 810 ft pounds at 100 yards so I cannot see how he came up with a higher number at 200 yards. Thats the way these chart things seem to go sometimes.

However the Carbine comes in at like 510 at 100 yards. I have always considered the Carbine to be a 100 to 150 yard gun in spite of its military design criteria. And I consider the classic AK round to be about a 200 round gun at most. Both of them have a certain usefulness in those areas but pale in comparison to the .308 that puts them both to shame. They both are more fun to shoot that is for certain. The Carbine being slightly more easy to handle but the AK certainly fun as well, just more kick. And both a lot easier to handle than the .308 which has double the energy of these two. However, that aside, there are many Deer taken within 100 yards with both of them. One shot clean kills. And even with the 5.45 X 39 as well. Good choices I think within reason. Knowing the limitations of each.

Lets see if I can post this one test (not sure it will stay formated right)...

.30 Carbine calc with 110 gr. bullet
(Calculated using Ingalls' table)
Bullet Weight ......... 110 grains Bullet Caliber ........ 0.308
Sectional Density ..... 0.166 Coefficient of Form ... 1.150
Effective Bal. Coeff... 0.144 Bal. Coeff. at STP .... 0.144
Cross wind ............ 10.0 m.p.h. Altitude .............. 0 Ft.
Atmospheric pressure .. 30.00 in. Temperature ........... 60.0 F

Range Velocity Energy Momentum Mx. Ord. Defl. Drop Lead Time
yards f.p.s. ft-lb. lb.-sec. in. in. in. in/mph sec.
0 1900 881.6 0.9280 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.000
10 1849 835.1 0.9032 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.3 0.016
20 1799 790.7 0.8789 0.1 0.2 0.2 0.6 0.032
30 1751 748.5 0.8551 0.1 0.3 0.5 0.9 0.049
40 1703 708.6 0.8320 0.2 0.6 0.8 1.2 0.067
50 1657 670.8 0.8095 0.3 1.0 1.3 1.5 0.085
60 1612 635.0 0.7876 0.5 1.4 1.9 1.8 0.103
70 1569 601.1 0.7663 0.7 2.0 2.7 2.1 0.122
80 1526 569.0 0.7456 1.0 2.6 3.6 2.5 0.141
90 1485 538.6 0.7254 1.3 3.3 4.6 2.8 0.161
100 1445 509.9 0.7058 1.6 4.2 5.8 3.2 0.182


7.62X39 calc using 125 gr FMJ bullet
(Calculated using Ingalls' table)
Bullet Weight ......... 125 grains Bullet Caliber ........ 0.308
Sectional Density ..... 0.188 Coefficient of Form ... 0.759
Effective Bal. Coeff... 0.248 Bal. Coeff. at STP .... 0.248
Cross wind ............ 10.0 m.p.h. Altitude .............. 0 Ft.
Atmospheric pressure .. 30.00 in. Temperature ........... 60.0 F

Range Velocity Energy Momentum Mx. Ord. Defl. Drop Lead Time
yards f.p.s. ft-lb. lb.-sec. in. in. in. in/mph sec.
0 2000 1110.1 1.1101 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.000
10 1969 1076.3 1.0930 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.3 0.015
20 1939 1043.3 1.0762 0.0 0.1 0.2 0.5 0.030
30 1909 1011.2 1.0595 0.1 0.2 0.4 0.8 0.046
40 1879 980.0 1.0430 0.2 0.3 0.7 1.1 0.062
50 1850 949.6 1.0267 0.3 0.5 1.1 1.4 0.078
60 1821 920.0 1.0106 0.4 0.8 1.7 1.7 0.094
70 1792 891.1 0.9946 0.6 1.0 2.3 2.0 0.111
80 1764 863.2 0.9789 0.8 1.4 3.0 2.2 0.128
90 1736 836.2 0.9634 1.0 1.8 3.9 2.6 0.145
100 1708 810.0 0.9482 1.3 2.2 4.8 2.9 0.162

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pgrass101

I've stuck with M1 carbine for the simple reason that my wife likes to shoot it so she will practice with it.

She thinks the recoil is to much on the AK.

My M1 carbine is our primary HD long gun. I'll trust it out to 150 yds anything beyond that is FAL terriorty for me.

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Noli nothis permittere te terere

I am waiting on my personal bailout!!!

cphilip

Oh ya... da FAL will reach out and touch someone...

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Creature

For 200> yrds, I am still sticking with my first choice -the M1 Carbine. Compared to the AK, the M1 just plain handles like a dream and it is much easier to pack and stow...not to mention it just looks a heck of a lot better. I have shot the M1 out to 300 yrds and those rounds got there accurately and in a real hurry! And even out that far, the Federal 110 grainers still packed enough energy to penetrate the side walls of a huge five foot tall tire from a Caterpillar front-end loader through and through. It really was enough to convince me that I wouldnt need more for most anything within 200 yards. I remember being quite amazed at that little round. To this day that round never ceases to surprize and please me.

Gun Bunny

Thanks, I like it also!!!

I sold this thing!? Don't ask why.

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