Open Carry - What do you think? - Page 6

500Mag · June 19th, 2008, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tankdriver

I do not want a BG walking up to me to rob me, see I'm armed and know he will have to kill me before I have a chance to do anything to him. I want the fact I'm armed come as a complete suprise to him when I pull it.

While nothing is 100% avoidable/preventable proper situational awareness should eliminate this fear.

TacticalCompact · June 19th, 2008, 03:15 PM

I personally believe that a gun openly displayed would probably circumvent most occassions where you could use the "element of surprise" to your advantage. The theme of many threads here at DC.com involves restraint, and avoiding any place, situation, or confrontation that may force you to draw your weapon. If carrying openly would deter a criminal from selecting you as a victim, wouldn't that then solve all the other issues related to avoidance?

I thought I'd add some reference from another thread that I though was helpful to this discussion. It involves fanny packs. Fanny packs, for all intents and purposes, can be considered almost open carry. Read:

http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulle...aming-gun.html

Quote:

I asked them each why they thought I was carrying a gun, and each said ..... man carrying a fanny pack in Texas? It has to be a gun. I went into my alter ego that I use frequently during work hours and we fast talked while they worked about the "training" they received in prison, and due to the high volume of concealed carry permits in Texas, a subject they discussed frequently was how to spot weapons on people to avoid them as the risk is to high. (NOTE: The all three said the second most identifiable sign is a photographer vest...something even professional photographers in Texas don't wear).

Then again, maybe we should all wear fanny-packs and photographer's vests, while keeping our guns IWB @ 4:00 or in a smart-carry hahaha.

FN1910 · June 19th, 2008, 03:24 PM

I am not against OC but when I venture over to OCDO this picture comes to mind with the OC logs and plans to OC at a certain store this week end. Maybe if so many didn't talk about it like it was a winning something each time they walked out the door.

deadeye72 · June 19th, 2008, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FN1910

I am not against OC but when I venture over to OCDO this picture comes to mind with the OC logs and plans to OC at a certain store this week end. Maybe if so many didn't talk about it like it was a winning something each time they walked out the door.

O.K. That picture is funny, I don't care who you are.

BAC · June 19th, 2008, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TacticalCompact

Then again, maybe we should all wear fanny-packs and photographer's vests, while keeping our guns IWB @ 4:00 or in a smart-carry hahaha.

Word!

-B

CR2008 · June 19th, 2008, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveH

No disagreement here on the target #1disadvantage in a hostile situation.

I'd add that sometimes the sight of a OC (think Virginia's required OC in places with ABC on-premise, here) can create a hostile response.

OTOH -- I personally have been two situations (and know others in the OC community who report more) where perceived potential threats altered their body language and movement upon seeing that I was armed.

Was I in real danger? No way to prove it. However, when two rather unpleasant looking young men pass you on the other side of a street (eyeballing you), cross the street, come back toward you, at twenty some feet they split so as to pass on both the street & building sides of you, and one is reached under his shirt -- what do you think? Then when you do the VA Tuck and place you hand on the grip, the one w/o his hand inside his shirt says something to the other, they both turn around and walk away, what do you think? Yes, this was a CC converted to an OC. However, were VA not a OC State, it would have been illegal.

The other was OC all the way and less dramatic.

I know several people have have done this in Georgia, where OC is legal... they CC most of the time but when they are around some lonely looking place, especially if they perceived a BG eying them they move to OC.

I think this is a good strategy where ever it is legal to OC and CC... if I were in a lonely parking lot real late at night coming from Kroger super market or some place, I would rather be OCing but I would never concider OCing 24/7.

JD · June 19th, 2008, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BAC

Word!

-B

Oh great, not this again...

CR2008 · June 19th, 2008, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD

I am in total agreement that the sight of a gun may deter crime, but it is still an unknown. But how many times have you heard about a gun on someone's hip deterring a crime? As I have not heard about it on the news or a forum somewhere, does that mean it really hasn't happened?

...all I was saying is that neither can be PROVEN and there's no sense in arguing over it. It's just like the which is better, Coke or Pepsi, it's all opinion, very little fact.

Psychologically, criminals target people who pose less of a threat, as well as those who are oblivious, they do not randomly pick targets... disabled people, the elderly, women etc fit this category on the most part. And most criminals fear the armed citizen even more than law enforcement, that is a statistical fact that is EASY to look up. If some loiterer were look out for who makes a suitable target, a person with a gun on their hip is just about the last person they want to mess with, why not the lady busy loading groceries into the mini van some lanes down? She will pose less of a threat, and she won't even know what hit her to begin with.

JD · June 19th, 2008, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CR2008

Psychologically, criminals target people who pose less of a threat, as well as those who are oblivious, they do not randomly pick targets... disabled people, the elderly, women etc fit this category on the most part. And most criminals fear the armed citizen even more than law enforcement, that is a statistical fact that is EASY to look up. If some loiterer were look out for who makes a suitable target, a person with a gun on their hip is just about the last person they want to mess with.

Right, as stated earlier I agree.

But what about criminals that aren't in their right mind, take your methheads, crackheads, and probably the worse case scenario, the suicide shooter.

If the last one sees you first, he's probably going to definitely shoot you first, he's there with the gun, no turning back....

My only point in going against the above stated is that to dismiss the possibility of being targeted due to it being unlikely, is that we all ready planning on what to do if we find ourselves in an unlikely circumstance.

We carry a gun so that in the unlikely event that we need it, we have it.

We carry spare magazines in the unlikely event that we need more than one.

We carry spare guns in the unlikely event that we need more than one.

We carry knives in the unlikely event that we need to use it to fend off an attacker.

We do all these things because there is a possibility that we may need them no matter how unlikely the circumstance.

So while I totally understand that the presence of a gun can deter crime, I'm not going to pretend it's a force field that will keep unlikely circumstances from occuring, I am a firm believer in Muprhy's Law...

If it can go wrong, it will.

No matter how unlikely.

CR2008 · June 19th, 2008, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD

So while I totally understand that the presence of a gun can deter crime, I'm not going to pretend it's a force field that will keep unlikely circumstances from occuring, I am a firm believer in Muprhy's Law...

If it can go wrong, it will.

No matter how unlikely.

Armed guards OCing is another example. Where I live, even the small local fast food joints have armed security inside them who OCs, the bank has it, and so do other places (not shocked, DeKalb has an increasing crime rate, and being robbed is not good for business)... any one wanting to commit an armed robbery is certainly most likely to go for places with no armed security guards.

Though being armed is no magic bullet prof vest, and I can understand what you said about a crazy maniac shooting the armed guard, armed citizen who is OCing etc first but I don't even see this as likely if it were to happen, if a crazed maniac were to shoot any body first it most likely will be the one who is closest to his field of view. And people who OC have a responsibility to have a high awareness of other people around them, they typically position themselves in such a way that people won't be so close as to grab their weapon, most of them are not the type to want to stand next to people.

The only reason I don't OC is due to the

calling police due to their ignorance, and many LEOs are intollerant of legally armed citizens in DeKalb so the only way I would personally OC is if I had to go some where real late at night and I suspected a loiterer targeting me across the way... all I would have to do is to move or unbutton my shirt to make the IWB holstered gun OC (and I wear an undershirt to keep reduce sweet getting on my gun.)

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