Terminal Ballistics Observations- .38 & 10mm

randytulsa2 · October 30th, 2006, 11:44 PM

I have had occasion to finish off immobilized deer a few times in my life. Until today I had always performed the chore with a .38. It always did the job.

I shot one with the muzzle loader this morning (spine shot at 40 yards) and he was still quite conscious when I walked up on him.

I packed my Witness 10mm with me this morning and that is what I used to deliver the coup de grace this time.

All I can say is "Wow."

Don't get me wrong. I don't want to get shot with a .38. Not one little bit. But I never want a 10mm even shot TOWARD me....

The .38 (110-gr. JHP- various brands) always penetrated one side of the skull and lodged in the animal's head. Perfectly effective for the intended purpose.

But that 10mm (175-grain Winchester Silvertip) penetrated both sides and took away a chunk of head with it.

Same distance (arm's length), approximately same size animal and similar points of impact.

I have found yet another use for my undervalued and under appreciated 10mm Witness. A darn fine gun.

P95Carry · October 30th, 2006, 11:58 PM

Randy - .38 and 10mm is IMO apples and oranges!

Your results are not surprising really, tho pretty impressive

artz · October 30th, 2006, 11:59 PM

Randy, sounds like you should be shootin' the other way 'round. The main huntin' gun is the 10mm, followed by the coup de grace with the .38.
I think you'll find that you won't need the .38, especially when used with a good handload. Everybody keeps talkin' about the 10, heck I'm startin' to miss mine.

dr_cmg · October 31st, 2006, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by artz

Everybody keeps talkin' about the 10, heck I'm startin' to miss mine.

Too bad.

It's staying in Alabama. I just ordered a new Eric Larsen holster for it.

artz · October 31st, 2006, 12:31 AM

I have made up my mind. If I buy another 10, it will be a glock 20.

dr_cmg · October 31st, 2006, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by artz

I have made up my mind. If I buy another 10, it will be a glock 20.

I can't believe that you said that Arthur. A Block, I mean Glock? Seriously, good weapon if it fits your hand. The few I have tried did not fit my hand. Other pistols with almost rectangular grips don't either so it's not Glock. The only double stack I have been able to fire well was the Bersa UC9. The grips are more rounded. The one thing the pistols in my sig line have in common is the single stack mag.

artz · October 31st, 2006, 01:11 AM

Thats about the only thing in a decent price range for a 10. I don't care for the Witness version, although shooting it might change my mind. Even the smiths' grip was just a smidgen too large for my taste.
Out in Cali, I was seriously talking to a guy about converting my GP100 to a 5 shot 10mm. Kinda wished I did now.
Whats a guy to do ?

dr_cmg · October 31st, 2006, 01:56 AM

I keep hoping to see SIG come out with a 10mm. That would be awesome. The SIG reliability with the 10mm round. That would be sweet.

srfl · October 31st, 2006, 03:26 PM

Agreed Randy...the EAA Witness 10mm are both an underrated gun and round. I (foolishly) traded mine off (full-sized blue steel framed version) for a HK USP. I "replaced" it with a Wonderfinished, steel framed Witness in .38 Super. A nice, equally underrated round, but not a 10mm.

Bud White · October 31st, 2006, 03:30 PM

Again its not that surprising the 10 is loaded decent though not to orginal specs and more it is more a apple to grapes comparsion

October 30th, 2006, 11:44 PM	#1
randytulsa2 Distinguished Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 1,468	Terminal Ballistics Observations- .38 & 10mm I have had occasion to finish off immobilized deer a few times in my life. Until today I had always performed the chore with a .38. It always did the job. I shot one with the muzzle loader this morning (spine shot at 40 yards) and he was still quite conscious when I walked up on him. I packed my Witness 10mm with me this morning and that is what I used to deliver the coup de grace this time. All I can say is "Wow." Don't get me wrong. I don't want to get shot with a .38. Not one little bit. But I never want a 10mm even shot TOWARD me.... The .38 (110-gr. JHP- various brands) always penetrated one side of the skull and lodged in the animal's head. Perfectly effective for the intended purpose. But that 10mm (175-grain Winchester Silvertip) penetrated both sides and took away a chunk of head with it. Same distance (arm's length), approximately same size animal and similar points of impact. I have found yet another use for my undervalued and under appreciated 10mm Witness. A darn fine gun.

October 30th, 2006, 11:58 PM	#2
P95Carry Assistant Administrator Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: South West PA Posts: 25,407	Randy - .38 and 10mm is IMO apples and oranges! Your results are not surprising really, tho pretty impressive __________________ Chris - P95 NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member. "To own a gun and assume that you are armed is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!." If a BG dies as the result of pointing a gun at me, then he has merely succumbed to an occupational hazard of being a thug

October 30th, 2006, 11:59 PM	#3
artz VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Georgia Posts: 2,260	Randy, sounds like you should be shootin' the other way 'round. The main huntin' gun is the 10mm, followed by the coup de grace with the .38. I think you'll find that you won't need the .38, especially when used with a good handload. Everybody keeps talkin' about the 10, heck I'm startin' to miss mine. __________________ Lord, grant me the serenity for things that I can not change. Just call me a pessimistic optimist !

October 31st, 2006, 12:31 AM	#5
artz VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Georgia Posts: 2,260	I have made up my mind. If I buy another 10, it will be a glock 20. __________________ Lord, grant me the serenity for things that I can not change. Just call me a pessimistic optimist !

October 31st, 2006, 01:11 AM	#7
artz VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Georgia Posts: 2,260	Thats about the only thing in a decent price range for a 10. I don't care for the Witness version, although shooting it might change my mind. Even the smiths' grip was just a smidgen too large for my taste. Out in Cali, I was seriously talking to a guy about converting my GP100 to a 5 shot 10mm. Kinda wished I did now. Whats a guy to do ? __________________ Lord, grant me the serenity for things that I can not change. Just call me a pessimistic optimist !

October 31st, 2006, 01:56 AM	#8
dr_cmg Lead Moderator Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Alabama Posts: 7,897	I keep hoping to see SIG come out with a 10mm. That would be awesome. The SIG reliability with the 10mm round. That would be sweet. __________________ George Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein

October 31st, 2006, 03:26 PM	#9
srfl Senior Moderator Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: FL Posts: 6,662	Agreed Randy...the EAA Witness 10mm are both an underrated gun and round. I (foolishly) traded mine off (full-sized blue steel framed version) for a HK USP. I "replaced" it with a Wonderfinished, steel framed Witness in .38 Super. A nice, equally underrated round, but not a 10mm. __________________ USAF: Loving Our Obscene Amenities Since 1947

October 31st, 2006, 03:30 PM	#10
Bud White VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Elsewhere Posts: 17,476	Again its not that surprising the 10 is loaded decent though not to orginal specs and more it is more a apple to grapes comparsion

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